Wellesley College: is it worth it?

Parents Forum
1

<p>I am hoping for feedback from students and parents, alike. Our daughter was admitted off of the wait list at Wellesley two weeks ago. She had accepted an appointment to the United States Air Force Academy....yes, a full ride worth $414,000. We were hearing she had some anxiety about this, but we then came to learn that this is normal. However, this week, she made her decision and she is going to Wellesley (at least at this point). Wellesley did not give us much of a deal....like $11,700 per year off of $240,000 education. Our daughter is going to have to take loans out for $30,000 of this, as well.</p>

<p>As a parent, I am having a hard time believing that this school is worth it. I am not convinced that doors open...it just sounds like a very expensive liberal arts education. We are from the midwest and conservative and the school is liberal. I would appreciate any and all feedback from parents and graduates of this school...recent ones and if this education is worth it.</p>

2

<p>What’s going to convince you it’s worth it? </p>

<p>There’s obviously quite a difference between debt free and $200K of debt… And there’s really no doors Wellesley is going to open that the USAFA won’t open as well.</p>

<p>It’s going to come down to what makes her happy… There’s no quantitative measure that makes it worth it, so there’s really no answer to your question. </p>

<p>Wellesley’s a fine school, as good as you can get, some would say, but there’s still no quantitative measure by which you can justify choosing it over the USAFA. </p>

<p>Also, what does liberal and conservative have to do with “worth it” ahah?</p>

3

<p>If your daughter does not want to be in the military after college…this could be the issue. Going to a military academy is a huge commitment. What is giving your daughter cold feet about this? Maybe that is the question you need to find the answer to.</p>

<p>And for the record…the $30,000 per year in loans will have to be cosigned by you.</p>

<p>Both schools are terrific, but in very different ways.</p>

4

<p>This totally depends on the child. For one of mine it would absolutely not be worth it. He would thrive at the Academy and be totally suited. For the second, it would definitely be worth it. He would hate the Academy and the idea of military service would just not fit. Of course, he wouldn’t have applied but yours did. Only you and your child can answer this.</p>

5

<p>I think the big issue is why your daughter is questioning the USAFA now. </p>

<p>Only one of my son’s friends went to an academy, naval. He was interested in this from middle school onwards. He graduated and is still in the military. at his wedding, my son really enjoyed his military friends.</p>

<p>Is there a way that the Wellesley acceptance could be postponed until January? If your daughter is unsure if she will fit into the academy life, this would give her a chance to try it for a few months. </p>

<p>If her anxiety about joing the academy are deeper, then she is looking for an alternative. She must be bright to be accepted into 2 such fine places, which suggests she could also have gotten into colleges which offered merit money. </p>

<p>In terms of Wellesley College, I can only say positive things. For a few years after grad school, I worked there. Faculty was amazing, kids were bright and personable. The grounds are gorgeous. The town is mid to upper middle class. Ihave no recent experience about how liberal the school is.</p>

<p>After UG, my son was headed for first job. He did not seem excited, even though the job paid extremely well and was in a great city. He had all summer to share his concerns but just kept moving forward (finding apt, furnishing it, etc). If only he would have been open about his worries about the job, he could have saved himself some terrible times.</p>

<p>So please, do everything you can to understand what your daughter is feeling. If Wellesley is her only option at this point, let her go. She can transfer to a less expensive college later on.</p>

6

<p>Yes, Wellesley provides a very expensive (and very good) liberal arts education. It has such departments as astronomy, biological sciences, chemistry, computer science, mathematics, physics and so on. Compared with the US Air Force Academy, which has such departments as political science, english and fine arts, history, philosophy and so on. The US Air Force Academy does have a variety of engineering departments which Wellesley doesn’t have. If your D is interested in engineering, becoming a pilot or astronaut I can see the advantage to going to the USAFA. Other than that, I’m not sure what is so bad about the liberal arts.</p>

7

<p>This is a tough one, I feel for you. The thing is, if she is really questioning the Air Force Academy, I agree with another poster that there is where the real issue is. </p>

<p>I’m sure if she is bright enough to be accepted to both schools she understands the amazing education she will receive (at either school) and also understands the money aspect, including her own ownership in the loans (and your sacrifice). Remember that even if she goes to the Air Force Academy, if she drops out at any point, you’ll be on the hook to reimburse them for her years there anyway, so maybe this wasn’t the route that was meant to be for her. (and ditto another poster - if she finishes up, she is committed to the service, which is scary if she isn’t sure).</p>

<p>Wellesley’s a great school. Your D will have a large selection and variety of coursework to choose from, and will come out of there a strong, confident, amazing young woman. I am a proponent of a liberal arts education (and a bit sad that my own D is so focused on the sciences at another LAC that she isn’t taking enough true liberal arts courses - take a Shakespeare class, honey!!). I do agree with dadx3 that only if your D knows she wants to be an engineer or a pilot would the Air Force Academy make a lot more sense.</p>

<p>I also wouldn’t worry one bit about the liberal-conservative thing. I can never quite get why people want to send their kids to colleges that don’t expose them to a variety of people, especially those with differing viewpoints. Just like the real world! MOST colleges are pretty liberal (excepting the service academies, of course). You have already raised your (apparently exceptional) daughter with all kinds of moral beliefs and values and an understanding of why you, as her parents, see the world the way you do. She is extremely unlikely to be influenced in a negative way by being exposed to the other side of the coin. It will open her eyes for sure, but she will process it and grow as a person by adjusting to those with other, even radical (in your eyes), ideals. And even the most liberal campus usually has a young republican club (couldn’t believe there was one at Smith where my D is)! :)</p>

8

<p>I say this with kindness and respect, because you’ve asked for opinions. This sounds like a bright kid with a good record who would be sought-after by a lot of colleges, and a family that’s caring and willing to help – and yet there are two options on the table, late in the game, and neither one is really what she needs. She may need a gap year.</p>

<p>I had many friends go through the Academies, particularly West Point, and it was my understanding that if you aren’t positive that you want a military life for at least 9 years, plus reserve obligations, and if you aren’t willing to be killed for your country as a volunteer, don’t do it. Clearly she doesn’t feel that way, or you would not have started this thread. The Academies are not just colleges. Women are facing additional difficulties in the military, which are becoming more widely known these days, and the Academy level is not exempt. I know there used to be some option to quit and transfer out, early in the game, but I think that also entailed certain enlisted duties, at least at some point, to pay the government back for the partial education. You would need to confirm what her rights and duties would be if she started at USAFA and hated it.</p>

<p>Wellesley, in my opinion, you just can’t afford. I wouldn’t be able to afford it either. People have their own individual tolerances for debt, but since you’ve asked for input, I think that’s far too much debt for undergrad. Particularly when the kid is a desirable applicant who could get much better deals elsewhere.</p>

<p>Any kid who can get into USAFA is a viable merit aid applicant at many schools. But if she starts at one school and transfers out, her merit aid options are generally understood to be very limited as a transfer applicant. I am not an expert on that. Other threads and people could shed light on that. But the accepted notion is that you get your best shot at merit aid when you are fresh out of HS or a gap year, and have not yet enrolled in any college. That’s when you are of the most usefulness to the college, in terms of enhancing their incoming freshman stats. Taking even one course during a gap year will turn you into a transfer applicant. </p>

<p>I think your daughter needs a gap year, in which to do some more soul-searching about what she really wants out of college, and to develop a more realistic college budget, in consultation with her parents. She can hopefully secure a nice merit aid award from a school that will meet her needs, without decades of financial regret.</p>

9

<p>Unfortunately, my experience isn’t recent (I graduated from Wellesley in 1988), but I did want to reassure you on at least a couple of fronts. </p>

<p>First, the education at Wellesley is top notch. The professors are deeply caring, intelligent, and interesting. The students are fantastic, confident, hard working, and often brilliant, women . . .and the whole venue is inspirational. The network is very strong. </p>

<p>Second, when I attended Wellesley, it was liberal. Most colleges are liberal. I was not liberal. I’m not liberal now. Some of the best moments I had at college was in depth discussions of politics with my liberal friends. I actually learned from those discussions. My views rarely shifted, but I actually ended up learning more about both sides of many issues - - all of which to were my benefit. Ironically, some of my MOST liberal friends are now more conservative than I am. I really would not worry on this front. The atmosphere will be stimulating, but it is respectful. I was an economics major, and both liberal and conservative elements were taught without any particular bias (unlike at my conservative business school lol).</p>

<p>Another element I really liked about Wellesley is being in the social venue of Boston. There were lots of opportunities to meet very bright men and women from other colleges . . .it’s a mecca of young intelligent, driven young people.</p>

<p>I’m sorry I don’t have more current information to share with you. With one child going off to college for me next year - - to a very expensive liberal arts college - - I do sympathize with the whole “is this worth it?” argument. My son had opportunities to attend MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE colleges than the one he will be attending. Will that be a good choice? It remains to be seen. But I can assure you that Wellesley is a fantastic starting off point . . .</p>

10

<p>“I think the big issue is why your daughter is questioning the USAFA now.”</p>

<p>I think sometimes when something is about to become a reality, you can suddenly realize your real feelings about it. Especially when you are young. I think sometimes the idea of something sounds just so great and you are proud you can achieve something so fantastic. And after you’ve shared your achievement with your friends and family and reveled in the fact that you’ve met your goal . . .you ultimately are left alone with your decision. And sometimes, that’s when the doubt and concern have room to creep in.</p>

11

<p>Clarification to #9 – I interpreted the OP’s post to mean that the student and family will borrow $30,000 a year, for a total of at least $120,000 undergrad. If the OP meant that the debt load would be a total of $30,000 for the whole degree, it’s a much more modest number. But nevertheless, this student could probably drive a better bargain elsewhere, and $30,000 is still too much debt in some situations.</p>

12

<p>What was her mindset when she applied to USAFA? It’s such a long process. She must have put a lot of thought in it before/while applying. Can she say what has changed for her? Had she been interested in the military for awhile or was it somewhat of a new idea…“see if I can get in” sort of thing ?
It’s a once in a lifetime opportunity.
Is she certain there will be “no regrets” if she gives this up without trying? </p>

<p>If she had not been accepted off the Wellsley waitlist, would she still turn down Air Force? What would her next option be? Did she have more affordable acceptances?
Does she realize how much debt she will have (as in how many $$$/month she’ll have to pay) upon graduation fr. Wellsley
Would she be interested in AFROTC at a civilian college? </p>

<p>My S is a Naval Officer (NROTC not Naval Academy). It is a big commitment but there are also great rewards . </p>

<p>Good Luck to your D.</p>

13

<p>While Wellesley is on the liberal side of the political spectrum from what I’ve seen and heard, it has plenty of conservative students considering I knew quite a few of them at previous jobs. Wellesley provides an impressively top notch education for students who are willing to take full advantage of it. Moreover, they also have an academic exchange program with MIT so students who desire a more STEM-centered environment can take advantage of it like a HS classmate who took most of her CS major classes there. </p>

<p>Moreover, Wellesley is certainly no bastion of radical lefty progressive politics as my own LAC(Oberlin College) was in the mid-late '90s…though I heard from younger alums that it has been toned down considerably since I graduated. </p>

<p>Others have covered points on how a FSA education isn’t really free as one will owe a minimum of an 8 year commitment to the military(5 active, 3 reserve) upon graduation and if one bails after year 2, will need to pay the Federal government back in cash or enlisted service. On the last point…it’s COMPLETELY AT THE DISCRETION OF THE military services/academy/relevant Federal government agencies. </p>

<p>As one FSA graduate I was acquainted with put it somewhat scatologically, an FSA grad will pay it back with every nickel he/she passes out of his/her stool. </p>

<p>The FSA is great if one is 100% committed not only to a military career of at least 8+ years, but also committed to a 24/7 military lifestyle from the moment one reports to the FSA for the first day of summer training like Beast Barracks at West Point. While I heard from many FSA grads that in retrospect, the summer training was mild in comparison with later trainings at the FSA/active duty, summer training was enough to get several folks I knew to drop out within the first few days/week of it…before the first year even started. </p>

<p>One will also have to manage maintaining grades with a heavier than average academic load while being subjected to early morning wakeups, constant military exercises/training, keeping one’s room/living spaces in immaculate condition, being yelled at/ordered around by upperclassmen, and having one’s every waking moment subject to a degree of micromanagement that is more like living at home with micromanaging parents or more restrictive boarding schools in middle/high school than at most colleges/universities. In short, one really has to be 100% committed to that lifestyle/career path for at least 8+ years after graduation and sustain it consistently to see it through. </p>

<p>Had one cousin who left an FSA sometime in the '80s after a year. He grew fed up with the micromanagement, deciding the military wasn’t for him, and found the STEM department to not fulfill his advanced academic needs. Ended up transferring and finishing up in top academic standing at an HYPSMCC university.</p>

14

<p>Wellesley is ranked 16 per Forbes. It is ranked higher than Penn, Brown, Dartmouth, and Duke! </p>

<p>[America’s</a> Top Colleges List - Forbes](<a href=“http://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/list/]America’s”>Forbes America’s Top Colleges List 2022)</p>

<p>Did you know the price tag before your D applied? If she only gets $11K/yr from Wellesley, her EFC must be pretty high. What if she were not accepted into AFA? But, if you can’t come up with $150K for her alone, it is not a good idea for her to go to Wellesley. Does she still have a 3rd choice?</p>

15

<p>I agree with the others, unless your D is sure about going to a military academy, she should not. Might this be your dream and not hers? It sounds like she wants to get away from the midwest conservative culture. Personally, I feel that 30K in loans is worth it for a Wellsley education, unless that is a per year cost which is unaffordable.</p>

16

<p>If she doesn’t want to go to a service academy and you can’t afford to send her to Wellesley, then she should take a gap year and reapply to schools that you <em>can</em> afford. </p>

<p>I gather that you can’t meet your EFC at Wellesley, which has good FA. This may mean an in-state option, or a less competitive school that would offer someone with your D’s stats an automatic and really large merit scholarship.</p>

<p>Before making this decision, though, I would look hard at what the cost to you would be IF she gets such an award, then consider whether the incremental cost of Wellesley is worth it to you or her. </p>

<p>Rereading your initial post, I thought you were suggesting that the loans would be $40K per year. If it is $30K over four years, I’d say that is more manageable, especially if she can reduce it by work study, summer jobs, etc.</p>

<p>I wouldn’t worry about the political climate. Wellesley has students with a broad range of opinions. It turns out an enormous number of students who are highly successful in the professions and corporate careers. Your daughter may develop opinions that differ from yours eventually, but W is not going to turn her into a raging left or right wing radical. Take a look at the alumni magazine some time. :)</p>

17

<p>When you ask if it’s “worth” it, the answer is “yes” (resoundingly, yes!) if what you’re referring to is the quality of the education she’ll receive - it will be extraordinary.</p>

<p>But if what you really mean is, “will it get her a job?” . . . then I don’t have an answer for you. A Wellesley education isn’t a golden ticket to a high-paying job. If that’s all you’re concerned about, then send her down the road to McDonald’s - it won’t pay much, but she’d have job security.</p>

<p>It sounds like your daughter is still trying to figure out what she wants to do with her life. Wellesley would help her do that. It’s an amazing school, and your daughter is lucky to have this opportunity . . . but if you don’t want to pay for it, then don’t.</p>

18

<p>Call the financial aid office before you make any final decisions. Wellesley has a very responsive financial aid office, and they may be able to help you decrease the cost burden.</p>

<p>Otherwise, I think you’ve gotten some great advice. My d is attending Wellesley in the fall - it is just about the most conservative LAC she applied to (although you and she may have different views on that). :-)</p>

19

<p>My D loves Wellesley. She’s pretty middle of the road. There is an outspoken super liberal component there, but so what? There will be a similar cohort at any elite school.</p>

20

<p>OP, I think that if you have very deep misgivings about taking out debt to pay for a liberal arts college, you should not do so. Your D obviously is very bright and could get merit aid at many fine schools. I agree with Fieldsports and Consolation that a gap year might be a good idea if you cannot afford Wellesley. There is no college worth placing one’s family finances in jeopardy.</p>

<p>Wellesley is a wonderful place and I believe it is worth some prudent amount of debt (what that means will vary family by family). Do not worry too much about the liberal/conservative thing. My D had an economics professor who shocked some of his students with his opposition to raising taxes. Fiscal conservatism is alive and well at Wellesley. My D is a member of the Wellesley College Republicans and has never had a problem with her friends, many of whom are much more liberal than she is. However, if a student does not respect LGBTQ concerns, Wellesley is not a good fit. One thing you don’t have to worry about at Wellesley is the weekly bacchanal where students have to navigate puddles of vomit in the bathroom. I don’t know whether that’s “conservative” or not, but it’s something my D values about Wellesley’s environment. If you want to party you can, but it doesn’t have to impinge on your life if you don’t want it.</p>

<p>To me, the larger issue is whether your D ought to go to the Air Force Academy if she is ambivalent about it. Given the commitment and potential sacrifice demanded of cadets, she ought to be all in. It sounds like she’s not, whether or not she ends up at Wellesley or another good college.</p>