west point verse civilian school

Colleges and Universities A-Z Military Academy - West Point
1

<p>the ultimate question. aside from the typical west point applicant, whose number 1 desire is to attend west point and ultimately serve in the army, there are those few who have applied, and been offered appointments but are unsure of whether they really want to dedicate the next part of their lives to the military.</p>

<p>i am one of these. i have been offered an appointment, but right now i am deciding between west point and boston college. is there anybody else here who has gone through the struggle of having to choose between a civ school and usma? i have nothing but respect for everyone who attends and graduates from usma, and while for some time now i have wanted to achieve that same goal, i am now unsure if i want to be int he army, or "normal."</p>

<p>is the very fact that i'm unsure of whether i want to attend USMA or not, enough to reason that maybe West Point is not for me and that I should be goingto BC? i want to be able to have the west point experience, to have something different and valuable, but at the same time.....well, you get the point.</p>

2

<p>maybe what you are looking for is an ROTC option. this is much like that of West Point in that you become an officer and learn the military way, but you also get to have your "normal" life at college.</p>

3

<p>Hi There-</p>

<p>Congratulations on your fantastic post high school options! WOW! Way to go! Both WP and BC will offer you incredible educational experiences. But yet, different atmospheres as you noted. You are asking yourself all the right questions in order for you to make this decision Pyoo323. As you know, no one can make it for you, you have to own it in your heart. You will be the only one going through the next 4 years, so it's truly all about you. I truly admire your desire to serve our country.</p>

<p>Have you looked into AROTC at BC as another option? Here's a link, I did a little digging. </p>

<p><a href="http://www.bc.edu/clubs/rotc/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.bc.edu/clubs/rotc/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>I wish you peace during this decision-making process pyoo323.</p>

4

<p>pyoo323: Am I correct in reading that unlike most candidates who are deciding between the Academy or ROTC option (ie their goal is to serve as an army officer), you are deciding between the Academy or civilian option (ie you are unsure about the military commitment after college?)</p>

<p>The USMA mission is:
"To educate, train, and inspire the Corps of Cadets so that each graduate is a commissioned leader of character committed to the values of Duty, Honor, Country and prepared for a career of professional excellence and service to the Nation as an officer in the United States Army."</p>

<p>Candidates have a wide array of reasons for attending WP - whatever your reason is, it needs to be strong enough to motivate you to keep going through the tough times (and there will be tough times). In addition you need to have a willingness (if not a strong desire) to serve as an officer in the army. All candidates need to understand that they are signing up for selfless service during a time of war. Having said that, I think it is normal for candidates to second guess themselves on some level. I suspect you are not alone in your decision, but it is a decison that only the individual can answer. Only you can decide if the WP experience and the commitment it brings is something you want to pursue. </p>

<p>As others have said, you have 2 good options - Congratulations. Good luck with your decision.</p>

5

<p>You don't mention whether or not you've visited West Point. If you're on the fence it's a very good idea to visit the campus for an overnight visit with the cadets. They will tell you everything you need to know, take you around to their classes and workouts, and tell you horror stories in the evening. You will assemble for meals with them, eat with them in Washington Hall, and spend the evening with them in their dorms. I suspect within those 24 hours or so you will have the answer you're looking for. It's well worth the effort to check out what might prove to be one of the best opportunities of your life. Good luck.</p>

6

<p>haha. I spent many, many sleepless nights deciding between UC Berkeley and West Point. I'll tell you why I made the choice I made when I get back online later tonight.</p>

7

<p>ANN:</p>

<p>You pretty much nailed it. I have already looked into various ROTC options, and have realized that my decision will ultimately be based upon whether or not i actually want to be in the military, or be a civilian.</p>

<p>thanks to those who mentioned rotc, it is good advice to those who know for sure they want to be military leaders, but for me, right now the debate is WHETHER OR NOT i DO want to be a leader--so i wonder if anybody had to decide between civilian/military like me...</p>

<p>WPSON--i have visited the campus, the one where i follow a cadet around for a day....so i did get a definite feel of what it would be like--lining up for lunches, going to class, etc. etc.</p>

<p>Qwertz--i look forward to hearing what path you chose, why, and how you feel about it now...</p>

8

<p>Well one thing for sure, you can't approach it half way. Those who try end up disappointed; very disappointed.</p>

9

<p>Honestly, if you are unsure this far into the process, I take that as a red flag. Life at a service academy is challenging, no question there, but the real question is do you want to be an officer? WP will prepare you to be a leader and give you a great education. After you graduate is where WP becomes more than a tough school. </p>

<p>Perhaps the best question for you is not whether WP is better, but whether the military is better for you.</p>

<p>Ask yourself why you would want to be an officer and why you would want to be a civilian. Which answers are better to you?</p>

10

<p>Ok, I've been waiting to get this off my shoulders for a long time. Having to decide what's going to happen for the next nine years of your life can make you go crazy.</p>

<p>Before you read this, I'll have to warn you guys: I know that some of the stuff I'm about to write might offend those of you going to West Point (mostly the pro-military types), so I'd like to let you all know beforehand that I am fully aware of the responsibilities and consequences of my choice, and that I am fully committed to all the responsibilities that entail my decision. Also, I'm going to give a no-bull***** opinion about my decision to attend West Point, so don't expect me to sh** out the "West Point is right for me" propaganda. I'm open to advice and criticism, but don't flame me unless you've got something relevant to say.</p>

<p>I want to start with some background leading up to why I chose West Point. I grew up in Southern California, my parents were first generation immigrants, and none of my relatives and nobody I knew ever joined the military (in the US, anyways). I was raised in a culture where the common opinion on people who joined the military was that they were: a) kids who needed money to go to college, or b) rednecks (or something similar to that stereotype). (I don't believe that anymore.) Anyways, sophomore year in high school, I decided to apply to West Point. Why? Well, how many guys in high school didn't want to go to the most kick-ass military academy in the world, shoot guns, and blow **** up? I applied just for the hell of it, never expecting to actually attend the academy. Junior year comes, I also applied for the SLS program just cause it'd be cool to check out the academy for a week. Got accepted, figured I'd go, do some military stuff, and come home with a bunch of stories to tell. I actually enjoyed SLS and the people there, which was nice. One week at the academy was fun, but I didn't know whether I could stand four years of it. I continued on with my application, writing letters to senators and stuff. Looking back, I truly don't know why I continued with all those applications. I guess I did it so I could have something different and exciting to look forward to.</p>

<p>Now back to the present. I also applied to a few UC's and some other private schools. I got rejected from a private institute of technology which shall remain unnamed. This institute also happened to be the one place I worked four years of my life to get into. I eventually got accepted to Cal and West Point, the two colleges I had to choose between.</p>

<p>I forgot to mention something. Up until I got my acceptance from West Point, I figured that I would go to some UC, screw around for four years, get some tech job, and live happily ever after. I sounded like a very good plan. As a matter of fact, it * is * a very good plan. A plan I worked four years of my life to accomplish. So why did I choose West Point?</p>

<p>The day I received the acceptance, it hit me: I had a chance, the chance, to attend the United States Military Academy. The most kick-ass military academy in the world. But then I'd be giving up literally everything I've worked for in high school. Nine years is a long time. I believe in serving my country, but nine years is a big chunk of my life. West Point would turn me into a leader. The name itself would open doors for future employment. It also meant that I would have to leave everything I've ever known. West Point meant literally no free time and a three week summer break. But at West Point, I'd be able to shoot guns, drive tanks and jump out of airplanes; stuff most people can only dream about. But while I did that, my friends would be out partying, getting drunk or getting laid, then going home and sending me letters about how much fun they had without me. I spent days of my life trying to decide between the two. I made mental tallies of the pros and cons of every little aspect of each college, yet I'd never be able to come to a definitive conclusion. Some days, I'd be set about going to the academy, other days, I figured I'd screw West Point and take the easy way out.</p>

<p>A few weeks ago, I bought the book Absolutely American and read through it. It gave some great insight into academy life, and it somewhat reassured me of life at West Point. (Hell, if George Rash could graduate, why the hell can't I?) When I first read it, I felt like I was in the same position as the Whitey character - he had to choose between Rangers and Aviation. Infantry was what he wanted to do his whole life, but it'd also prevent him from having a successful family life. Aviation was "taking the easy way out," allowing him an easy transition out of the Army and into civilian life. After reading the book, I still was not sure if I wanted to leave home for nine years to join the military.</p>

<p>At this point, I was leaning toward West Point. Why? Truthfully, it was cause I did not want to end up at UC Berkeley. From where I come from, going to UC Berkeley is not considered very impressive. I know, many people would give their left arm just to go there, but I did not want to live with the fact that I worked my ass off and ended up at some "mediocre" school. (in my mind, anyways) Then I thought, is it my ego that's telling me to go to West Point, or do I actually want to go there? I haven't figured out the answer to that question yet. </p>

<p>Last week, my uncle came over. He congratulated me on getting into West Point, and he told me something that really struck me: He told me that I had a great opportunity in front of me. He said that if he had the chance to go to West Point, he would've taken it, cause it was a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. And he was right. How many people in this world ever get a chance to do something as important as protecting our country? In Absolutely American, the author talks about facing the elephant, facing the thing you've prepared your whole life to do. I am going to face the elephant. I may not have prepared, or expected, at any time in my life, for this to happen, but I'm going to sure as hell try to go through with it. I want to find out if I have what it takes to become an Army officer.</p>

11

<p>ok, this is a follow-up with some other factors that helped in my decision.</p>

<p>First of all, most of the people at West Point aren't hardcore military guys, at least according to my squad leader at SLS, so I wouldn't be stuck being around "the Army is my life" type people (not that I have anything against them). </p>

<p>Second, I figure that in the worst case scenario, I'd hate West Point and I'd transfer out of the place after a semester.</p>

<p>I understand, and many of you would probably agree, that I'm choosing West Point for all the wrong reasons. I'd probably agree, but I'm going to do it anyways. I've never been the person to take the easy way out of things, and I figure that if I could survive West Point, it'd make me that much stronger of a person.</p>

<p>Also, WPSON2010 - what exactly do you mean by approaching West Point half-way?</p>

12

<p>My suggestion, go to Boston College. If you are unsure and WP was an after thought for you. Don't take someone else's spot who wants a career in the military.</p>

13

<p>"Also, WPSON2010 - what exactly do you mean by approaching West Point half-way?"</p>

<p>What I meant is that West Point is so demanding, and so foreign to what you've experienced before, that if you're not fully committed the likelihood is very high that you'll either drop out on your own or be found wanting and given the boot. While West Point will do everything it can to keep truely qualified cadets there, it also has a way of sorting out the dabblers pretty quickly, starting, but definately not ending, with Beast.</p>

14

<p>Qwertz82: Two thoughts:
1) many candidates choose WP for the "challenge" of the institution, but you have to be really committed to meeting that challenge to succeed. If you go in with the idea that you can leave after a semester if you hate it you will likely drop out - even the most committed of cadets contemplate leaving at some point; plebe year is tough. Your reason for going needs to be strong enough to overcome those though times.
2) understand that the commitment is 4 years at WP, 5 years active service and then 3 years in the reserves (where you can expect at least 1 deployment in the current situation). If you choose the option to get your branch/posting of choice, or guaranteed graduate school option it will add another 3 years or more.
Good luck!</p>

15

<p>
[quote]
I want to find out if I have what it takes to become an Army officer.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>If you ask me, the fact that you have been awarded an appointment and decided to accept it shows that you do. All you have to do now is prove it to yourself and to the Academy. Good luck! :)</p>

<p>Oh, and BEAT ARMY! ;)</p>

<p>ETA: Ditto what WPSON said about not going in half-way. You have to go in full-tilt-boogie or you most likely won't make it.</p>

16

<p>Man I think these forums are mislabled. So many people getting lost.</p>

<p>USAFA is thata way >>>>>></p>

<p>Zaphod, USNA forum is that way ^^^^^ :)</p>

<p>Also, I guess I need to work on my "full-tilt-boogie" motivation techniques :P</p>

17

<p>Well, I guess my (USAF biased) view is not wanted. I can go back to other things, like working on my own stuff rather than trying to help someone else.</p>

18

<p>I think you're perfectly welcome here raimius, and your insight and experiences as an Air Force cadet are most helpful.</p>

19

<p>Qwertz:
Look at the academy as an opportunity to show that you belong there. Its not an automatic meal ticket to fame and fortune. UC Berkeley is a great University and usually when you hear people knock it, you delve a bit deeper and find out its for political reasons, not for reasons that have anything to do with "higher learning". In my opinion, 9 years of preparation to get into a "prestigious" private institution (no matter what it is) is never wasted if your final choice is to attend USMA. You will find yourself challenged as no other institution can. Our D turned down offers from Berkeley, UCLA, and a Naval Academy Appointment in favor of West Point---she and roughly 4000 cadets like her now spend each day trying to earn the right to stay there and graduate. Choose wisely for yourself.</p>

20

<p>It sounds like you guys are having to make the exact same decision I struggled with for a long time. Here was my thinking process in case anyone cares:</p>

<p>I also attended SLS this year and had the time of my life. I have no military background in my family, and before last summer I never had any interest in the military further than how every young male has wanted to be a navy seal or army ranger running around with guns at some point in his life. I only attended since my mother thought it would be a good experience, so I applied and was accepted. The seminar was fun in nearly every aspect, but more so than the activities and academy lifestyle, I really liked the type of people they had going there. The cadets were instant role models, and the other kids in the seminar were as a whole very intelligent, determined, accomplished, and easy to get along with. I read Absolutely American as soon as I got back, and it remains one of the best books I have ever read. </p>

<p>However, I think one must be very wary about making decisions after this kind of total immersion in the powerful culture and heritage of such an institution. The influence is very great, and though it most certainly was not intentional on the part of WP, I felt I had "brainwashed" myself a good bit. As soon as I got on the plane homebound to Atlanta, I thought: "This is definitely where I want to go and do with my life." As months passed, my deliberation became less crowded by positive memories and more reflective on my entire life path. </p>

<p>I received principal nomination to the big three USMA, USNA, and USAFA, but I only bothered to submit an application for West Point since I felt so sure. I now regret not filling out apps for the other two, more to have the option to go rather than actually wanting to. </p>

<p>I received a lot of "support" from adult leaders, many who assumed that an offer of admission meant my immediate acceptance of the offer, and I felt more and more under pressure trying to make an objective decision.</p>

<p>Many of my friends from SLS MOST SIMILAR TO ME in that they are more intelligent free thinkers than hooah soldiers, have declined their offers of admission. </p>

<p>At age 17 I do not feel ready to decide exactly what I'll be doing for a period of time more than 50% of what I have lived thus far. </p>

<p>A very good friend and classmate of mine, albeit entirely unqualified and a frequent liar, cheater, and thief, was also accepted. I was quite perturbed as the acceptance of this unnamed cadet candidate completely contradicted what I thought the academy stands for. He is also colorblind to the degree of failing the colorblindness exam several times, finally passing only after having taken the identical exam over and over until memorizing a sufficient amount of correct responses (It was between him and the optometrist). This showed me that the standards this year may or may not be up to par with years past.</p>

<p>Perhaps most importantly, I did not want to begin knowing that this may not be for me and then end up quitting. We are at war, and to me this isn't the time to be be dipping my feet in the water and not getting in. Whether shooting an officer in the field or taking an officer candidate's spot and then quitting, there will be one less officer in the fray and 40 ineffective leaderless men as a result. </p>

<p>I also slightly disagree with the direction the war is headed. While I am no coward, I find it hard to do my best work and stay focused under the war's current inconclusive and hazily defined set of objectives. If America was at war with Nazi Germany or attacking space aliens, I would gladly take up arms and even give my life, but the way it is now Id like to avoid it while I still can. </p>

<p>I have all but decided to attend Georgia Tech next year. I am very satisfied and I do not feel like Im settling for worse at all. Before anyone starts to argue with me, keep in mind this is just my own opinion, and my own rationalization for doing what I did. However I would love to talk more about it if you'd like I think we can all learn a lot more by communicating. </p>

<p>HOOAH to the class of 2011 Ill be w/ yall in spirit.</p>