My kids and their peers don’t expect to do as well as H and I financially; they eschew materialism, and one views having a manicured big yard as an unnecessary and unwanted expensive and environmentally negative idea. (I agree! But H preferred having one and not moving after 20+ years here.)
Neither see driving as a big deal. Oldest is glad that he’s attending college in a city where he doesn’t need a car and can easily rely on public transportation or walking to meet his needs.
They both saw (and continue to see) H working very hard for the lifestyle they have benefited from, but again, have no desire to replicate bc they have lower expectations and desires for what they need/want.
Quality of life is by far the more important variable for them than making money.
Min didn’t want a car at first, she’s walking to work, then she moved to SF, no parking space, so she gave me back her car, luckily I was slow in selling her car, then she wanted it back because living in SF, everything was out during COVID lock down, she had to go to the suburbs to get groceries and that means she had to have a car. Now she’s back to the suburb and she needs a car to go to work one day a week. So these generalization about expectations rarely work out as planned. Uber was/is very expensive beside of the fact that she had to interact with somebody.
Maybe someone who is better informed that me. But if a husband makes less than his spouse and they share custody of their children, why would he have to pay child support?
Anymore most divorcing couples I’ve been familiar with share custody.
I don’t think he makes significantly less, maybe 10-20% less, but those are his kids too. I have a girl friend who got pregnant with a guy, they were not married, she made more than he did, he still had to pay child support.
Seems to me like the most common examples are pampered tech workers thinking they have the right to demand their employers decline contracts with customers they don’t like.
Just today I was reading about Google employees that got fired for mounting a campaign to stop the company working with the Israeli Defense Forces.
You can try that in the boom times when there’s a shortage of employees. When the recession comes and you need a paycheck, most rational people tend to lose those scruples. I think hippies in the 1970s also cared about what their employers stood for. But with double digit unemployment, most couldn’t be that picky.
I recall my first job, the interview started with “do you have a problem with working on defense projects” and continued “you know you’ll have to get a security clearance”… it’s not hard to give the right answer.
Well, you may be outnumbered among posters on this thread, but there are certainly plenty of families–parents and kids–who share your views. Just look at all the kids who come on CC with goals of getting into Elite College X in order to land High-Paying Job Y. There’s no right or wrong, just different values and priorities.
As I said, for kids who want to keep (or reach) an UMC lifestyle and stay in my area, short of substantial parental help, they need to go for the serious money, and choose a similar partner. And there are those that do.
As someone mentioned upthread, our views are informed by our own experiences. For me, two things have influenced me. One is that I chose a career that turned out to be a bad fit for me. So while it’s paid well enough, I’ve often hated my job. I spent years absolutely dreading Monday mornings. Spending a large part of your waking hours at a job you hate takes a psychic toll that I would not wish on my kids. So I get it when people say money isnt everything.
The second is watching dear friends struggle with the severe debilitating mental illnesses of their kids, and the affect that has on their and their children’s lives. So when I look at life through the lens of my friends, who are just praying that their child will still be alive tomorrow, it has had a strong effect on my priorities.
But again, that’s me and my life. Others may and do differ. And of course the ideal is to have work that you love and pays well and gives you the work-life balance that you want. Many people have to compromise somewhere to find that sweet spot.
I think you’ve brought up some really valid points.
I also think that it’s all about striking a balance between the various factors that one has to weigh when making such a decision. It’s often hard to figure it all out. And every choice has pros and cons to it.
I thought there was a spectrum of opinion on this group. Not sure why you think your views are in the minority. And I am not sure why you need to delete your post if you feel your views are in a minority :-).
I was being a little more mean spirited than I should be.
I think everyone has the right to feel the way they do.
I guess I see a few of my older friends who are still paying the medical bills and funding their children who happens to be my age. We just went to lunch with our friends who are now providing day care for their great grandchild. I think that has affected how I’m feeling.
People keep mention UMC, please define what they are income wise. It’s hard to tell whether you need an Ivy to achieve that, but what the heck is that?
We just met a family with four kids. Oldest is in the medical field, the two middle are in CS and tech start ups, and the youngest didn’t go to college and is living in a van working at a national park and having the time of their life. Parents seem totally fine with each of their kids and that they are happy and healthy.
If I’m being honest, I would struggle if my D opted to skip college and was living in a van, no matter how happy, and I’d probably pray that she was considering it a gap year (or two) and would find her way back to school.
Yes I know but what income band. WSJ had an article recently about UMC and inflation, they define it as between $75k-$125k, if my memory serves me right.
I think we all choose different roads in…well, life. How we are educated, how we value work over pleasure or at the expense of pleasure. Or vice versa. How we spend or save.
The above, IF we are fortunate enough to make those choices.
There isn’t one way that is correct. We all show that!
I get a lot of pleasure from still doing things $$$ wise for my kids. They all make more money than I do at this point (I run a non profit grant funded program so that ain’t saying a lot…) but I love treating them even though they are adults. They don’t ask or expect. It’s how I was raised as well . I’d rather use my $ to take them on a vacation now then then use my money to take a vacation when I’m not around to go!
This works for us.
But bottom line, their career is their choice. We helped them write their early chapters. The pen and paper was passed to them during college to develop the rest of their own story.
“Upper middle class” is vague enough that many use it when they do not want to write down a specific income or wealth level. For example, on these forums, writing “we are upper middle class and will not get college financial aid, but can only afford $20k per year for kid’s college” may sound better than “we have $300k income and will not get college financial aid, but can only afford $20k per year for kid’s college”.
