DD2 is currently interested in engineering, and says she is interested in chemical engineering or material science . I will be taking her to visit a few schools starting this Friday, and I am wondering what questions I should be asking about the major, and the engineering facilities, research, internship opportunities, etc.
I was not an engineering major, so any thoughts from those who have some experience would be great. I am trying to get a better understanding of the similarities and differences between Purdue, Rose-Hulman, Wisconsin, Illinois, Lehigh, and Tufts.
At the moment, I have the impression that she is leaning toward Tufts, if they will admit her. It is a reach, but she would be an athlete for them which is giving her a decent chance. (basic stats: 3.55 uwgpa, 4.25 wgpa, 31 ACT)
To confuse the options further, Vassar has contacted her and invited her for a weekend in the fall for swimming. They don’t have engineering, but she could double major in Math and Chem. She likes that they are finishing a new science building and upgrading their facilities.
At the DI schools she is not quite fast enough to swim (except Lehigh), but would probably play Club Waterpolo. She is a high school varsity swim team captain, and will probably be a varsity water polo captain, but water polo has not chosen its captains yet.
The biggest obvious difference is going to be size and professor involvement - This is the first pass - She should worry more about fit/vibe/feel than anything else right now
Also with Chem E and/or Materials Science very little high school prior knowledge is expected - few students have any experience in either of those studies before college
Basically, just general well preparedness for college is expected, including math through precalculus at the minimum (take calculus if offered to the student), high school physics and chemistry, and the rest of the well rounded college prep course selection (four years of English, etc.).
If she wants to go to work in industry at graduation, chemistry is probably not that good substitute for chemical engineering in terms of employer interest.
D3 schools with engineering might be her best bet, especially if her swim times for D3 are solid: Tufts, Carnegie Mellon, Johns Hopkins, Rensselaer, Case Western, U Rochester, Stevens Tech, Rochester Tech.
It’s hard to receive a bump with admissions, but at least she’d be able to swim in D3. What are her best times? Lehigh’s times are at least as good as, say, Stevens Tech, which has a top 20 team. Has she contacted any D3 coaches?
Be sure when you set up the visit that you also set a visit with the engineering department. On paper Purdue, UIUC and Wisconsin are going to be similar, however, they may feel very different. We visited two of them, however, I’ll let you develop your own opinion. Rose Hulman is unique among the group. It’s peers are schools more like Harvey Mudd or Olin both of which are much harder to get in to. Case Western might be a good school to consider as a match. It is a D3 school with an excellent engineering school and a strong liberal arts backround. Our D is a ChemE at Purdue. We have been pleased with their Professional Practice office. They offer both a 5 and 3 session co-op opportunities as well as internships. If that is something she might be interested in you may ask each school about that. The sessions with the engineering department should also answer questions such as are you directly admitted to the major or are you accepted into general engineering and apply for your major your second year. You might ask about research opportunities for undergrads.
@Ivvsf Thank you for your post. I will investigate those options.
@swampdraggin “you mean - She should be asking about the major!
The biggest obvious difference is going to be size and professor involvement - This is the first pass - She should worry more about fit/vibe/feel than anything else right now”
Are there any important differences in facilities that I should also look for?
@ucbalumnus “If she wants to go to work in industry at graduation, chemistry is probably not that good substitute for chemical engineering in terms of employer interest.”
If she ended up at Vassar, the primary expectation would be that a Math and Chem double major would prepare her for an chemical engineering Masters degree. Does that seem like a feasible plan?
Also she did take Honors Chemistry, AP Physics 1, and pre-calculus. Senior year she is taking AP Calculus BC and AP Chemistry, AP Lit and Comp, AP Psych, and AP Econ.
@dunboyne She is in contact with the head coach at Tufts, Vassar, Rose-Hulman. She was going to contact Case Western, but I am not sure whether she did. Senior swim begins in mid-August. She is hoping to improve. Her to best She primarily swims the 200 Freestyle, and 100 freestyle relay. USA times from Junior year (age 16) are:
0:26.3 50 freestyle
0:56.2 100 freestyle
2:00.6 200 freestyle
5:22.0 500 Freestyle
I don’t think she would be a star for any of these teams, but it looks like she is good enough to improve their scores in meets right away. Especially in relay events.Also, if she decides a DI school is better, she would play Club Water Polo. So that would be okay. Any thought would be appreciated.
There are commonalities between the Chemistry major and the Chemical Engineering major, but the two disciplines are quite different. Depending upon the job/career, a Chemistry major would not be competent conducting critical Chemical Engineering tasks. Also, a master’s degree in the traditional engineering majors does not provide much of a leg up over a B.S. holder on the factory floor. The exception is likely to be in the R&D area. Companies often finance an employee’s master degree in Engineering when they need that expertise.
Her best bets as far as swim interest (factoring in Chem Eng) would be Case Western, Rensselaer, Rochester Tech, and Tufts. But you’re right, she wouldn’t be top of the heap, though her 500 is quite competitive. It might be worth it for her to contact the coaches at all of these schools. She could swim competitively and pursue engineering (better job prospects).
@Dunboyne In looking at college swimming.com. It looks like she will be one of the best swimmers at Rose-Hulman, and Vassar.
She could help Tufts with only a small improvement, but her grades and scores are marginal for Tufts. However, it is possible that her strength in math, and swimming may be enough to get her in; she is hopeful, but she is not counting on it.
If not, then there is a good chance that she will have to decide among Vassar, Lehigh, Case, Wisconsin, Rose, Purdue.
Just let it be understood that Case, Rose Hulman and Purdue are matches not safeties. Standards for getting into a schools engineering college are often higher than to get into the university in general. Her chances of acceptance are good at Purdue and Rose Hulman, however, I would not consider it assured. Case borders on being a reach. I cannot speak for Lehigh or Vassar. She should apply to some schools that she would be assured acceptance. I think University of Cincinnati would fit in that category as would the University of Akron (it has an excellent ChemE program with it’s relationship with Firestone) and I’m sure others can give lots of other schools.
I have D that is ChemE NU grad of 2009 working in her field. Son a current NU ChemE student. D was looking at all the same schools that your D was - so good luck to her! BTW - you can PM me if you have follow up questions.
Re: Vasser - NO. A Liberal arts school is not an engineering school, and Chemistry is NOT ChemE as someone pointed out. BTW - my kids say that HS physics was more helpful to them than HS Chem regarding ChemE.
My D tells me old joke: Q: "What’s the difference between a Chem Major and a ChemE Degree? A: " About $20,000 per year. To start. "
Also - For some strange reason, ChemE is NOT in Engineering Dept at UIUC. So keep that in mind. Also, out of all the schools that you mentioned, my D also applied to Iowa State ChemE, and that and IL were her #2 and #3 choices. VIP: My D and S decided on Northwestern over all the others- it was less money out of pocket. Might be for your D also, so why not shoot them an app? And both my kids went from HS varsity starters to club sports standouts - and they loved it. I don’t know where you live in relation to your D’s schools, but I say go close- It’s a GREAT perk for me and wife to see out kids do stuff at college when we get invited to games.
I’m a current high schooler looking into ChemE so my opinion may differ from others. What I find most important is that they actually have ChemE. Chemistry etc. Will be terrible for job prospects. Second, a key factor is whether the school gives the students a lot of industry experience. Is it common to get an internship? How are graduation rates? Co-op programs? Do professors actually let undergrads come to their lab? Etc. Nowadays, I see a lot of jobs (entry level) expecting experience in the industry so I would consider university the best time to get it, to survive in the industry. I’m not sure about getting chem and then ChemE masters. It may work but I would probably just go with ChemE.
@Ivvcsf “Just let it be understood that Case, Rose Hulman and Purdue are matches not safeties. Standards for getting into a schools engineering college are often higher than to get into the university in general. Her chances of acceptance are good at Purdue and Rose Hulman, however, I would not consider it assured.”
I think you are correct about that. On our high school’s Naviance, all of the students with her grades and ACT score were admitted to Rose-Hulman and Purdue, but I suppose it is possible that she could always be the first to not get in, so we will play it safe.
I think that to be safe, we should add Penn State, Ohio State, and Michigan State. All of the applicants to those three schools were also admitted with her grades and test scores. That should be completely safe. Especially for a girl who will have already taken BC Calculus, I think it would be very unlikely that they would all reject her. I do not think I will even take her to visit these three, but at least they will make a safety net, and we can visit if they begin looking more likely.
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swampdraggin wrote:
Also with Chem E and/or Materials Science very little high school prior knowledge is expected - few students have any experience in either of those studies before college
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Not so fast.
My son was a ChemE major and I don’t think he would have done well w/o the strong math and science foundation that he received in high school. While a student may not learn ChemE or MaterialsE stuff in high school, s/he really needs to be able to “hit the ground running” once in college.
Well, @mom2kids She will have AP Calc BC, AP chem, AP Literature and Comp, AP Physics 1 is already done, AP Lang and Comp is already done. Those are her primary APs. 3 more off APs. Anything critical missing?
mom2collegekids - I agree with you - I just meant that the student is certainly expected to have done quite well in science and math in high school but there are very very few students with a background specifically in materials science or chemical engineering in high school
and “hit the ground running” too
Right…what I meant by “hit the ground running” is that when eng’g students arrive at a univ and don’t have the math/science foundation, they’ll often stumble in Gen Chem and Calc classes. There’s a lot of weeding that goes on during the first year of eng’g.
Your D sounds like she has the foundation.
lol…I didn’t mean a foundation in ChemE or Materials.
I would also ask about the sequence of the engineering required courses. Some schools teach some courses only once a year or every other year. Missing a course or having to repeat a course can delay a student’s graduation for a whole year.
DD2 was deferred in ED: Tufts (so many still be admitted)
Admitted EA: Purdue and Case Western Reserve
Outstanding applications: Lehigh, Illinois, Wisconsin and Northeastern
She is still interested in Chem Engineering, but her sister is trying to get her interested in Computer Science.
Question:
From what I can tell, these seven schools all seem to have fairly comparable engineering programs, so it would seem that she should primarily focus on Fit. Does anyone have any insight into any significant differences between these seven schools, or other factors for her to consider?
