What to do about high school casting?

College Majors Musical Theater Major
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<p>Resurrecting an old thread here, but this is our dilemma at the moment:</p>

<p>Is it time to throw in the towel?</p>

<p>I totally understand the “stick it out in the chorus” or “letting it go” mindset, but the paragraph below describes our situation pretty closely.</p>

<p>“However, at their high school, they are expected to attend every rehearsal, are not allowed to leave early for voice lessons, dance, etc., and at times are sitting around trying to do their homework in the dark auditorium while they wait for the director to get to them. And, high school shows take months of rehearsal because so many of the kids are new comers.Part of what is frustrating is to have such unprofessional conduct on the one hand, but require kids to treat the high school show as if they were on Broadway.”</p>

<p>Add to that often kids are cast in incorrect vocal ranges, favoritism, pre-casting, and possible student influence in the choice of the shows and casting. Dk started in the program last year and is a senior this year and has taken lots of dance, acting, and voice lessons outside of school. Dk also has had some professional experience and a bi-coastal agent, so we do know how things work for the most part and how k stacks up in a bigger pool. Dk has also had good results in competitions and applications to auditioned summer programs. Dk is modest about all that and has tried really hard to fit in and, for the most part, has succeeded in the high school setting and enjoys the social aspect and being/having been a drama kid. </p>

<p>Dk had two good supporting roles last year. The “perfect” lead role in all ways (look, skills, range, etc.) came up this year, but k ended up cast in a glorified chorus role, tops…about ten minutes on stage in the whole musical. Other speaking and solo song roles going to sophs and even freshmen.</p>

<p>After being upset, we regained our composure over a couple of days. The director offered to have a meeting with k re. audition technique and skills. Dk took the director up on it and got through it with self-respect intact, amazingly. Luckily, k is super resilient. But the fact is that the director pretty much totally trashed k, up and down in terms of skills and talent (k is very skilled, especially in some of the specialized skills required for this show). It was not a very educationally-oriented meeting. The director implied that dk was pretty much out of the running for the last musical due to other roles that have been pre-cast and due to some of k’s physical attributes that wouldn’t fit, ie, appearance of youthfulness, too kid-like. (Don’t they all look young at this age?) There is no policy at this high school re. casting, seniority, etc. although seniority seemed to be some part of the equation in the past.</p>

<p>So, with all this information, we feel that it is over for k at this point in this last year of high school. We would like to pull out…rehearsals have just started. I feel that if the directors can’t even take the time to make a schedule (but can take the time to unjustly undermine a student at a crucial time in their lives) or take into account the stress/time constraints of senior year under these circumstances, well, it’s hard to maintain a professional demeanor.</p>

<p>The only other alternative would be to try to negotiate a much reduced schedule. We made some noises in that direction at first, but that was not received very favorably.</p>

<p>Also my feeling re. “sticking it out”, especially after such a meeting, is that they are still kids. If the things are looking so bleak, why suffer the entire year essentially knowing what is going to happen. Why not go out and explore other opportunities at this point? Looking forward to your thoughts!</p>

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<p>Sigh. The drama surrounding drama is unbearable at times, isn’t it?</p>

<p>Our long time drama teacher retired suddenly over the summer. Our school administration cares so little for the performing arts that they hired a guy with NO experience. On top of that, the principal told him during his interview (the new teacher told me all this) that he did not have to do a musical if he didn’t want to. WHAT!!! Within three days of the new school year he realized who was on his side and who was not, and that the kids would totally revolt if there was no musical. My D opted out of the play this fall due to her need to spend her time in dance class and getting ready for college auditions but she volunteered to be assistant director. D tries to make suggestions for blocking (he did not have the blocking done before rehearsal started), lighting ect. He says thanks and just keeps doing what he wants to do. They spend a couple of hours working on like three pages of script. D is frustrated but I told her that he has to learn too and that if he doesn’t want her suggestions or advice, oh well. She is very worried about the musical. They haven’t even picked one yet. I did my best to suggest a few that would have minimal costumes (i.e. what we already have on site), fewer male roles (we don’t have many guys who can sing), and simple choreography (he has never choreographed a show). Haven’t heard anything yet… aye yi yi. I’ll not miss all this crazy stuff when my kid goes off to college!</p>

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<p>Oh, I have so much sympathy for you. My D sounds very similar to yours (professional experience, agent, much success outside of school), although our school does do seniority casting. Therefore my D (now a junior) has had to bide her time seeing less-talented older kids given parts. My D is also continually told she looks too young (she does look young, but you’re right – they are all young now!).</p>

<p>What has kept D hanging in there and taking non-speaking, non-singing roles is that she hopes her senior year will finally see her reward. Things have picked up for her in her junior year.</p>

<p>So, what does your D want to do? If I were in your shoes, and my D wanted to pull out, I would let her. She’s done everything she should do, and I don’t think she’s going to learn anything from sticking it out.
But, if my D wanted to stick with it --and I can see my D wanting to stay with it to be with her friends — I would let her. I would be angry at the choir/drama director, but if she could suck it up, I could.
So I guess my bottom line thought is to let your D make the decision. She’s a senior now and will be making her own decisions all of the time in the very near future.
Interested to hear what others think.</p>

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<p>My comment is not about whether or not to do the show or the casting, etc. But are you saying that the entire cast is called to come to every single full rehearsal slot? That really is not too great. I think that is not respectful of the kids’ time. There should be a rehearsal schedule of who is needed, which scenes, etc. until toward the end when the whole cast is needed to run through the show, etc. Making the kids sit in the auditorium for very long blocks of time when not needed, but not allowed to go to another one of their scheduled lessons/activities is not so good in my opinion. Most directors, I think, plan out a rehearsal schedule calling for who is needed on a particular day or hour. Our school did have such a rehearsal schedule though there were times my D complained about sitting there all afternoon, not being needed, could not do homework, and was missing other activities/lessons where she had conflicts (even down the hall, for example, for jazz band which she was in). </p>

<p>That said, usually in professional theater, this does not happen as much. However, as I type this, my D is now rehearsing a professional production of a musical. She plays a lead in it. But she did tell me on the phone yesterday that everyone is called from 10 to 6 every day and she is not needed all that time. She doesn’t have school homework as she is out of college, but she has a ton of things she is working on for other jobs and so she has brought her laptop to the theater for times she is not on stage and has made it work out since there is wireless there. She commented that there was no stage manager and so that made the rehearsal times a bit less structured in the way she is used to in professional theater. </p>

<p>In any production rehearsals, there are bound to be moments when not needed but I do not think a school director should call the entire cast for rehearsal each afternoon if some kids are not going to be needed. Their time is valuable too.</p>

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<p>The drama surrounding drama is unbearable – I like that!</p>

<p>Thanks for all your replies. We have to make this decision today or tomorrow, so we really appreciate the input.</p>

<p>I understand that there are going to be times when someone will be sitting around for some time. Both dh and I have worked in professional theatre (not as actors) for some years, we do know how it works. And yes, I know it seems hard to believe, but the announcement at the start of this production was “you all have to be here all the time” although there’s been some backpedaling, probably due to parental pressure.</p>

<p>And then there is the educational component, forgoing dance, voice, acting lessons while being underutilized, at times extremely underutilized, during rehearsals in the senior year. It just doesn’t seem worth it. And to what end, high school resumes don’t carry a lot of weight, missing out on time to continue improving skills and work on college applications. I am trying to find a good reason for k stick with it, but it’s pretty difficult, given the circumstances. And believe me, I know that dk is not the most amazing mt kid to come down the pike. K does need to be working on those other things although k is years ahead of others in the production who are just learning a boxstep. I believe it’s just one of those situations that are hard to understand and aren’t going to change at this juncture.</p>

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<p>Whoops, not quite getting this right yet. @merlehay and walker thanks so much for your input and insight and sympathy. It is really hard, but if there’s any time to do this, I think it would be this year. The good thing is that we don’t need a letter of recommendation from this person, thank goodness.</p>

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<p>Maybe it would be helpful if your D made a list of all conflicts (dance, voice, audition dates) and give it to the director so they can decide if she can be in the show and still make all of her other commitments. It is so hard to fit it all in senior year and spending time sitting in a rehearsal without being utilized sounds beyond frustrating.</p>

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<p>We faced a similar situation last year–a high school director who wouldn’t allow S to attend dance classes, voice lessons, even orthodontist appointments if they conflicted with a rehearsal, even though he had a really small part and many days and evenings he did nothing but sit there for hours on end. He enjoyed the other kids but ultimately decided that this year he would focus on community theatre and training as being a much better use of his time. I left the decision up to him, but I can’t deny that I was very happy that he came to the conclusion that he did!</p>

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<p>I agree that missing dance, voice, etc. when sitting in an auditorium all afternoon and not doing anything is very hard to take. Having the entire cast come to all rehearsals, especially toward the beginning is ridiculous. </p>

<p>Our school sometimes worked this out. For example, my kid had schedule conflicts galore and sometimes missed things like dance classes for the school musical (but not all her dance classes…she took a lot…and usually went from musical rehearsals onto dance studio in early evening). But some things she did work out during the audition period on her conflicts list. At our dance studio, which was 25 miles away, my D was in a select jazz repertory dance troupe which rehearsed after school every Friday, whereas many of her dance classes were in the evening and did not conflict with the musical, but she could not miss the dance troupe rehearsals on Friday afternoons and would never give that up for just a couple months of conflict on the school musical. She told the school musical director that she could not come on most Fridays. She was still cast as the lead each year and allowed to miss Friday rehearsals. I recall in tenth grade she was Dorothy in Wizard of Oz and they cast an understudy for her and that girl did the Friday rehearsals and was given one matinee of the show, which was a nice way to work that out. Believe me, all the many activities and lessons and their respective conflicts were not easy to work out with the various parties involved but we tried to do so as much as possible. </p>

<p>Training is important for a kid going to college for this field and so I would not give it all up for the show. Some things like private voice lessons and piano lessons were easier to work out but obviously certain things are at set times. It is a lot of juggling and in our case, a lot of long distance traveling as we live in a rural area. But I know my kid would be bothered to be called to EVERY rehearsal and not be utilized at all at many of them. I don’t think that is right and I would suggest the cast or even parents advocate for a rehearsal schedule that requires certain cast, scenes, or numbers on certain days until they start to do run throughs, etc. Then it may be worth your D staying in it. She’ll have to weigh if she wants to go to rehearsal every day and sit and give up other important things for that or not. I would not give up ALL her training, however, as that is important.</p>

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<p>Reading over the replies, I think maybe we should probably go to the director and choreographer with calendar in hand and make the effort to reduce k’s time at rehearsal, at least before we give up entirely.</p>

<p>I have my doubts that it will work to the extent both sides would find acceptable, but we can show that we were willing to try to work things out for the benefit of both parties. One really difficult aspect is that dance (where dk is on scholarship) is at the same time as rehearsal everyday except Friday. It’s especially hard to work this out when we know that k’s chances of being cast in the last musical are slim to none. But maybe it is worth a try to preserve some semblance of a good relationship with the director.</p>

<p>I think I’ll start on the e-mail now. Will let you know what kind of response I get! It’s so good to have someplace to check in where everyone “gets” it. Thanks!</p>

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<p>Agree with what’s been said. I think that if you present a list of conflicts and say the only way your s/d can stay in the show as an ensemble member is if the director can meet you half way and only require s/d to be at rehearsals for his/her 10 minutes of the show. If he says no, then you have your out without quitting; if he says yes, s/d still gets to continue with dance and other training.</p>

<p>At this point, I think training and preparing for college auditions is more important than sitting around in rehearsals. If s/d is released from the cast, you may find, like zebrarunner, that there are other performance opportunities that you have overlooked because you have been focused on hs shows.</p>

<p>Curious to know director’s reaction to your email ;)</p>

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<p>We also have had disappointments with casting at our high school, regardless of how very well it goes for my D outside of school. D is also deciding whether or not to stay in her Senior year school musical. Chances are she will say yes because while there will undoubtedly be plenty of down time at rehearsals our rehearsal schedule is not as restrictive as the rehearsals at your school. Also, her theater director is the one writing her college recommendations. And there will be other shows he casts this year. (FYI, there is a similar CC thread called Painful Day).</p>

<p>These posts do bring another question up. When is it acceptable for a parent to do the communicating with or on behalf of their child, and when is it not appropriate? Since high school, I have required my D to do the communicating with teachers, directors and coaches 90% of the time. The only exceptions I have made was when a sports coach was verbally abusive, and when a teacher failed my D without reaching out to me at all. They learn a lot from how we interact during issues of conflict, but they also learn from stumbling through it themselves.</p>

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<p>shaun0203 - lots of similarities with your D and my S. This year, lots of kids have decided not to go out for the fall musical because they don’t like the director (our drama teacher), but S gets along with him, and the teacher is also writing him a recommendation. Luckily, our director is excellent as far as only calling certain characters at certain times, so there isn’t a lot of full cast rehearsals until about midway through the production.</p>

<p>And same here - we try to not get involved, but will coach our son from home if he asks about how to deal with or approach a teacher. Our performing arts teachers can be a little on the “diva” side, so a lot of kids/parents don’t want to cross them. I was planning on getting involved at the beginning of this year when the choral director put my son in a very awkward position though. He is the musical director of our student-led male a cappella group, and a girl wanted to join (she presents as a boy). The choral director told him it’s his call as far as if she should perform with them. This issue has legal ramifications, and would be a hot button throughout the school, and she’s making a 17-yr-old responsible for that! Apparently the girl has reconsidered, but try-outs are next Monday, so it could still happen. I will surely go to the school and let them know this is a decision that should come from administration. The boys sing all around our area, and they have the word “man” as part of their name, so it will be unusual for a girl to be up there singing with them. My S, of course, was only concerned with her vocal abilities - LOL!</p>

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<p>

At my d’s PA HS, they insist from day one of the Freshman year that the students take the initiative and responsibility for managing their time, planning their work, and communicating with the school, especially artistically. Of course, parents are welcome to communicate with the school whenever they choose, but the school’s strong recommendation is that a student interested in pursuing a career in the arts needs to learn, early on, some of the basic entrepreneurial skills that are necessary to be successful in these fields. </p>

<p>The school encourages parents to carefully monitor progress, offer advice, present opportunities, help find resources, become fully informed about pursuing a career in fine arts, and be a great supporter of whatever dreams a student has, but stop short of “doing things” for their offspring, like intervening in artistic progress assessment, casting, etc.</p>

<p>In situations that exceed the normal course of learning, such as potential legal issues, safety, etc. the school strongly encourages direct parental involvement.</p>

<p>Much to my chagrin, I have found myself biting my tongue until it bleeds, only to see that, sure enough, d manages to handle things really well as they come up, although she rarely follows any approach I would have recommended. I think I am learning just as much as she is.</p>

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<p>I’ll just jump in here, too. My kid is a born communicator. K started answering the phone as a toddler and hasn’t stopped since. Being more shy and introverted myself, I was amazed and very happy about this ability, so k has been able to communicate with teachers and other adults quite easily from the start and has always had a lot of common sense. So I am not getting involved in this yet, although my dh and I do advise k and talk things through with k, which I think is helpful. </p>

<p>However, there is more to this than I’ve stated here, so we’ll have to see how it goes in the next few days. Parental involvement may be needed at some point. I hope not, but I fear that it will be the case.</p>

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<p>well, this is timely since my daughter is auditioning for the fall production at this very moment. I think what I’ve learned now that she’s a high school senior is to be sympathetic, but to let her fight her own battles. It’s a tough business, and since she wants to do a BFA MT better to learn that lesson now than later.</p>

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<p>jeffandann - “break legs” to your girl. My S is auditioning for the fall musical tomorrow, and he mentioned in passing that it’ll be his last musical. I think he’s having mixed emotions about it.</p>

<p>They are growing up . . .</p>

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<p>My D was told yesterday to just pick the spring musical. That’s how lousy things are here. You tell the only kid with a clue to pick the production. Aye yi yi</p>

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<p>Here’s the thing about high school casting that I think gets kids interested in MT all confused. My daughter is in I guess you would call a slump. She thought she’d be cast in one of the leads this summer but got Ensemble, and was told she could have played any of the female leads but because they had some kids that only fit a certain lead they felt they had to cast those kids or they wouldn’t have been in the show. Seems odd. Then she just missed out on being the lead for a high school summer production because the teacher thought another girl had a bit more vulnerability for the part; but note that she was one of two considered for the lead out of about 100 girls auditioning. Then for some small student directed plays she didn’t get cast, but she in retrosepct thinks she wasn’t really good for any of the available parts. So to her credit she’ll house manage and get some experience behind the scenes for that.</p>

<p>So here’s the deal. Those kind of setbacks can lead a kid to question whether she’s doing the right thing going for MT. And my daughter has certainly had her share of feeling bummed this year, which is why I really hope her audtion for the fall play went well yesterday (callbacks today). </p>

<p>But in the end, does any of this high school stuff really matter? I think not that much. Because every single person that is actually in the music theater business that has evaluated my daughter has indicated to us that she has the talent to obtain a BFA MT spot and work in the profession. So while it is tough to watch your child go throught the angst of high school auditioning and performances (as well as the angst of high school in general) I don’t think it will have that much effect on their future. So I try to keep that perspective with my child, and I guess if you have a HS director that absolutely won’t work with your schedule, etc it’s probably OK to have them miss a performance without thinking it will ruin their career plans.</p>

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<p>“But in the end, does any of this high school stuff really matter?”</p>

<p>Yes, this is exactly it. It doesn’t really matter at all in the long term. Thanks for the great post and reminder. I do know that deep down, and so does k. </p>

<p>More of the dilemma is where to put energies and time in the senior year given the situation. I guess I feel that if the directors want to use k in a “bit role” that doesn’t really highlight many of k’s hard-earned skills and a role in the upcoming musical seems unlikely due to pre-casting and k is not learning anything AND there is no reasonable schedule, well, it just feels like a waste of time. E-mailed the schedule a day and a half ago and have had no response yet…that is normal though for this dept, as I expected…we’ll have to make our decision soon.</p>