<p>We've all heard about the pros... now what are the cons for this fab school?</p>
<p>Yeah, I stole this thread from the Yale forum.</p>
<p>A lot of people see NYC as a pro to Columbia, but I think it can be a con as well. The business of the city can only be handled so much by nature-dwellers or people from quiet towns.</p>
<p>Huge Core that prevents you from taking classes you actually want.</p>
<p>Here are some:</p>
<p>Terrible sports teams / No rah-rah school spirit / alums don't have "Columbia pride" --- these are all related</p>
<p>Bureaucratic administration / lots of red tape</p>
<p>Relatively poor advising / you have to fend for yourself / not a lot of handholding (this is a good thing, IMO, as I didn't want to be babied)</p>
<p>Columbia2002, does the lack of "Columbia pride" result in lackluster alumni-connections (for job searching)?</p>
<p>(wrote on another post)</p>
<p>Campus Life - Freshmen and Sophomores hang out at a couple bars, and a mix of grad students and upper classmen at 1020 (a bar). The frats are totally insular so don't expect that to be a factor. House parties are non-exisitent for the most part, a East Campus gathering of 10-20 is the best you can get most of the time. I personally found the social scene frustrating, it seemed like 25% were too cool to stay in the area, 25% were to nerdy to care, 25% stayed in very cliquey groups, and maybe only 25% went out locally. </p>
<p>If you want a campus based social-life Columbia isn't the place, a place like Brown has much more activity. A place like Dartmouth or Penn MUCH MUCH more the campus activity. If you really need to be in the city Columbia isn't as bad as most urban schools, but don't come expecting tons of friends hanging out at house parties. It just isn't what Columbia is about. If on the other hand you only want your college experience 'in small doses" and prefer to go out in the city, Columbia is great. For some its the best top school in the world, for others it is far from that. Its a slightly polar place.</p>
<p>Well, when it rains for a few days, all of the paths and sidewalks flood, so bring your rain boots.</p>
<p>The meal plan is hit or miss--a lot of the on-campus places are okay, but the dining hall is more miss than hit (breakfasts are good though).</p>
<p>It's UBER liberal; I don't know if that's a problem for you or not...</p>
<p>if you wear stilettos like i do the brick paths can be a pain. </p>
<p>lack of community= hard to meet people.</p>
<p>don't expect AMAZING classes. some of my classes are great, some are really stupid. ahem. frontiers of science. </p>
<p>ALSO...since there is a lack of community and people go off campus a lot...it can feel REALLY cliquey. people that go off campus vs. people that don't, the scenesters and hipsters that are in the "i'm not a hipster you conformist ****" facebook group, the kids that always stay in, etc. people divide into cliques easily...in my observation. which is weird because you think a school in a big city would have less of that.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Columbia2002, does the lack of "Columbia pride" result in lackluster alumni-connections (for job searching)?
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</p>
<p>Nah, alumni know that Columbia kids are among the best in the country, and are still perfectly willing to help them out.</p>
<p>Hate to say it...but the alumni networking can't touch some of the other Ivies.</p>
<p>What's the basis for your thinking that? Alumni networking is so fuzzy and difficult to evaluate and compare. People from Ivies do well in the job market not because of "networking" but because they're among the best candidates out there... and the people doing the hiring are often Ivy alums because Ivy alums are often in important positions.</p>
<p>In the beginning you're right, it isn't as important. But later in life it comes into play. I got my current job not through my MBA network, but my Dartmouth network. Alums were willing to meet with me, one of those informationals turned into my perfect job.</p>
<p>I repeat, what's your basis for thinking that "[Columbia's] alumni networking can't touch some of the other Ivies." The fact that you got hooked up through your Dartmouth network says exactly what about the weakness of Columbia's network?</p>
<p>Here's another example. When I worked in DC for a very well-known legendary senator the summer between my first and second years, I met a columbia alum from a big newspaper and mentioned I was a columbia student. He literally seemed to not care at all. A couple days later someone from Time came, he was a Dartmouth grad and I mentioned that I was considering transferring. The guy went out of his way to be helpful, gave me his business card, and actually called me later to ask if I had any questions.</p>
<p>Just one experience but it tells me something. Columbia is a less community oriented school, even while people are there they feel less strongly about it compared to some other schools. Columbia has some AMAZINGLY positive qualities - like the lack of a jock-dominated culture, the core, etc. But loyalty, community, and networking are just not what Columbia is about.</p>
<p>
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Just one experience but it tells me something.
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</p>
<p>It tells you exactly what you told us -- that one Columbia alum was cold and one Dartmouth grad was helpful. It doesn't tell you or anybody else anything more. This is purely anecdotal evidence, and isn't going to convince anyobody of anything. As I said above, "alumni networking is so fuzzy and difficult to evaluate and compare." Your one experience proves just that.</p>
<p>I am just saying that just as Princeton or Dartmouth are much more connected and community oriented during college, this also translates to the real world as well. The network at schools like those is just tight because everyone wants to be friends with each other, they all show up to reunions, and they all are incredibly focused on helping their schools. Once again, columbia has some amazing attributes, but community and networking are not some of them.</p>
<p>
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I am just saying that just as Princeton or Dartmouth are much more connected and community oriented during college, this also translates to the real world as well.
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</p>
<p>I still don't see how you have any basis for concluding that, because Columbia isn't that community oriented / rah-rah / connected during college, Columbia's alums aren't focused on helping out their schools and fellow alums.</p>
<p>As the holder of both Columbia and Dartmouth degrees who has attended both undergraduate institutions, has had roommates from both undergraduate schools, and has many many friends at both schools - its an observation. If you want more proof look at both college giving rates, Dartmouth/ Princeton and community schools are much higher. This is comparable since both schools solicit donations actively. </p>
<p>I am not saying Columbia is bad in this area, its just worse than its peers.</p>
<p>As an alum from the seventies, who absolutely loved Columbia, I agree with most of the posts here. That is the feeling of Columbia. I'm active with the alumni group in my city, and it is fun, it is nothing like the alumni groups for other ivies like harvard, yale and dartmouth, even places like mt. holyoke. I think its part of the territory. Columbia doesn't baby its students, we learned through the hard knocks of life and experience. that is what i thought was so great about columbia. New york is part of the experience. In my life as a professional, its nice to meet a columbia alum, but there is very little community at columbia and while i might have a connection for that person, it 's nothing special. When Columbia alums meet me and find out that I'm also a columbia alum, again nothing special. When I asked some columbia alums to help try and convince my daughter to go there, they were very level headed, just giving the facts (just like in this thread), no great enthusiasm, just the realization that columbia is great for some (like me) and not the perfect place for others.</p>