<p>Guess you've got it all figured out then. lol.</p>
<p>You just need to chillax dude. Go drink a non-alcoholic beverage and listen to Cyndi Lauper.</p>
<p>You need to learn to be less stubborn and to accept advice/criticism when offered.</p>
<p>Umm buddy, you just told someone who is enrolled in a program that their program is a joke, and tried to give them advice on how to be better at their profession with no knowledge about it. Being here in this program is something I've dreamed about for three years now...and some choad tells me offhand it's a "joke" and I totally need to reshape my carefully laid plans I've built my life around.</p>
<p>In regards to the courses, I can accept criticism and be gracious about it without doing what people tell me to do. Yes I'm stubborn, but being stubborn doesn't automatically make me wrong. Especially when I'm talking to people who don't even know me.</p>
<p>I never said teaching was a joke.</p>
<p>I'm not ignorant of the profession. My mom was a teacher and has an MA in her subject area, and I know a number of other teachers fairly well. Two have master's degrees from UVA in academic subjects and one has a PhD from Penn. Maybe their ignorance has rubbed off on me?</p>
<p>jags, Virginia does not require a masters in education. For example, cavs mom has an MA in her discipline, but not an MA in Education. I'm sure her students learned quite a bit from her because she knew quite a bit herself.</p>
<p>I really don't care who you know. My dad knew someone who helped develop the atomic bomb but my dad doesn't know crap about science.</p>
<p>You said teachers should have content knowledge, and implied that getting an MT from UVA somehow precluded that. I responded to your erroneous implication that Curry graduates DO in fact have BOTH. You say I should just take some education courses on top of the content area courses I, of course, won't get in Curry's programs, and I say that I have to actually be in Curry's program first. Then you tell me my graduate work will unnecessarily cost me over $50,000? You've been wrong again and again, and you use other people's knowledge to compensate for that? What? Just admit you don't know jack about this.</p>
<p>Cav isn't referring to actual money you're shelling out, but the opportunity cost is about 40-50,000 for spending an extra year in Curry.</p>
<p>You mean...after not completing a state-approved teacher education program? I couldn't be fully licensed. I'd have to get a provisional license without being highly qualified, and once that ran out, THEN what? Why in the world would I choose to go into the field through a backdoor, taking courses while working full-time when I can just spend one semester finishing it all up for good then get a job to finish out the year when the semester is done?</p>
<p>A first year provisional teacher not enrolled in a state-approved program making $50k a year in VA would be a lucky bastard indeed.</p>
<p>Your unfocused and rather weak essay at making me look like a loud-mouthed ignoramus is rather flat. I'd advise you not to teach gifted classes.</p>
<p>The cost of an extra year in Curry and the value of your first year teacher's salary+bene's would be well over $50k - closer to $60k if you worked in NoVa.</p>
<p>All I know is I had two or three teachers who came in from their fields into teaching without having to go through Curry or wherever. Their training was all paid, which is thousands of more dollars saved, and ended up teaching the advanced courses (IB) courses at our school, thus getting paid even more money.</p>
<p>Actually, I remember a guy from NASA who taught IB Physics at our school. I highly doubt a scientist went through an education program.</p>
<p>I'm not trying to make you look like anything. You're just...wrong, and you can't stand it. You were wrong about Curry's programs, you're wrong about the weight of pedagogical knowledge, you were wrong about teacher salary, and you're wrong about me. Sorry if that makes you feel like a loud-mouthed ignoramus.</p>
<p>sv3a - I know, some of my friends are doing that. The only problem is that (for instance) Richmond City will pay for your education but you have to live and work in Richmond City for a period of...I think, no less than five years. I would rather pay an additional $6,000 out of pocket to NOT have to enter into a contractual obligation like that with a school district. There are alternative routes to licensure in VA, but TED programs are the easiest, most direct and effective route. For people who can afford them and have the time they are the best way to go.</p>
<p>No, no, no. You can teach without a master's degree. There marginal utility of education classes decreases sharply. I wasn't wrong about teacher's salaries, lol. I figure you'd start in the $35k-$40k range. I'm not wrong about you because I haven't said much about you. Jesus, quit arguing. I gave you the same suggestion that I would give my own sister. Sorry that it didn't mesh with your career plans.</p>
<p>Of course you can teach without a master's degree. It's becoming licensed WITHOUT one that can be a pain, because the easiest, most direct and efficient route is through a TED program which provides you with a master's as well as licensure upon completion. Your advice to me is to bypass this route for...what? For what purpose? I've got the money for it. I've got the time. Why in the world should I go out of my way to come in through the back door?</p>
<p>How am I the argumentative one when almost the first thing you said was that my degree is a "joke"? Where's the common sense and communication skills? You don't say something like that to another adult and then refer to them as being argumentative. Christ almighty, let's think before we type.</p>
<p>Oh, I'm getting it loud and clear. Believe me, there's not lack of comprehension from this end. I never said that the academic subject could only be studied and mastered at the exclusion of the pedagogical knowledge. What I've said several times is that the pedagogical knowledge becomes worthless at some point, while the academic knowledge continues to have value. I'd prefer that my teacher had an MA in an academic subject. But that's beside the point of what I originally said - that you could probably get a school system to pay for your MA. But I guess if it's going to be that dirt cheap, why not?</p>
<p>What would you have wanted your math teacher to learn that they could only get from an MA and not a BA? Your English teacher? History teacher? Art teacher? Music teacher? Foreign language teacher?</p>
<p>You're making the obvious statement that it's useless to have pedagogical knowledge without content knowledge. Who would ever claim otherwise? You're just stating the obvious. I say it's nearly useless to have content knowledge without pedagogical skills. It's great that you can do ridiculous equations, but without knowing how to teach a student you're a brilliant mathematician and a horrible teacher. You can't have a BA in pedagogy and an MA in content knowledge. You can only have a BA in content and a MA in pedagogy. What you propose (to get BA/MA in content) totally excludes learning how to actually teach. Sure you'll find people who happen to be skilled in both, but do you realize how rare they are? People try and career-switch into teaching all the time with no pedagogical knowledge (the NY City teaching fellows, for instance) and crash and burn.</p>
<p>I'm sorry, I'm just not seeing that UVA BA degrees in English, math, history, science, or what-have-you are lacking for the prek-12 environment. Maybe you can enlighten me? I'm honestly not seeing it.</p>