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<p>The people who let you in… or not.</p>
<p>who do hiring managers think they are that they can totally judge a person??</p>
<p>The people who offer you a job… or not. Get used to it.</p>
<p>This diagram may help you to understand why colleges are more willing to admit qualified URM students rather than qualified ORM students. It may also help you to understand why URM students are URM in the first place. <a href=“http://hphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net/hs046.snc3/13347_1078089291211_1795638120_155093_1363762_n.jpg[/url]”>http://hphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net/hs046.snc3/13347_1078089291211_1795638120_155093_1363762_n.jpg</a></p>
![http://hphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net/hs046.snc3/13347_1078089291211_1795638120_155093_1363762_n.jpg[/url]](http://hphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net/hs046.snc3/13347_1078089291211_1795638120_155093_1363762_n.jpg%5B/url%5D){kind=link}
<p>Brilliant cartoon, I agree 100%.
It’s not that we’re pushing ORMs down, we’re bringing up URMs. That’s not racism.</p>
<p>The cartoon is cute and clever but it clearly advances the notion that all white people are/were racist and that they all profited by oppressing black people. This notion of collective guilt is as pernicious as racism itself and–significantly–not entirely unrelated.</p>
<p>“We” ARE in fact bringing down ORMs by bringing up URMs.</p>
<p>^^^ Thats not true at all, if an ORM is truly qualified to attend a school like Harvard then they should succeed no matter where they go, plus they will definitely go to a great school.</p>
<p>As a URM who might benifit from AA when I apply to Columbia next year I can see how this can upset people. But if I get in I won’t believe its because of my skin color. I have good stats, EC’s, and other things that make me stand out as an applicant.</p>
<p>And realistically the greatest benefactors of AA over the last 50 years have been white women. You can’t blame AA on black students who make up less then 7% of the school populations of elite institutions for you not getting in. If every black person could go to Harvard then the school would be 70% black and not 7%. </p>
<p>AA is not perfect by any means but its purpose is to provide an even playing field. Some people want to say that its reverse racism against white people. AA really only hurts male Asians. Their applicant pool is the most competitive. White men still have the same competitiveness they had before which is obvious since they still make up the majority of elite college populations.</p>
<p>If there was no affirmative action, then a majority of students in the ivy league would be chinese or jewish. I, personally, prefer a more diverse environment on a college campus. Diversity is part of the college experience and the education. Education is achieved both in the class room and through your classmates. I love how the only thing people object to is the race affirmative action, when geography is a factor in admissions, too. In fact, depending on the year, whether or not you play the oboe may determine if you get into Harvard. Be better than the rest of the people applying and you will get in. To the starter of this thread: Chinese parents and children have a different academic mentality for the most part, which is why so many of them are very successful in high school and have the opportunity to be competitive in ivy applications. However, here’s the fact: You did not measure up to the standard of the other chinese students who applied. Compare yourself to the other chinese applicants, not the black applicants and you’ll understand why you did not get admitted. Deal with it.</p>
<p>^Exactly. Great points.</p>
<p>Let us say for a moment that we had affirmative action for people standing in line. So folks are waiting in line for hot concert or movie tickets or table reservations at a popular restaurant on a Saturday night. Now along comes a URM and gets moved up 20 spots in line simply by showing up. How often does this need to happen until the majority of the crowd gets upset? And how is this any less logical than giving URMs preference in college admissions?</p>
<p>That’s not really how AA works. They evaluate you based on your circumstances, most of the time.
I’m not gung ho in favor of AA. It has many problems. I just think that colleges are allowed to use AA, and if you don’t like that, don’t apply.</p>
<p>^^ Great analogy Lorem. Represents the precise issue at hand</p>
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<p>More like incorrect analogy.</p>
<p>Here’s a better one. Let’s say there is a hot restaurant people are waiting for. People have been randomly assigned blue or red tickets. Those with blue tickets are automatically pushed to the front of the line over those with red tickets. Those with blue tickets get into the restaurant and are eating while those with red tickets sit out forlornly in the cold. After the meal is finished, another group of blue tickets comes to wait in line. Those with red tickets have been waiting in the cold for hours and hours, the ones with blue tickets who have eaten feel bad and bump up those with red tickets to the front of the line where they should have been. The new group of blue tickets complains.</p>
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<p>There were folks 50-some years ago that said,“I just think that bus companies are allowed to use racial seating rules, and if you don’t like that, don’t ride the bus.”</p>
<p>And they didn’t ride the bus. They boycotted in large numbers so much so that the bus was forced to change it’s rules to allow them to sit where they wished.</p>
<p>So if you want to boycott Harvard and help the higher education bubble burst, you can LoremIpsum. It would actually be better for all of us.</p>
<p>And blacks didn’t ride the bus and the bus eventually desegregated. </p>
<p>If you don’t like AA don’t apply, use it as your form of protest. Lol.</p>
<p>Nil beat me to the punch.
That is has to be the stupidest anti- AA comment ever.</p>
<p>Alright, let me just throw my two cents into this blazing inferno. I fully support economic affirmative action and don’t believe in racial affirmative action BUT don’t believe it should be stopped. I went to Cal day today and about 85% of the students that I saw were asian or white. It’s doesn’t make it as exciting. It’s more interesting when see you people of all colors, races, etc. Also look at UCSD, which was on the point system, so no holistic, no racial AA factored in (only socioeconomic AA); UCSD has 1% african american students and 50% asian students!! (via collegeboard) Come on who wants a school with 1% african american unless you truly are racist…
edit: btw, harvard would admit student #2, but can you blame 'em, student #2 is more rare than student #1 as an earlier poster noted</p>
<p>Fact #1: AA simply doesn’t work.</p>
<p>Fact #2: There’s almost nothing we can do about it. Universities have the right to accept whatever students they think will further their own “mission”, whatever that mission is. Unless LoremIpsum convinces a sizable portion of ORMs to not apply to Harvard (impossible given Harvard’s prestige), nothing’s going to change.</p>
<p>Oh well. What can you do?</p>
<p>Candidate 1:
4.0 GPA
2350 SAT
13 AP classes (mostly 5s)
Ranked 1/550
Asian (Chinese)</p>
<p>Are you an Asian male or female?
You will be in the TOUGHEST POOL if you are an ASIAN MALE.
There are many 2350+ and 800 on every SAT IIs and 4.0 UWGPA IN THE POOL.</p>
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<p>Not applying solves nothing. What I suggest is that EVERYONE simply click on one of the Common App URM categories: there’s no defined standard, you could be 1/128th URM and legitimately check the box – how could anyone prove you’re not? If everyone suddenly became a URM, it would effectively neutralize the matter, and force a real public discussion. That would be civil disobedience at its finest.</p>