So I’m planning on majoring in Biology and being pre-law. I’ve received admission into
Michigan State (in state tuition)
Wayne State (full ride)
UIUC
UT Austin (Bio + Plan II honors)
Penn State
I’m waiting on
UMich (OOS)
Georgetown
Wake Forest
Emory
Which university should I attend? (list in order)
If you are going to be pre-law and law school or any graduate school is in your future you should avoid undergrad loans or keep undergrad loans to a minimum. Therefore in-state is your best option, especially with your being in-state resident of Michigan. Do you realize how fortunate you are to have such great in-state schools? Obviously Michigan is the best school in your state, and one of the best in the country at an unbeatable cost for in-staters. You will not get the same full college experience, interaction with peers and networking and opportunities for internships, research, grad schools and work at Wayne State as you would at Michigan or MSU. So if your parents can afford to send you to these two schools (and not jeapordize their ability to pay for college for any of your siblings) I think it’s an easy choice. However, if they have financial issues in paying in-state tuition and you don’t want to take loans, then full ride at Wayne State should be seriously considered. I know they have a good law school --see if they give preference to Wayne State undergrads. If you cannot get into Michigan (esp since you are in-state) then I don’t think you have a shot at getting accepted to Georgetown, Emory, Wake Forest or UT Austin. And since Michigan is better than each of those schools you can eliminate them anyway. As for MSU versus UIUC and Penn State, I don’t think it’s worth paying so much extra for out of state for UIUC and Penn State and you can get the same full college experience at MSU, which is just as good as both for biology or pre-law.
@trackmbe3 I don’t get in state at Umich but I do to any other school
Home state?
Also I’ve already received admission into UT Austin and I got into their plan 2 honors program which is the #3 honors program in the country. That also lets me choose which major I want to pursue so I’d probably do business at mccombs instead of Biology. The only thing is i’m not sure if Plan II is worth the money
also for MSU, if i go there, my parents are paying for all of it so i won’t have any student debt
@ClarinetDad16 I was in MI for the first half of high school but moved out of the country after so i get instate for all universities (public ofc) except U of M
Plan II Honors at UT is pretty special–what about the honors programs at your other choices? I would think you qualified if you were admitted to UT’s program.
Re “prestige” it is not always worth the money. There are about 20 names or less that open doors just by being on your resume, then a long list of “good school” schools where how much it matters really depends on region, program/major, or who you are talking to (and things like recognition from sports programs plays a role here). People on this forum waaayy overestimate the name recognition of some admittedly very good schools, but still schools that most people will have never heard of. Most LAC’s, for example, will be recognized by alumni of that school, alumni of peer schools, and people in the region–but that is it. You go to that LAC for the terrific education you may get in that learning environment, and not because an employer 1,000 miles away will have heard of the school.
The real issue when it comes to assessing the worth vs cost is the question of how much your student loan debt will be when you graduate. For that you have to know (1) an accurate number for your family contribution, (2) your family’s willingness/ability to meet that number, and (3) what your financial aid package looks like grants vs loans vs scholarships. Sticker price, assuming you are eligible for financial aid, is not a reliable barometer for this. Figure out what your likely aggregate student loan debt will be when you graduate, double it, and imagine that number divided into 120 or 360 monthly payments (i.e., 10- or 30-year payback of the debt). Then think about whether you intend for professional school (“graduate school” in an academic field is different because you should be able to obtain assistantships and the like for tuition or more–no one in their right mind pays for a graduate degree in Philosophy, Math, or other liberal art). If you go to professional graduate school (law, medicine, business), scholarships are FAR harder to come by and you will likely be relying heavily on loans. Then amortize THAT debt over 10- or 30-year payback in monthly payments. Again, if you go to graduate school IN Biology or the equivalent, you should have the opportunity to pursue a MA or PhD tuition free, so do not get obsessed about that expense.
Student loan debt for undergrad plus professional school can easily be equal to or more than what the mortgage would be on a first (or even move-up) house, and therefore makes starting your life and a family more difficult. I know far, far too many people who borrowed $100k for their undergrad degree from a private or OOS state school that was good, but not “wow” good, then another $100-150k for a similar law degree, then proceeded to be miserable and complain about how they could not afford a house, or could not afford to take the dream jobs (public interest versus large law firm lawyer), whatever.
All that being said, going to the cheapest college you can, one where everyone blinks and thinks of the loser they went to high school with who went to the same college, is not a good choice if you have better options because of your academic achievement.
Georgetown and Michigan would be top schools with respect to your law school ambitions:
https://www.■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/blog/top-lawyer-producer-schools-infographic/
This site glances at biology programs, and includes schools such as Wake Forest and Emory:
http://www.■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/lists/list/colleges-to-consider-if-you-want-to-study-biology/117/
@BooBooBear In terms of costs, my parents are paying half of my fees no matter what they are. I’m really really interested in Plan II. If I go to MSU i’d be at the honors college. I was wondering whether plan II was worth paying OOS for? How good is it compared to other schools?
@merc81 thank you for your input! unfortunately all 4 of these schools are the only ones I’m yet to hear back from. Hopefully I can include these in my options soon, fingers crossed!
Are you planning some sort of bio-related law career? Since that major will put you in the environs of a lot of REALLY grade-competitive pre-med students.
@renwa my understanding is that after 1 year at UT Austin, you are able to establish residency and pay in state tuition for your remaining years. Look into that because it could save you 90k over 3 years.
UT is a fantastic school and the Plan II program is supposed to be top notch. I have friends who have passed up Ivy League schools to participate in UT plan II.
Where do you live now? Do you have residency in that state?
Could you elaborate on Plan II letting you pick whichever major you want?
@Jpgranier So from what I’ve heard, once you get into Plan II, you’re pretty much able to gain entry into any major + honors college. I’ve already been accepted to Biology but since I’m pre-law and my major doesn’t have to be STEM I was thinking I could be in the Business honors program as some recruiters specifically ask for BHP students and it gives me an advantage. I moved out of Michigan 2 years ago but I have In state for all schools except UMich.
I didn’t realize people gave up ivies for this program, that’s really cool. I’m worried about managing a job (which i’ll have to do to get residency) and schoolwork at the same time. If I get instate my 2nd year though i would only have a debt of 30,000$ bc my parents would cover the rest which would be a manageable amount for me
@Trisherella i’m not planning a bio related law career but I’ve heard a STEM degree is VERY helpful in law school (something to do w writing patent law). I love biology and have published papers and I’ve done research at labs and I know some computational biology so I would love the competition i think
@renwa you should double check on that information.
Switching majors at UT is a very difficult process when transferring to majors such as business, engineering, and computer science.
You will have to apply to BHP, which is EXTREMELY difficult to get into.
I find it very hard to believe by just being in the Plan II honors you’ll be able to join any major or honors program you like.
Perhaps you heard that if you’re qualified enough as an incoming freshman to be accepted into Plan II, almost no major or honors program would reject you as a freshman applicant?
I believe the job would only have to be 20 hours a week, and there are many jobs on campus where you can sit and study while at work.
@Jpgranier I actually called the office (plan II) and they said that it’s not too hard to add on any major. The guy i was speaking to said he was about to add on business to his major and it’d only take him an extra semester of college.
unfortunately it has to be an off campus job
@renwa did he say it’s not hard to change your major or not hard to manage two majors at once. Transferring from biology to business would be based on GPA after one year, and the average transfer was a 3.8 GPA. A 3.8 at a top university like UT isn’t comparable to high school.
If you want to major in Bio then Emory should definitely be your top choice. If you get accepted at Emory then just forget about other schools cuz Emory’s bio program is by far the best on your list(Top Five Bio program in the country). But the admission process for Emory is super competitive. I would suggest you to consider U Mich as a backup in case you don’t get into Emory they have a good bio program too but not nearly as good as Emory’s tho.
studying bio at Wake Forest??? U will regret that for the rest of your life