<p>CalMtMom, I agree that success should not, and cannot, be measured by Broadway credits alone. This is particularly true of those like the very talented young woman of whom you speak. I have known her, her mom, and her incredible family, for many years. She is another whose experience has been similar to that of Anthony. She has worked steadily for 15+ years since graduating from college in the world of theatre, and like most who find such continued and sustained success, has worked hard at creating much of her own success, through her own performances at singing gigs in NYC, through her own personal show which she wrote and starred in, through the theatre company which is so close to her heart, in addition to her performances onstage in national tours, off-Broadway, and on Broadway.</p>
<p>Alwaysamom—Her Family is indeed remarkable to be sure. And she is very, very talented with a big heart (takes after her mom, I suspect) Hard work cannot be understated here. In all cases of people “making it” that are posted on this forum, these are people who are driven, focused and who constantly work at creating opportunities for themselves. It is wonderful to have education and training from fine colleges and universities (In her case Yale) but the real work comes from the individual who works to develop craft, to make connections with other artists, who is somewhat relentless in the pursuit of the next gig.
Lists of people’s names from schools are all well and good, but frankly, in the long run it is the person pursuing the education and training more than the school that makes the difference in ultimate success. This is why it is so important for students looking at this forum to think in terms of what they are looking for in their college experience rather than a ‘reputation’ of a school. My humble opinion :)</p>
<p>You both bring up a good point about creating opportunities for oneself. This is something my own daughter is very much into. She doesn’t merely audition hoping to be cast in something, and in fact, has done very little of that as she is constantly involved in a show or project. She is into creating one’s own opportunities and she’s been doing that a lot since graduation. Each time she has created something, a show, a concert, etc, it has led to another opportunity. She doesn’t wait for jobs to come to her (though some have!) but often creates her own jobs and performance opportunities. I agree that it takes drive, initiative, hard work, etc. and making connections with other artists. As well, in NYC, people see your work and offers can fall in your lap when they like what they see. She has found that each time she creates something for herself, it leads to something else.</p>
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<p>I’m glad this was mentioned. I worked in theatre LONG ago, and the next job virtually always came from the prior job rather than from an audition. By the time auditions started, the directors had invited at least one actor for every leading role, and 99% of the time would cast those roles from the folks they had invited. Is that still the case at most professional theatres?</p>
<p>Sometimes I get on this website and feel like I am dealing with my kids. Not listening to what you are saying by moving off point and changing the direction of the discussion. I am not trying to debate Anthony ‘s brilliant career path, successes, personal wealth or resume only a very poignant exchange 12 years ago. Nor is it about his career taking turns into off Broadway, national tours, movies, commercials, TV, radio or any other it still boils down to my original post. He felt sad about not knowing when he will be back on Broadway and he was correct.</p>
<p>I think a lot of people think Broadway is the measuring stick for musical theater success. Success is something that is difficult to define because everyone looks at things differently. People have said on this website that they measure success by being on Broadway, or a national tour, getting their AEA card, writing or directing, managing or casting or even being personally fulfilled working in local theater shows in church basements.</p>
<p>Does a baseball player want to play in the major leagues? Does a basketball player want to play in the NBA? Does a hockey player want to play in the NHL? Does a football player want to play in the NFL? Now the fact that you never made it passed, AA baseball, CBA basketball, WHL hockey, or WFL in football mean you are a failure, of course not. You probably were able to still follow your dream as a professional athlete for many years. You gave it your best shot and that should be enough.</p>
<p>But, if you do make it all the way to Broadway, MLB, NBA, NHL or the NFL, you have indeed climbed to the top of the mountain. You are among the best of the best. I can definitely see where Broadway is a litmus test for MT.</p>
<p>Broadway is surely the “top” echelon of MT. I can’t imagine anyone denying that. </p>
<p>But I don’t think the analogies with the NHL, NFL, NBA, or MLB are quite the same. </p>
<p>In acting, it is not all a linear progression. For example, a child can be on Broadway and hasn’t done much prior to Broadway and then never be on Broadway again. An adult actor also can be on Broadway for six months and never again. An actor can be on Broadway and then Off Broadway, a National Tour, a MT Festival, etc., and still be working professionally in the field. But with a major league baseball, football, hockey or basketball player, first they must work their way up to the major leagues…by being on a college team, then a minor league team (sometimes) and then the majors. But after they leave the major league, typically their professional career in the sport as a player ends. With Broadway, you can be in a Broadway show (and skip many steps to get there) and after being in the Broadway show, you can perform in many other venues, perhaps return to Broadway again or not, but continue working as a professional actor. Not so with professional sports. </p>
<p>In my opinion, while Broadway would be a great place to get to perform if possible, I’d rather see a MT performer who worked solidly in a professional realm for years and years than one who had one turn on Broadway for a year and never got to work professionally on stage after that. Making it on Broadway is a huge achievement, but if someone craves a career in MT and the stage, getting to work consistently as a professional performer than a one shot deal on the Great White Way might be more satisfying as they get to do it for a long time. If you are really passionate about MT, the thrill of Broadway is great but is usually short lived, whereas a career consistently working on stage seems like long term success. </p>
<p>I believe in reaching high and dreaming big. But I also believe that having a goal “to be on Broadway” is very limiting and very low odds, whereas setting some realistic (yet high) expectations of becoming a professional and continually working MT actor is hard to achieve, but at least a more realistic outlook. If success in this field is defined solely as making it on Broadway, there are gonna be lots and lots of unsuccessful people. I happen to think that those who are appearing Off Broadway, on tours, in new works, in other venues, are pretty darn successful in this field, if they work consistently. Even that is hard to achieve in this field. Each job in theater is rather short and you can go from a summer stock show, to a Broadway show, to a tour, to a regional theater show, to an Off Broadway show, back to Broadway, then back to a regional theater, and so on in this field, which is not quite the same linear trajectory of a professional athlete.</p>
<p>As far as a “litmus test for MT,” I’d be more impressed if a BFA in MT program could list a large percentage of graduates who are working actors than a program that has one or two Broadway actors who are alum and not many other graduates working professionally on stage.</p>
<p>I am hard pressed to find any profession analogous to acting, where job placement and security is out of the individual’s control. Writers can work for newspapers, advertising companies, magazines, etc, and can even self-publish books and blogs. Artists can work on staff at the same. Sports teams, as noted above, join teams (at whatever level) and have an ongoing job. </p>
<p>Actors, if they want sustained work, have to do something else, related, perhaps, but something different, like teaching. There are some repertoire companies, I suppose, where people have sustained gigs, but I think of these, frankly, more as comedy troupes (eg., improv companies); and even if an actor is part of a production company, I doubt they’re cast in every show. An actor might be in a long-running show, but that’s it. </p>
<p>I’m sure for every actor who lands on Broadway at least once in his/her career, there is another actor somewhere equally talented – or perhaps more so-- who never will, either by choice or by fortune / timing.</p>
<p>(I wrote this post with all actors in mind, not just MT, where certainly the above applies even more. I suppose a regular job for an MT performer would be Disneyworld or a cruise line.)</p>
<p>As you say SDonCC, if an actor is lucky enough to perform in one of the very long running shows on Broadway there is an extremely good chance he/she can stay there for the run of the show should he/she desire and stay in shape to continue to perform their role. I have a good friend where that is exactly what happened to her (and quite a few others in the cast). She had done some very big Bwy shows, stopped to have a kid, and then landed this lead role shortly after giving birth. It was perfect for her as she could take her child with her for rehearsals and shows most days. Once school started only Wednesday was a conflict and many friends in the neighborhood were happy to have an extended playdate until the dad came home. She worked on that show for about 12 years because it was the best situation for her family. Some think she ruined her career as she was no longer in high demand having entered her 40s by the time she left but she was able to balance what she personally needed.</p>
<p>Her child is in college now and she is one of the most popular cabaret performers around; she travels the world performing to sold out audiences and performs benefits with some of the most well-known names in the business. She wouldn’t have it any other way. </p>
<p>There are also those who land in a long running television show (soap operas used to be the “gold standard” of lifetime employment for an actor) and are employed for many years.</p>
<p>So even in this business there are some who are able to sustain their positions with a little bit of luck. I agree that for most it doesn’t go this way but it is a real possibility.</p>
<p>SDonCC, some theaters actually have a resident acting company such as Oregon Shakespeare Festival. </p>
<p>But of course, this isn’t Broadway which apparently some consider a litmus test. </p>
<p>In any case, even for those who do get on Broadway, the stints are not that long and they may go from that to either not being a working actor or to another theater venue, and maybe back to Broadway and maybe not.</p>
<p>SoosieVT. I agree your last couple of posts but I will point out that in professional sports particularly baseball and hockey, players do go up and down from the major leagues (Broadway) to the minor leagues (all other). Any many. if not most athletes can have long careers in the minors, then go on to coaching or instruction. Just watch Bull Durham. I think the comparison is closer than you think.</p>
<p>Spring Awakening came on a national tour to my college, and interestingly enough, a good portion of the cast came either from Boston Conservatory, CAP21, or Elon. There were definitely other schools in there, but those three were repeated several times on the program.</p>
<p>Now that the Tony nominations are out, I’ve decided to compile this list. (Essentially, my friends and I were interested in who actually gets to play supporting/leading roles on Broadway. Sure, places like CCM/CMU/Michigan/NYU probably has a huge list of performers currently on Broadway. But it doesn’t hurt to provide this list either.)</p>
<p>Best Performance by an Actor in a Leading Role in a Play
Brian Bedford, The Importance of Being Earnest -** Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts**
Bobby Cannavale, The Motherf**ker with the Hat - No training
Joe Mantello, The Normal Heart - **North Carolina School of the Arts **
Al Pacino, The Merchant of Venice - The Actors’ Studio
Mark Rylance, Jerusalem - Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts</p>
<p>Best Performance by an Actress in a Leading Role in a Play
Nina Arianda, Born Yesterday - **New York University<a href=“MFA”>/B</a>
Frances McDormand, Good People - **Yale University<a href=“MFA”>/B</a>
Lily Rabe, The Merchant of Venice - Northwestern University
Vanessa Redgrave, Driving Miss Daisy - Central School of Speech and Drama
Hannah Yelland, Brief Encounter - University of Cambridge</p>
<p>Best Performance by an Actor in a Leading Role in a Musical
Norbert Leo Butz, Catch Me If You Can - Webster<a href=“BFA”>/B</a>, University of Alabama<a href=“MFA”>/B</a>
Josh Gad, The Book of Mormon - Carnegie Mellon University
Joshua Henry, The Scottsboro Boys - University of Miami
Andrew Rannells, The Book of Mormon - No Training
Tony Sheldon, Priscilla Queen of the Desert - No training</p>
<p>Best Performance by an Actress in a Leading Role in a Musical
Sutton Foster, Anything Goes - Carnegie Mellon University
Beth Leavel, Baby It’s You! - **University of North Carolina at Greensboro <a href=“MFA”>/B</a>
Patina Miller, Sister Act - Carnegie Mellon University **
Donna Murphy, The People in the Picture - New York University<a href=“BFA”>/B</a>, Lee Strasberg Theatre Institute</p>
<p>Best Performance by an Actor in a Featured Role in a Play
Mackenzie Crook, Jerusalem -** No training**
Billy Crudup, Arcadia - UNC at Chapel Hill<a href=“BA”>/B</a>, New York University<a href=“MFA”>/B</a>
John Benjamin Hickey, The Normal Heart - Unknown
Arian Moayed, Bengal Tiger at the Baghdad Zoo - Indiana University
Yul V</p>
<p>Of course not every bio lists someone’s college degree, but I had noticed that Book of Mormon which garnered the most nominations today for Tonys, has a bunch of CMU and NYU grads (whereas often I notice a smattering of more schools in a cast). </p>
<p>Of this cast…</p>
<p>From CMU:
Josh Gad
Rory O’Malley
Tommar Wilson</p>
<p>From NYU:
Nikki James
Jared Gertner
Nick Spangler
Asmeret Ghebremichael</p>
<p>Other schools represented in the cast include Hartt, Webster, University of Miami, BOCO, Yale (2), Harvard, CCM (2), Temple, and Wagner.</p>
<p>Shout out to Forrest McClendon from The Scottsboro Boys! D had the privilege to work with him at Temple and many of her MT friends study voice with him in Philly!</p>
<p>Do you all think that Carnegie Mellon can take credit for Sutton Foster? :0) I think that I read somewhere that she only went to school there for a year.</p>
<p>I believe Sutton only attended CMU for one year. But hey, a college can opt to say so and so attended (because they did) and not claim the person graduated. So, the statement is true, even though the person may not have trained there very long. </p>
<p>For those who don’t know, Sutton is now on the faculty of NYU/Tisch’s MT program at New Studio on Broadway.</p>
<p>kksmom, your question brings up another point. Obviously a college trains and educates a student (let’s hope so for what it costs, LOL). But let’s face it, at tippy top highly selective programs, those who enter typically are very talented to begin with. They obviously hone their craft in college. But it is kind of a no brainer when there is a significant percentage of graduates of certain programs who are successful professionally in the field because there is a very high concentration of talent from day one in those programs. One can become successful no matter which college or program they attend! But it is only natural, for example, to find a higher percentage of leaders, doctors, those who eventually obtain a PhD, etc. coming out of Harvard than say, Slippery Rock State College. There will be some coming out of the latter who go onto very selective fields and grad schools and become professionals and so on, but there tends to be a more concentrated group of such high achiever types at the former. So, I don’t know that we can give the colleges all the credit for the success of their graduates when they self selected a slew of very talented high achiever types to matriculate in a HIGHLY selective admissions process.</p>
<p>To clarify I am not saying one college program is better than another, but rather that some programs start out with a freshmen class that is heavily concentrated with stand out talent. In such cases, one might expect there to be a higher percentage of those who fare well after graduation because these students were so strong as a group when they were selected at the point of admission.</p>
<p>As an example, when my daughter spent 8 summers at a theater camp with kids from all over the country and outside the country, there were certain kids who were stand outs. I observed over the years that these stand out kids landed at the most competitive MT and Acting programs. And of the young people we know from the camp who have met with a lot of success after college, such as Broadway and the like, these were the kids who were stand outs in their youth before they ever went to college. It is not surprising to see that these were kids who “made it.” Not sure the colleges can take ALL the credit. :D</p>
<p>Thank you for that observation, soozie. The flip side of that truth means that students who for reasons outside of the MT consideration (geographical, financial, etc) who end up at one of the lesser known colleges which are not frequently seen on those playbills, does not need to assume that their education and training would be inferior or that attendance there would hinder odds of being successful after graduation. (especially when careful research and an excellent regional reputation both indicate a very solid program - but, not one that is well known and that these exceptional students are going to self select) </p>
<p>I mean, those are clearly excellent schools, but they aren’t taking schlubs and turning them into the next Sutton Foster. Those kids who end up in those programs clearly have not only the talent in the first place, but also the drive to get into those hard to get into programs in the first place. So they have a big part of what it takes for success before they even went anywhere.</p>