Which Ivy League is the best for Christians?

College Search & Selection
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<p>I love how the OP just wanted to know which Ivy (s)he would feel most comfortable at as a Christian and now it’s battle of Christ VRS Science. </p>

<p>Whistle Pig what are your feelings on Steven Hawking and his opinion of heaven/God/religion in general?</p>

<p>My Conservative Gay Catholic Friend is going to Princeton this year (:
I don’t get it either, visit the churches by each school and see which one you like the most. All of those schools will have people who are believe the same thing/different thing/don’t care.</p>

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You kept referring specifically to Jesus, so I wondered why, if He hadn’t specifically said so.</p>

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Einstein’s religious views aside (I believe he was a Jew, no?), merely saying that God created the Universe and Man do not preclude Him doing it through the means of the physical laws He created, no?</p>

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Evolution occurs over millions of years, I’m afraid, not in your lifetime (well, aside from minor alterations in finches and the like).</p>

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Well, all of them teach legitimate science, and so that was apparently a point of contention for someone who believes in an Earth made in 4004 BC. Also, it’s not “Christ vs Science,” it’s “Myth vs Science.” Christ has nothing to do with it, and can be believed in regardless of how old one thinks the Earth is.</p>

<p>But I do tire of arguing with intense ignorance.</p>

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<p>But this book I’m holding written by a few people edited by a bunch of people way after it was says that Christ is real so you’re wrong.</p>

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<p>RIGHT! Definitely men, writing on behalf of Another. </p>

<p>The great news? The Author (not his scribes) gave us all freedom ot believe it or not. The bad news? As has been vividly illustrated, many have assumed the freedom to “not.” </p>

<p>Certainly I nor any other earthly-evolved lump of humanity can transform one’s heart. Merely call out the culture when it rears its ugly head. For the bottom line is simply this. We are all sinners. Jesus came, died, arose, and ascended that we MIGHT be saved from the wrath of a loving but just Creator. There is but one, narrow, elitist way to being saved, i.e. confessing one’s errant ways (according to God’s rules, not ours) and inviting Jesus into our very being. </p>

<p>Where all this gets messed up is by our pride, our determination and belief that somehow this need not be explained but all the rest of God’s instruction must be either by science or as myth. And some fail to grasp that that is not only sin, but it’s original. </p>

<p>Trust me, I know sin plenty well. I’m an expert, lifetime perpetrator. Guilty as hell, literally. Whose sentence has been commuted, paid in full. And I’m working at not perpetuating that perpetration which got me convicted to begin with. But no need to shoot the messenger, Eddie. Like me, you and each one of us, is totally free to buy it all, buy none of it, or as some reveal here and in our world, prefer inventing our own brand, and labeling it Christianity. Precisely what the Mormons, the news media in describing the killer from Norway, Jim Jones, and a whole bunch of others have attempted, realizing like Hunt’s in watching Heinz, that catsup and ketchup look alike, sound alike, but as real 57 lovers know, are not at all alike. It’s clever marketing but a lie created by liars. Like you and like me. Stealing a great notion by thiefs. Like you and like me. Coveting what they have and we want. Like you and like me. Get the idea, fellow-sinner? Btw, the #2 among the top 10 list of God’s no-no’s? Idolizing another before Him. Nothing scientific about any of this, is there? Except maybe that #2 now …</p>

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<p>None of the Ivies has a religious mission. Very few of the US News top 100 colleges and universities in America have a religious mission. The primary mission of these schools is to discover and transmit knowledge. </p>

<p>Would you choose a car mechanic based on whether Christ is central to the spirit, vision, purpose, and programs of his garage? I doubt it. You probably expect your car mechanic to focus on fixing cars, not saving souls. Does that expectation imply a rabid attempt to eliminate His presence from the shop?</p>

<p>Of course, college is a little different from an garage. It’s a community. A good college community does make services available to support physical, mental and spiritual health. You can investigate the quality of those services by asking specific questions here and by visiting the school. Just be aware that, at modern, secular colleges and universities, those services are mostly incidental to the institutional mission. </p>

<p>If you believe that Christ should be central to the spirit, vision, purpose, and programs of your school, then don’t choose a secular school.</p>

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<p>I agree. The original question is sort of like wondering which is the best way to execute someone? Firing squad, gas chamber, old sparky, crucifiction, etc.?</p>

<p>God is everywhere. Every Ivy was originally established as a religious institution. All have wandered far from that. Most are no doubt expert in studying and analyzing religion and total flops in terms of overtly nurturing and complying with the Great Commission. It’s safe saying most would overtly oppose spreading the Gospel. But the profs can and do pick it to pieces. Vultures stripping the bones. But do not mistake not selling Christianity to imply or infer that these institutions are not in the business of proselytizing and persuading, all in the disguise of “discovering and transmitting knowledge.” That latter phrase makes it all sound so enlightening and high-minded, doesn’t it?</p>

<p>While a bit of a divergence, Tim Groseclose sp?, UCLA professor confessed in discussing his highly acclaimed book “Left Turn” based on his study of the left-leaning main-stream media, the only way he’d ever pursue such a study is “with tenure.” The good news is that he was offered positions at Harvard and Yale, notably “inspite” of the study. It’s no diff with Jesus. Anyone promoting him as Him at an Ivy … you can bet all you have and all you can borrow, she is tenured.</p>

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<p>Historically, those schools didn’t simply wander away from a religious mission. They each made conscious decisions to become secular institutions.</p>

<p>Separating scholarship from overt, deliberate proselytizing is as characteristic a concept for most modern universities as the separation of church and state is to modern democratic governments. It distinguishes liberalism (in the classic sense) from both totalitarianism and religious fundamentalism. Classic liberalism means being free to fix a meal, take a bath, go on a date, discuss a poem, or calculate the age of the earth without having to appeal to Marx or Jesus as the final authority.</p>

<p>If you bring your car to me and say the devil is making noises under the hood, and I try to show you that no, you simply have a loose fan belt, am I proselytizing? If you tell me you “have faith” I can fix your car, and I then launch into a tirade against religious faith, I’m being very rude. That may make me an anti-religious bigot … but my bad behavior doesn’t invalidate the use of scientific procedures to diagnose your car trouble.</p>

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<p>The Ivies are very liberal & have offended many if you are one to watch all the profs’ tactics. Too many old intolerant professors who think their view is the only view. Don’t for a minute think that a renowned institution is going to act ethically. Ever since Bush’s 2nd term, there has been in the mainstream media stories on students whose test scores & grades & papers were screwed around with. There were stories of conservative media people who gave talks on campus who ended up with pies in their faces. There were occasions where mention of a Christian symbol or word was frowned upon because it was not sympathetic to those of the Islamic faith. There was even a well-known Catholic school that welcomed a politician who was pro-abortion. You take your chances these days.</p>

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<p>Much accuracy in your observations, sadly, Cordie. Anyone doubting your comments might do well to hear Chuck Colson’s testimony of his episode in being asked to speak at his alma mater, Brown. Not a pretty scene either before, during, or after beyond him coming to the sad realization that his beliefs and values since coming to Christ were not only inconsistent with those of Brown, but almost 180 degrees. This from a man who acknowledged a lifetime of major giving to his school, even when he was incarcerated. He discusses this in his tape lectures @ Harvard entitled … “Why You Can’t Teach Ethics @ Harvard Business School.” He does Breakpoint too … on line. Check it out. He is a brilliant sinner. He has no illusions about the Ivies … any one of them … being a “great place” for followers of Christ. Although there are many.</p>

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This, I suppose, was Obama–the President of the United States–speaking at Notre Dame. He didn’t speak about abortion (of course) and despite some breast-beating, it was a non-event.</p>

<p>This is an example of the hyperbole with respect to Christianity and conservatism at the Ivies. Yes, they are liberal schools with lots of people who don’t share Christian beliefs. But there are vibrant Christian communities at all of them, and any Christian who is not a weakling can thrive there. I don’t fault anybody who wants a different kind of educational setting, but I do get tired of the silly statements I sometimes read here.</p>

<p>Correction: Obama did talk about abortion. Here’s the text of the speech: <a href=“HuffPost - Breaking News, U.S. and World News | HuffPost”>HuffPost - Breaking News, U.S. and World News | HuffPost;

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<p>And I think we’ve just read one. </p>

<p>Trying to make a collective case for this collection of extremely secularized institutions (and notably within the context of a “Christian Colleges” forum) on the basis that there are “vibrant Christian communities at all of them”, beyond what Jesus himself told us (salt & light, city on a hill, light under the basket, when 2 or more gather in My Name, Matthew 14:24, and on and on …duh. And didn’t Jesus proclaim the Truth of Christianity … in the synagogue?! ), is like saying, “The Japanese didn’t sink ALL our ships or kill all our sailors @ Pearl Harbor. Besides those, it woulda been a great place to serve! Sunshine! Great beaches! Lots of opportunity for fast advancement, especially that following Monday.”</p>

<p>Anecdotes are nice in their place. This one, which is about as broad-brushing and patronizing as could be attempting to portray the obvious while implicitly trying to defend the indefensible, would seem to perfectly illustrate your comment about “silly statements.”</p>

<p>You might want to continue the hunt for justifying your idea about Cornell being a bastion of bursting Christianity. Or any of the others.</p>

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<p>WP, I am constantly amazed at your perspective, though I shouldn’t be because I’ve encountered it from many sources. You have taken on faith that one viewpoint is correct and indisputable, which is your right. But IMO, you fail to realize that embracing an answer before considering all the available evidence is fundamentally at odds with a higher education. The secular schools that you criticize as backsliders have determined than the appropriate methodology for for education is to examine evidence, then come to conclusions - not the other way around. Though that may be contrary to the methodology of most religions, it’s not a matter of proselytizing and persuading - it’s just acknowledging the approach that’s appropriate for educational inquiry rather than religious faith.</p>

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<p>Whistle Pig, my statement about Christian communities at Ivy League schools is based on knowledge. People can take it or leave it.</p>

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<p>I was just going to venture on this thread to mention that my son found his first Mass at Yale to be a welcoming experience. </p>

<p>But I also want to respond to bandgeek1</p>

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<p>Because my son’s conservative gay Methodist friend is going to Messiah. I wonder which of them will find a more welcoming environment.</p>

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<p>None doubts your statement. It’s your implied tangent and conclusion that are off base and potentially misleading, again, within the context of the thread and topic. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, as anyone watching the culture and reading Scripture knows … and understands … knowledge is not the magic bullet. Heck, Satan knows clearly who Jesus is. Einstein “knew” more than any living human being, but if failure to believe is a ticket to hell, then he might have been on that midnight train. Time’ll tell about that, won’t it.</p>

<p>Preference to understanding, wisdom.</p>

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<p>Knowledge is better than nonsense, or empty rhetoric.
The topic of this thread was, “What is the best Ivy for Christians?” My answer is: any of them can be an excellent environment for a Christian, as long as he or she is willing to seek out a community of other Christians–and there are multiple choices on each campus.</p>

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<p>And did your “they all have great groups” response contribute to that? No. Perhaps “empty rhetoric” trying to make a case that is both obvious and in your words, silly and nonsense. But let’s stick to the point. </p>

<p>You’ve clarified your point here. I’ve known vibrant house churches in China. I’m confident both you and I, and serious Believers will grasp our discussion and its differences. Maybe it boils down to whether one wants to be a frontier lone range missionary or among the greater campus community where Christian values, relationships are more overt, pervasive, and even central to learning about God’s world.</p>

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<p>But again, why resort to absurd hyperbole? Christians at the Ivy schools are not “frontier lone range missionaries” by any means. You presumably don’t like it when people refer to Christian schools as closed, cramped environments where indoctrination replaces actual education.</p>

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<p>the school doesn’t matter. neither does it matter how conservative/liberal it is. just be respectful of others, don’t try to convert, and it shouldn’t be a problem. their are prejudice people, but they’re everywhere, not concentrated at one school</p>

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<p>If Christians want to be persuasive, the wisest thing they can do is to live their ideals, not spew them in a hostile and superior manner. A decent and kind manner can be amazingly persuasive.</p>