<p>I'm not a white male and I'm not going to Penn, but I just wanted to fill you all in. A friend (actually a friend of a friend), who is a white male, was in the top 10% of his class, had average or slightly above average EC's, and high 1200 to low 1300 SAT scores (on a 1600 scale), and I don't know what he got on his SAT II's. I was completely perplexed when I heard this news too, but he applied to Penn 3 years ago and he got accepted. I'm not sure why either, but I asked my friend. He didn't know for sure, but he believes that it was the essays and the passion he showed from his application. I'm not saying this will happen to everyone in a similar situation, but don't let anyone discourage you from applying to a school that you believe you are not qualified for. Obviously, his stats were under the 50% average, he was not an URM, and he did not have any particular hook. I'm too am curious of how he accomplished it, but in a sense, it is still inspirational. Any thoughts, comments, or questions are welcome- also any similar experiences.</p>
<p>There are always stories about underqualified students getting into top schools. I wouldn't put my faith in them, though. They were very, very, very lucky.</p>
<p>^ did he, by any chance, live in the Phila. area?</p>
<p>Yes, he lived in the Philadelphia area (the suburbs). Yes, he was definitely very lucky- but there must have been something about his application that was absolutely astounding. I have no idea what it was.</p>
<p>philly kids get a huge break</p>
<p>top high schools in philly send scores of students to upenn each year</p>
<p>Kids who attend a public school in the Philly area have a MUCH higher chance of getting into Penn. Don't be surprised.</p>
<p>Low 1300 + Phila. Area school + good GPA, ECs, recs + ED = decent chance</p>
<p>What do you guys consider a decent chance? Each year, our school sends about 5 kids to Penn, and I didn't figure that to be a lot (out of an average of 600 in the graduating class). Why do kids in Philly have an easier chance?</p>
<p>I also found this on collegeboard's website (about Penn):</p>
<p>Very important admission factors:
Character/Personal Qualities
Essay
Recommendations
Secondary School Record </p>
<p>*Important admission factors: *
Extracurricular Activities
Standardized Test Scores </p>
<p>*Considered: *
Alumni/AE Relation
Class Rank
Geographical Residence
Interview
Minority Status
Talent/Ability
Volunteer Work
Work Experience</p>
<p>It looks like test scores are in the same category as EC's- does this mean that they are looked at the same way? Does this mean that each applicant needs distinguishing EC's if it is weighted the same as SAT scores? I am not applying to Penn ED, but I'm thinking about applying RD. I have similar stats as the friend described, except I am Asian. I'm not too concerned about my chances of getting in (since it isn't my first choice).</p>
<p>Also, do other prestigious colleges work similarly?- giving a slight advantage to students in the particular area, etc.?</p>
<p>how about the chances of a kid with 2300 out of 2400 SATs (1520 out of 1600 ) who lives in northern NJ suburbs? about the same as the kid from philadelphia with a 1300? this of course is assuming all other factors are equivalent.. e/c's essays etc etc.</p>
<p>Colleges always give certain benefits to local students. For example, Yale always likes to take in a few New Haven kids. Actually, from the College Board website, it looks like Penn looks at the entire applicant and moreso, on the actual personality of the applicant than the academic qualifications of that applicant. That's very reassuring.</p>
<p>i dont know if you're being sarcastic cryptic.. it seems like every college's site <em>claims</em> to take such factors into consideration moreso than GPA and SATs and such. call me a cynic, but i dont know, a lot of times that just seems like a load of garbage to me. unless there's somethign truly extraordinary about an applicant, i bet they first look at a student's scores and grades before anything else. the essays and e/c's just act as a means of ensuring that a kid isnt a complete dweeb and actually has some direction.</p>
<p>You're right med, they all say how little scores matter but when you disect it, it's BS. Every good college has had improved scores every years for many years. Scattergrams show the high scorers getting in and the low scorers not. It's all about rankings, and I suppose the app money isn't bad!!!</p>
<p>What's so sarcastic about my post? I was being sincere. Anyhow, I think a lot of colleges do care who they're admitting and certain things can override GPA and SAT's. I mean, you need the academic qualifications first but then it all comes down to who you are at the top colleges. </p>
<p>And med, you would certainly have better chances than the other applicant if all things are equal. But the kid with the 1300 can still be a competative applicant with a great essay, good recommendations, and a sincere personal statement.</p>
<p>scores may matter in general but we had a legacy from ct get in rd to penn with a high 1200 (his gpa wasn't even that great...just a nice avg kid).... i definitely think that as adcoms are looking at individual candidates improving their avg sat is not at the top of things to consider, cliched as it is it's very true that sat's are only a component to be taken with the larger context of the application</p>
<p>First off, thanks for the input everyone. Secondly, it's a fact that SAT scores are improving, but I don't believe it's necessarily because adcoms are going through a "natural selection" process. To a certain extent, I'm sure it's effective, but on the otherhand, it's not their primary concern. Again, national averages on the SATs are also rising, so why wouldn't colleges follow the same pattern? Surely, rankings are very important in getting the most prestige, etc., but what type of college would it be if it was the very FIRST (not literally first, but you get the idea) thing they think about when looking at an applicant? Any rebuttal would be greatly appreciated- let's make this insightful for everyone! Keep those posts comin'!!</p>
<p>P.S.- I know I'm sounding naive by believing colleges won't play the "corporate" game, but they've been in the game for longer than any of us have lived. If colleges wanted nothing but prestige and money (with diversity to satisfy URM), than they wouldn't be colleges, they would be companies, factories, etc. I could be completely off (as I am often), but it's something to think about.</p>
<p>Also, I understand the logic/argument when someone says, "colleges look at the GPA and SAT scores before they look into the applicant holistically, etc." While this may be true to a certain extent (ex. a student with a combined 800 on the SAT and a 1.5 GPA might not be looked at any further after seeing the SAT and GPA, when it comes to HYP), it can't be the whole story. It's a fact that students with SAT scores that are lower than the average for that school are still considered, even if they are not an URM, recruited athlete, etc. How else will they admit all the interesting people without looking at essays, recs, etc.?</p>
<p>Bring up my post</p>
<p>b u m p</p>