<p>Have you noticed that smokers tend to hang out with other smokers, or potheads with other potheads, or jocks with other jocks - people identify with people with similar habits, traits and backgrounds - and no law or rule is going to change that</p>
<p>Sociologists have identified that "homeless" people hang with similar homeless and there are even perceived lower classes and higher classes within the entire homeless category. Example "mission stiffs" (who hang near churches) look down on "railroad stiffs" who are often only in town for few days - until they hop the next freight.</p>
<p>Group indentification is a natural part of life</p>
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smokers tend to hang out with other smokers, or potheads with other potheads, or jocks with other jocks - people identify with people with similar habits, traits and backgrounds - and no law or rule is going to change that
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</p>
<p>As I've said, even though Vietnamese-American culture, white-American culture and Cuban-American culture might differ from each other in significant ways, it's still American. Is a person who is ethnically Korean but was born and raised in Chicago really THAT different from a white person born and raised in Chicago? Do they not speak the same language, eat many of the same foods, wear the same sort of clothes, go to the same sort of high schools, hear the same music and watch the same things on TV? </p>
<p>So why is it at many colleges those two would be in seperate groups? They are both born and raised in America. They are both American. They both know American culture and the English language. But they segment each other apart.</p>
<p>I think it is beyond the satisfying answer of "Its just habits, traits." The truth is its racial, if not racist. It is not JUST "Well, we Puerto Ricans have certain interests" or "We black Americans have certain interests." Its also very much, "We Chinese are of the same ethnicity" and "We whites are of the same ethnicity."</p>
<p>Think about it: Say you're a white American, would you tend to feel more comfortable around an Asian-American you've never met before, or a white person that you've never before, but was born and raised in Poland? If you're an Asian-American, would you gravitate to a black-American, or would you feel more comfortable with a person that looks like you, but was born and raised in China? If you're a Hispanic American, would you feel more comfortable with a white American person, or a person of Latino heritage who was born and raised outside of America? If you're a black American, would you be more comfortable around an Asian-American, or a black person who looks like you but was born and raised in Nigeria?</p>
<p>It's racial. It's not just culture or habits or traits. If it was CULTURE, more "Whatever ethnicity here"-Americans would hang out with each other. Most born and bred Americans, be they Indian or black or Mexican or German or Japanese ethnically, share the American culture. Yet there is still racial self-segregation among Americans.</p>
<p>about the whole asians not making non-asian friends thing..</p>
<p>i think that statement is less true for asians who participate in school sports teams. teammates make wonderful friends and you really get close to each other because you sweat and work your butts off together during practice. </p>
<p>i just wish that the asians who just play piano or violin and only join the math club, science club, or the asian culture club would go out there and get involved in some sports.</p>
<p>Well, my parents want me to hang out with Vietnamese-American kids (just Asian wouldn't cut it), but sadly, I find that I have little in common. I don't enjoy boba or watching Chinese soaps, or taking pictures with peace signs. I grew up in a heavy Asian-American area too, but mostly 3rd or 4th generation, so they were basically just "American." I think eventually, as generations go by, it will be less and less of a problem. Mixed-race marriages will be more common so color lines will become more blurred.</p>
<p>This, from post 79 by Pearls-05: "But a Korean girl who grew up in SoCal? A Puerto-Rican who grew up in Brooklyn? Are they not Americans, and would be able to culturally understand and identify with other Americans, be they white or black?" </p>
<p>I VEHEMENTLY disagree with. The experiences of most white people in this country are so wildly different those of their neighbors (blacks, Asians, Latinos) that they cannot be compared. The most glaring difference is that white people experience such minimal racism in this society. The most they can point to is silly little incidents usually involving the word "cracker." Every other race tends to experience pretty widespread racism.
Which is generally the reason why self-segregation exists. People want to be with people who aren't going to be skeptical when they make a legit complaint about racism (white people have a tendency to do this).</p>
<p>Agree with Just_Browsing.</p>
<p>Culturally Vietnamese-american and italian-american can grow up having entirely different ideals and morals. They can have entirely different understandings of how social interactions work. To give an example, I actually do still bow to my teachers. Shaking their hand is not my first action, but actually to back up and bow to them. I am really old school I think in this habit. You are going to tell me that culturally an Italian-american is going to bow to his or her teacher? That he/she will treat that person with the absolute respect that he/she "deserves" when operating in the culture that I grew up with? BTW, I grew up Viet-Chinese-American. The only thing that can bind the two is the fact that they were born in the same country.</p>
<p>Anyway, if you were a white American student at say the University of Tokyo, and let us say that there were 5 other such white American students in close proximity to yourself, would you choose to try and befriend the other Japanese students that are studying there or would you naturally strike up a conversation with those that seem familiar to you. If you would do the same thing that students do on American campuses at foreign (to you) campuses, why would you say self-segregation shouldn't be done if you do it yourself?</p>
<p>I agree with you as well. Attending college itself can be so stressful that it is easier to gravitate towards people who share your beliefs. If you are white, you don't have to deal with people who either dismiss you as less than equal or who seem to be walking on eggshells because they are trying not to be offensive. The funny thing is then they will say something really offensive and because the belief is so ingrained in them, they don't even realize they are being offensive.</p>
<p>I just wanted to relax and be myself. It is difficult enough being away from home for the first time in your life, having to learn to take care of yourself, dedicating yourself to get an education, and finding ways to pay for it. Playing a part in some social science experiment is not high on the list of things to do. If you are a minority, and you are fortunate enough to be able to attend college, you have more pressing priorities. Having the comfort of being around people who understand you without you having to explain every little thing is very important. It is not that we go out of our way to self-segregate, it's just that it makes college life easier to deal with.</p>
<p>In a funny way this question itself seemed somewhat racially biased. As a minority myself, I know the first thing on my mind when I went to college was not 'where's all the white people at?' I understood I was there for a specific purpose and in the process of getting that education, I was exposed to many whites, Asians, hispanics, and others. I dealt with them as I would deal with anyone -- I try to treat others as I would like to be treated. But I did not go out of my way to force friendships. I knew they would come naturally and if they didn't, I would still treat others as well as I could. But I did enjoy the comfort of being around people who shared the same background and life experiences I had. I was glad that there were others like me I could identify with and who could understand what I was going through.</p>
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Is a person who is ethnically Korean but was born and raised in Chicago really THAT different from a white person born and raised in Chicago? Do they not speak the same language, eat many of the same foods, wear the same sort of clothes, go to the same sort of high schools, hear the same music and watch the same things on TV?
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<p>totally disagree with this as well. No, people of every household goes through different things let alone different race households. They eat their own cultural food in their homes, speak their own language (sometimes) in their houses, watch their own tv in their houses (korean dramas woot) etc.</p>
<p>Just hang out with who u are comfortable with. it can't be that difficult.</p>
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give an example, I actually do still bow to my teachers..... BTW, I grew up Viet-Chinese-American. The only thing that can bind the two is the fact that they were born in the same country.
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<p>Really? Does that go over well (bowing to your American teachers)?</p>
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[quote]
Anyway, if you were a white American student at say the University of Tokyo, and let us say that there were 5 other such white American students in close proximity to yourself, would you choose to try and befriend the other Japanese students that are studying there or would you naturally strike up a conversation with those that seem familiar to you. If you would do the same thing that students do on American campuses at foreign (to you) campuses, why would you say self-segregation shouldn't be done if you do it yourself?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>As I said before, internationals have more of an excuse by sticking to their own "type." The same goes for situations in which Americans are in the minority when it comes to nationality/culture, if not also ethnicity. </p>
<p>But non-whites born and raised in America, if I believe the people here, grow up radically different from whites born and raised here.</p>
<p>
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No, people of every household goes through different things let alone different race households. They eat their own cultural food in their homes, speak their own language (sometimes) in their houses, watch their own tv in their houses (korean dramas woot) etc.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Really? A black American family doesn't watch some of the same shows as a Hispanic American family? A Korean American family doesn't eat bread like other Americans? White American families corner the market when it comes to watching football and American Idol, and eating cereal and mashed potatoes?</p>
<p>Because if your statement is believed, different races are entirely different from each other in America, from what they speak to what they eat to what they watch on TV. Which means I can't imagine ever seeing a Chinese American eating macaroni and cheese, or a Mexican American watching basketball, because those are not things historically in their culture, right?</p>
<p>Also, I think "people of every household goes through different things let alone different race households" is very problematic. So Asian Americans don't experience divorce along with everyone else? White Americans don't experience poverty along with everyone else? Black Americans don't experience alcoholism like everyone else?</p>
<p>No. The truth is all "types" of Americans experience many of the same things that are not necessarily racially-based. </p>
<p>To say that culturally "ethnic"-Americans are incredibly different from mainstream white Americans is one thing. To say that they also totally experience different things is ridiculous. Racism might be unique to certain groups, but not life.</p>
<p>Most people seem to disagree with me that self-segregating is a bad thing, and that's fine if that's their opinion.</p>
<p>But the thing that surprised me most was how vehemently people insist that certain cultures are different, and that even if one were born and raised in America, they would still react more strongly towards someone of their own ethnicity's culture than someone of their own nationality's culture. </p>
<p>If you're born and raised anywhere, but don't share the culture there, can you see how you might be treated differently? Especially if you don't share that culture but choose to stay in your own segmented group where you're "comfortable."</p>
<p>If a white American family moved to Ethiopia, and their children were born and raised there, but this white family and their Ethiopian-born white children chose to only associate with other white Americans, should anyone cry racist? According to people here, no, they should not. So there should be nothing problematic with Asians moving to America and choosing to only associate with other Asians in America, even if their kids were born and raised in America.</p>
<p>Well, I personally know Asian-Americans who chose to stay in their own ethnic "enclaves" here in Los Angeles. The result are Asians who moved to America when they were babies, and who are now forty years old and still speak English as if they just came off the boat. They thought they would never feel comfortable in mainstream American culture and society, so they stayed in Asian communities where they DID feel comfortable. I met a very nice Chinese grandmother-- around 60--- recently who has been living in this country for 40 years. I was eating a yogurt.</p>
<p>She did not know what a yogurt was. She has been living here for 40 years. </p>
<p>I'm not making judgements. But if people ever complain about being treated as not American just because they're ethnically Mexican or Nigerian or Korean, its not too hard to wonder why. I'm not saying its right, just saying. Whites may have segregated people in the past, but its all too easy and comfortable for minorities to segregate themselves today. And when segregation occurs, misunderstandings and misconceptions and suspicions occur because you've closed yourself off. The same goes for whites who close themselves off to other minorities-- misunderstandings and misconceptions occur.</p>
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But the thing that surprised me most was how vehemently people insist that certain cultures are different, and that even if one were born and raised in America, they would still react more strongly towards someone of their own ethnicity's culture than someone of their own nationality's culture.
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</p>
<p>Peals, I completely agree with you, especially on that point. I think some of them are just trying to justify having homogeneous groups of friends, when they know it doesn't necessarily have to be that way. I'm black, and my best friends are Indian, Jordanian, and Cuban. We all act exactly the same, love to do the same things, and get along more with each other than probably anyone else of our own races. I'm just happy that we "found" each other.</p>
<p>I go to Pomona College so most students are white. I have lots of white friends but my closer friends are Asians because we have more in common. Beyond that, I have friends that are closer than my Asian friends who are Latino and Latina and that's because we identify as being low-income and poor compared to other students. It's not self-segregation, it's making friends that have things in common with you. I meet nice people all the time but have nothing to talk about with them beyond school because we live such different lives. I have a close friend who is rich and half asian and I have nothing in common with her. It's difficult to talk about things with people who haven't experienced what you have although I'm not saying that we shouldn't all be open to different experiences.</p>
<p>there is nothing wrong with hanging out with people of your own ethnicity. i mean, of course it's great to meet and make friends with people from all backgrounds, but i feel most comfortable when i'm around my korean/asian friends. we just relate and have more in common with each other.</p>
<p>also, the way you grew up seems to matter also. i know of a few asian people that don't really have asian friends in college, but that's also because they've felt more comfortable with caucasian people. i, myself can't do that.</p>
<p>it's also that some people are still downright rude. me and 2 korean friends of mine were crossing a street on campus, and as soon as we cross to the other side, these 2 guys driving by gives us the finger and yells out "get off the road you fu**ing chinks. it's freakin 2006 and this is still happening. and it's not like im in the boonies. enough said.</p>
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Which is generally the reason why self-segregation exists. People want to be with people who aren't going to be skeptical when they make a legit complaint about racism
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</p>
<p>Okay, I can understand this, but generalizations are dangerous. What about the white people who were President of their Civil Right Clubs at their school? What if they want to make diverse friends in college, no, NOT purposely trying to make friends with minorities, but wanting to hang out with lots of different people? What if that CRC President goes up to your table during lunch? How annoyed/mad is your Asian posse going to be with them?</p>
<p>What about 4th and 5th generation Asian Americans? Are they "whitewashed"? "Bananas?" "Twinkies?" (This could apply to any ethnic group technically, I'm just using an example"</p>
<p>What about people who want to try to make friends that don't all look like them? If they sit near your race/ethnic posse, are they an "egg"? "Inside-out Oreo?" These slang terms all exist, and I think it's these self-segregrated groups that tend to use them the most (and seriously, compared to how a diverse group might joke around with them.)</p>
<p>People make these judgements when they don't have to and we're never going to make any real progress this way.</p>
<p>P.S It's funny how one of my close Filipino-American friends can go on and on about her Asian dramas she loves, her Filipino and Korean singers she loves, and I can still find tons of things to her to talk about. It's not like all I can talk about with anyone is baguettes, Monet (French!), NFL Sundays (white!), Jpop and ukiyo-e (Japanese-American!).</p>
<p>It's also weird how I can talk to my African-American friends about, oh, school, books we've read, current events, movies coming out, without them ever criticizing my ignorance of their strong pride and heritage and calling me insensitive to their slavery past. That said, I agree with bifred on how race will really not be such a big deal in the future. =D</p>
<p>you guys are missing something.</p>
<p>the thing is when people first go to college of course they want to make new friends from different races and such, unless your completely racist and such which not many people are. But, it pretty much depends on the people around you. If there is already a asian thing going on... i mean that white person would probably feel strange hanging out with a group of asians, i mean he has nothing against them, but it would suck if they were talking in asian and you had no idea what was going on. Same thing for other races. If the college is already diverse and people seem to have friends from multiple ethnicites, the people are going to be much more likely to be with different people other than their own race.</p>
<p>'talking in asian'...LOL</p>
<p>
[quote]
But the thing that surprised me most was how vehemently people insist that certain cultures are different, and that even if one were born and raised in America, they would still react more strongly towards someone of their own ethnicity's culture than someone of their own nationality's culture.
[/quote]
Who are you to assume that every single person born and raised in this country does and should have a similar "American" culture just like every other American? You've probably come in contact with certain cliques of people who were of a specific ethnicity but acted very "American" in terms of their culture, thus making them hypocrites in your mind. In a case like this, I agree with you that the reason for these different cliques is predominantly racial. But I also believe that this isn't always the case. Someone who's descended from people from Asia, or Africa, or just any area that has a different culture from the common Western one we associate with America would surely have at least some cultural difference in comparison to the typical American one. Whether it was your parents, grandparents or greatparents who immigrated to this country, they may have preserved certain elements of their culture that have made their way to their kids today.</p>
<p>If you think anyone raised in this country should be the same or similar to everyone else, you're saying that American culture and how it is disseminated is so powerful, maybe too powerful, that it eliminates other cultures, which in my mind, is a bad thing. Call me idealistic, but I though America was a free enough place where we could incorporate the different elements of our diverse population without having to become homogenous robots.</p>