<p>Good student with good grades (excellent in the major). We are struggling but managing to pay tuition, etc. with no loans, . I find myself incredibly enough wanting to say "seriously? you want to take THAT class?" which I swore was bad parenting and I Would Never Do That...but..but....</p>
<p>Online class about a very contemporary musical phenom singer. I could just cry, such a waste of intellectual time when there are literally dozens and dozens of really interesting new things to learn in life. So far all I said was that I was trying to understand the thinking (which was , I'm told, "it fit and you said I could take a web class") It's not the web part, it's the fluffiness. I would never forbid it, ever, (although I will be smh all term) but am I wrong to think a university should be ashamed to offer this crap?</p>
<p>Agree it’s suspect unless the class teaches actual critical skills used to write about/assess the impact of said contemporary musical phenom singer. Sometimes that kind of thing can work. One example is the Tao of Pooh, which uses Winnie the Pooh characters to teach taosim. I know one of the Ivies offered a popular class on the Beatles once - same idea. But I agree, all too often, these kinds of classes are gimmicky and of questionable value. </p>
<p>It might be gimmicky and a waste. But, if the class provides a framework for thinking about popular culture in a critical way, it will provide tools that will benefit the student throughout life. Any essays for the class are also an opportunity to teach critical writing. </p>
<p>Or, it could just be a waste :). I don’t know. </p>
<p>I can imagine the sort of class you are referring to. I guess it’s about Paris Hilton or Miley Cyrus, etc. In my experience, the REAL goal of such a class is to critically study contemporary culture, and the specific topic could be almost anyone or anything. It’s a sneaky way of attracting students into a venue where they can challenge a lot of their assumptions. When done correctly, students are usually surprised by the level of difficulty involved in such a course, and also the quality of writing that is required. Anyway, I wouldn’t judge it based on the title alone, or even a short description. These days, a lot of students need to be “seduced” into thinking critically.</p>
<p>Obviously, I could be wrong about this particular course.</p>
<p>I took a very easy class on the Beatles when I was in college, and it was one of my favorite classes. Not only did I learn about the Beatles, but I learned about the history and culture of the time period, the history of rock music, and how to analyze a song. I learned much more in that class (and still remember much more) than I did in seemingly “more important” classes like structural biochemistry (which I got an A in but don’t remember learning anything).</p>
<p>There are other “popular music” classes in my school that focused on Bob Dylan or contemporary rap singers. Many seminar classes focus on “fun” topics to get students interested in and thinking about the subject (like stupid physics in movies, vampires in popular culture, facebook, etc). There are classes on popular literature, children’s literature, and science fiction. These classes are often gateways to teaching about culture and analysis through fun topics, and they’re generally targeted to non-major students who may otherwise never take a class from that department. Sometimes, you need a hook to get people interested in a subject, but that doesn’t mean the class is crap.</p>
<p>To be honest, I would be more concerned that the “fluff” would come from it being an online course, rather than a course in person. It’s much easier to slack off and put in the minimum effort when a course is taught online, and in my experience, the instruction tends to be of lesser quality than in person classes–although everyone’s experience varies.</p>
<p>I took a class from the ‘experimental studies’ program at my school named “War Movies” To this day, I remember more about and learned more from that course than any other. It was taught by two guys who were probably about 25, bearded, rather sloppy hippies. It was fantastic. Each week we watched a movie or even film stock about WWII, starting with Nazi propaganda movies and ending with movies made after the war but about the war, and the next night we discussed the movie. We learned that the US government confiscated most of the film stock during the war, and if you wanted to make a movie, you made an approved movie. We compared the movies made in the US to those made in other countries, both friendly and enemy. We learned history. We saw recruiting film. We saw classics (Bridge on the River Kwai; Mrs. Miniver). We saw bios of famous people (Glenn Miller, Jimmy Stewart).</p>
<p>You just never know what these course may offer.</p>
<p>Greenbutton- if it’s any comfort, your kid does not need to be enrolled in a course in order to read a book. There are millions of adults who every year read “War and Peace” and “All’s Quiet on the Western Front” and big, hefty biographies about FDR and LBJ and Florence Nightengale.</p>
<p>The class may be fluff (or not- hard to tell from your description). But you can encourage your kids to think of college as the first step on their quest to become (and continue to be) educated citizens of the world. The learning and critical thinking doesn’t stop when they get their degrees.</p>
<p>Can’t comment on the particular course, but in general, courses about pop culture figures aren’t really about the figure. They’re about us. What does it say about our beliefs, our priorities, our values that we venerate Katy Perry today or Madonna yesterday? Are they reflecting or driving changes in our society’s conception of gender roles, sexuality, race, etc.? You can have a fluff discussion of Shakespeare or an insightful critique of Britney Spears. The material can be just a tool for examining the writers and readers.</p>
<p>Ah yes, how dare a school offer a class that is clearly of interest to its students and that can teach them something about the culture that they live and work in. Travesty, I tell ya! </p>
<p>I am a GSI for what many people consider a “fluff” class. However, what you can’t learn from the title of the class is that the students in my class learn why people made the choice to shelter or not shelter Jewish people during the Holocaust, how not everything is in shades of black or white, what it was like to live under oppressive conditions; what it was like to be a woman under state socialism, how patriarchy still very much affects women in many places to this day- including the US, how power imbalances lead to very real problems like sexual and gender based violence; ethnic tensions and wars in Europe that are often overlooked by the media, how historical roots impact modern day atrocities, etc. The list goes on. Of course, just reading the title, you’d NEVER know that. </p>
<p>I am sure that this course is not about the life of Miley Cyrus or something. It is almost certainly about the extreme influence that the media and celebrities have on our everyday lives- from entrenched gender norms to the way that capitalism and media interact with each other. </p>
<p>Honestly, my undergrad degree looks like a laundry list of “fluff” classes and a “fluff” major- and yet, it’s given me incredible research and writing skills that I continue to hone in grad school. I am able to look at the world around me with a critical lens in a way that many are not able to- and that’s very necessary for anyone who is working in a field where you have to interact with or understand the public in any way. </p>
<p>The single most interesting class I had in college was “Children’s Literature”. It was an easy class and was taught in a huge hall because it was so popular. Fortunately, there wasn’t the push to take only “meaningful” classes only in one’s (profitable) major only with the goal of making big bucks at the end of the rat race. </p>
<p>This class allowed me to hear Margaret Hamilton talk about the realities behind the Wizard of Oz, Maurice Sendak explain how his parents let him and his sister “publish” books and put on plays that led him to become the writer he was, hear an educator from South America talk about the differences in American education and that in her country, and to hear an explanation of why Irish children jumped rope only with old clothesline (so they wouldn’t get shot playing with the “wrong color”). We examined family relationships, how writing for children isn’t as easy as it seems, and how someone like Dr. Seuss came to fame. Most of the kids sitting around me were engineering students. We all loved that class.</p>
<p>Hey now, I am from a family of teachers, artists, and writers, so I am not saying the subject of popular culture is unworthy of discussion. I am saying a class that requires, as a primary academic goal, checking in and listening to 200 selections of the same forgettable flash in the pan artist is perhaps not the best allocation of brain and money for a student who is <em>already</em> extremely well versed in musical popular culture. I am a hearty fan of electives and the well-rounded education (graduated from an LAC) but honestly – listening to songs as 30% of the grade? A paper about which song is “best” (not a comparison to another artist or genre)? </p>
<p>I am in fact wishing he was doing exactly what y’all suggest — finding something a little more outside his niche for an elective (because that’s what they are for). </p>
<p>But yes. I am irritated by the lofty notion that this is worth $500+ a credit. Perhaps that makes me a myopic backwoods dumbhead. That is certainly a possibility Now that we have brought it up – what makes a class “fluff”? Is it all in your perspective, or is there some clearly defined notion?</p>
<p>Oh, I don’t know about that. I took a class at Berkeley on vampire mythology back in the 90’s and it was pretty fascinating. Granted, it didn’t COUNT for anything in regards to major or GE’s but it wasn’t a waste of my time either. It was fun, connected me with some cool people who thought learning something quirky was better than getting plastered and has actually been information I’ve used more times than you’d expect!</p>
<p>If you were paying by the credit, if your kid was loading up on these sorts of classes then yes, outrage acceptable. If your kid takes a few of these courses during their undergraduate career and it doesn’t interfere with what they NEED to be doing, I’d just see it as a structured club offering some intellectual fun in their life.</p>
<p>Greenbutton–any chance you would share the actual course description, or even better, some of the introduction from the syllabus? Because on the face of it, it’s hard to imagine that listening to and debating the selections from the said flash-in-the-pan artist is really the goal of the class. If so, yeah, that’s not great. It’s just hard to imagine that such a course would get vetted to run in any good college. It’s just much more typical to be, as noted by most posters, a critique/analysis of contemporary culture. </p>
<p>I wish your problem on all parents everywhere!</p>
<p>The class is an opportunity for you to turn the helicopter off and let your good student who gets good grades (excellent in the major), make her own decisions about her own education and her own life. Let her risk wasting her time and your money. Kids need to learn to take risks. This is about as harmless of as risk are you will find. </p>
<p>That opportunity is worth every penny, IMHO. </p>
<p>When I was an undergrad, I took a classical music appreciation course. We had to listen to hundreds of pieces written by “dead white men”. I loved the course, but really…what’s the difference between that and listening to hundreds of pieces by a pop artist?</p>
<p>I learned to listen critically to the music. I could identify similar melodies, rhythms, and varying instruments. I could identify some pieces by the time period in which they were written.</p>
<p>If these students are learning to listen critically to the genre presented in the class, it is likely that they will be able to transfer those critical listening skills to many things.</p>
<p>My kid teaches " History of Rock and Roll". It is a vey popular course, and he makes sure the students are gaining something from it that they can use outside of the class.</p>
Now that we have brought it up – what makes a class “fluff”? Is it all in your perspective, or is there some clearly defined notion?</p>