Why do you homeschool?

Pre-College Issues Home Schooling and College
81

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I'm happy to pay for an educated population

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<p>I am happy to pay for an educated population too. That's why I like public subsidies for libraries and museums and vocational-technical education programs and lots of other educational institutions. All I ask of any of these, including K-12 classroom schools, is that they show some results for their claim on public subsidies. Meanwhile, my children are mostly educated through our family's earnings, pooled resources from other families that arrange joint classes, and some private foundations that fund scholarships for specialized programs for gifted students. Your tax dollars are at work with other kids, as are my tax dollars, and private funds are at work for many kids, including my kids.</p>

82

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All I ask of any of these, including K-12 classroom schools, is that they show some results for their claim on public subsidies.

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<p>Efficient resource allocation is one of the last arguments that could be made for homeschooling, which tends to require the unemployment (or significant underemployment) of one or more parents.</p>

83

<p>Is it possible to homeschool at all if both parents are working?</p>

84

<p>Student plus books could be counted as "homeschooling", I guess. I am curious whether most homeschooling refers to parents actually pre-digesting curriculum so as to regurgitate it, in the bird-feeding sense, to their children --- and more generally, does the division of labor resemble that in a public school.</p>

85

<p>The divisions of labor are all over the map. I was quite astonished, when I entered my professional school program, to find out that a majority of my classmates who responded to an optional demographic question reported NO occupation for their mothers other than "homemaker." (I reported my mother's outside-the-home occupation, surgical nursing, although indeed she was mostly a stay-at-home mom during the years when her children were little.) That refers to families in which children attend school: some have two parents full-time (overtime?) in the labor force, and some do not. I know of examples of homeschooling families in which both parents have full-time employment outside the home, but in the most common case one parent (perhaps) has typical full-time job for a third-party employer while another has a home-based sole proprietorship business. But there are all kinds of patterns, and the families I have observed change the pattern over time. </p>

<p>As to the manner of children learning in a homeschooling setting, my own home is the home I know best, but I am blessed with many local friends whose guest I have been and whose families I have observed in their learning activities. A fairly typical outcome of homeschooling approaches to reading instruction is advanced reading level on the part of the learner, which results in greater independence in self-learning than might be possible for a school pupil of the same age. A very common "homeschooling" practice is parent-organized joint classes, often with each parent teaching a favorite subjec that parent knows better than the other parents, or possibly a hired teacher teaching a particular specialized subject. And these days distance</a> learning courses abound, with each brand of course offering differing cost and quality trade-offs. My oldest son has participated in all of the learning patterns mentioned above at one time or another, and my three younger children are each mixing-and-matching learning opportunities that fit their different personalities and interests. </p>

<p>For public policy issues about funding education, I like the writings of economist Mark Blaug, and I would be glad to hear suggestions from thread participants of other authors whose writings on that issue I should consider.</p>

86

<p>That's informative, thanks. By "division of labor" I meant the labor of teaching and learning, i.e. are the number and ratio of hours spent by student and teacher to learn X, comparable to those at a public school.</p>

87

<p>The biggest mis-impression people have about home schooling in my family is that the parent is around "teaching" the kids. This very rarely happens with my children.
I believe that learning is something one does to oneself, not something that someone does to another. Particularly once one can read and figure, books, the internet, and the real world take over with plenty to engage anyone curious (which kids naturally are, IMO). My kids have never taken a "course" either, from other parents, on-line, or in a classroom, once they began home schooling.
Until college, that is.
If they saw the value in those alternatives, we would have done it at their request.
Once they have teenage siblings, parents aren't even necessary for supervision. It is important to remember that an added layer to the economy called "teacher" is a fairly recent creation. We can argue whether this is a source of economic "drag" to the economy or not. In most societies in most centuries, children learned in their homes and communities. That's the way it has been with my kids.
There is a valid role for teachers of ballet, music, etc. in my opinion. Coaches in sports also. But chemistry teachers who would never even think of doing an original chemistry experiment? That's another kettle of fish.
So much for my take on parents' time and efficiency.</p>

88

<p>But, will these students be ready to sit in a classroom all day and have things taught to them? High school also prepares you for what you should know and be able to do in college.</p>

89

<p>I can tell you that the first of my home schooled kids graduated from an Ivy with flying colors, and that the second is due to start at another in the fall.</p>

90

<p>romanigypseyeyes, I went to public high school after being homeschooled until 8th grade. High school SHOULD prepare you for college, but that is not always the case. I lived in a rural community and my high school had one AP class and a mixture of good and bad teachers. When compared to what I believe would have occurred had I homeschooled throughout high school, I believe I benefitted from Math courses, suffered from Science courses, and about broke even on English courses. </p>

<p>While I wouldn't trade my homeschooling experience for anything, I believe it is generally a good idea to go to public or private school in high school because, at most schools, the teachers are better equipped to teach in their specialities. However, a lot depends on the abilities of the teaching parent(s) and the characteristics of the individual child. There is not really a cookie cutter approach for everyone. For example, my parents opted to homeschool my brother and me until 8th grade, but are sending my youngest sister to regular school.</p>

<p>Also, you don't sit in the classroom all day during college... only about 15 hours per week. You spend most of your time doing what, in my opinion, amounts to teaching yourself in preparation for classes. The primary benefit of homeschooling when you get to college is that you already know how to teach yourself, which is an advantage. This helped offset the disadvantage of a relatively weak rural school.</p>

91

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<p>Oh, okay, this is a fairly frequently asked question about homeschooling. The claim of homeschooling parents, which is consistent with my personal experience, is that a child in a homeschooling setting will typically learn as much (gauged by progress through a standard curriculum over months on the calendar) with fewer teacher contact hours than are found in a typical school classroom. In other words, the main teaching parent does not have to devote as many contact hours per subject as a classroom schoolteacher. The claimed (in my case, observed) efficiency of learning perhaps results from the lessons being more exactly tailored to each learner's previous knowledge and "learning style"--after all, in this regard, homeschooling more nearly resembles individualized tutoring, even in a family with a large number of children, than it resembles classroom instruction. Other issues that might be in play are that homeschoolers actively seek out better instructional materials, some more successfully than others. (I "met" CC participant "Marite" online years ago in an email list for discussion of math instruction materials. I double- and triple-research math materials a lot because I think I need a lot of help in that subject, and I have been lucky to receive a lot of good suggestions about math materials over the years.) And some homeschooling parents (CC participant "Mini," whom I've had the pleasure of meeting in person, fits this pattern better than I) probably gain efficiency through "interest-led learning" ("unschooling"), in which a child pursues the subjects of the child's current interest in a very self-motivated way. </p>

<p>Does that answer your basic question? I'd be happy to follow up if you like. </p>

<p>Replying here also to post #88, I think the crucial issue in any learning environment is initiative on the part of the learner, rather than passive acquiescence to a treatment by a teacher. With reference to my own oldest son (current age fourteen), he has taken sit-down classes in a brick-and-mortar college classroom, and he is doing well in those classes. (By the way, ordinarily college students do not sit in classrooms "all day" in quite the same way high school students do. Usually they do a lot of studying at times and places of their own choosing in between scheduled class sessions.) My son has also attended academic summer programs of various kinds, in two countries, and listening to a teacher in a classroom is something he has been able to do without ever attending the public schools of our school district. </p>

<p>This is an interesting discussion, and I appreciate the forum management making it a featured thread.</p>

92

<p>What reasonably intelligent person needs to practice sitting in a classroom all day? Is the proper preparation for college, and for the rest of life, just sitting passively and absorbing (or ignoring) what others attempt to download into your brain?</p>

<p>People who want to force little children to sit at tables and practice tracing letters rather than permit them to play and experience the world insist that the children must be made over into little robots in order to achieve in school and ultimately in their jobs. Making children endure years of lining up,waiting, walking silently single file and sitting still when their little bodies need activity does them a horrible injustice. The same people then expect older children and teens to continue this passive behavior and simply take in, then regurgitate, an assortment of factoids. The good schools may actually challenge students to learn logic and rhetoric, and to exercise their creativity, but they are too rare. Schools are too caught up in teaching to the various standardized tests and the teachers dare not take time for exploration and learning.</p>

<p>My kids, like many of their homeschooled friends, were blessedly free of the constraints that most of their institutionally schooled friends had to endure. One result is that they have never lost their love of learning. Their university professors have often commented on their initiative, self-motivation, creativity, and perseverance. They exhibit leadership skills and confidence in their abilities to accomplish whatever tasks they face, which has enabled them to succeed in college both individually and as members of various groups.</p>

93

<p>Endure? Forced? Programed? School is not a prison nor are we "programed" like robots. I was able to freely play and we only sat at our desks for about 20 minutes a day until 5th grade. It was in 6th grade that my parents put me in homeschooling because of medical reasons. Everytime I was there though, we learned through hands on learning. We were encouraged to think for ourselves. I have even switched school districts and have found this to be true. We are not always simply spoon fed everything we know. We were never forced to be SILENT. We knew to respect a teacher when she/he talked. Yes, we go to school for a set time everyday. But isn't that preparing us for when we will eventually have to go out in the workforce and get a job? Great schools are not rare. I came from inner city DETROIT schools to one of the top school districts in Michigan and I was still ahead of most of the other students. We can be leaders too. I started a basketball league in a city where 3 other leagues had been started but all had failed. Mine is thriving. </p>

<p>The homeschooling parents say they hate when people generalize about home schooled kids. Yet, you also generalize and basically say we are robots. You generalize about our teachers and say that they are hindering our creativity and not allowing us to reach our full potential. If they didn't want to teach then why would they bother going to college and still continue to remain at generally low paying teaching jobs when they could be doing something else. They love it for the most part, that is why. </p>

<p>If you ask us not to generalize you, then please don't generalize us.</p>

94

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School is not a prison

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<p>At least one winner of the Nobel Prize for literature disagreed with that general proposition. </p>

<p><a href="http://learninfreedom.org/Nobel_hates_school.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://learninfreedom.org/Nobel_hates_school.html&lt;/a> </p>

<p>I will agree with you that there are better and worse schools, but I think that the best social policy is to let families decide what is appropriate education for their children, especially if families are bearing the expense of their decision.</p>

95

<p>I'm not saying home schooling shouldn't be an option, but I don't believe that school is a prison. People who believe that have obviously never been to prison. I agree that different people have different educational needs. Neither of my parents went to typical colleges, at least for their day. My mother was the only female in her college and my dad decided school wasn't for him and got into trade.</p>

96

<p>Different schools, different experiences. We tried our public school system for a number of years before pulling out. One of the main reasons included the fact that the staff (teachers) didn't seem to be allowed to think /act for themselves even if clearly they should:</p>

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<li><p>After returning from a field trip the bus the second graders were on was "tapped" in the school's driveway by a mini van (the van's side mirror tapped the bus - no one felt it or even knew about it until the driver of the mini van got out and informed the driver.) All the children (and chaperones, teachers) were FORCED to stay on the bus (without airconditioning and in Georgia heat and without lunch) for over an hour until the names of every single person on the bus was recorded for the "accident". Tell me - why couldn't they have at least disboarded the bus (thereby avoiding the heat) and then taken the names? Because some pencil pusher decided that that was policy and policy can't be changed. </p></li>
<li><p>Second grade teacher had spelling words on a big board in front of the class. I asked her "What is that word; I've never heard of it before. Is it spelled wrong?" "Yes, she answered, but I "CAN'T TAKE IT OFF THE LIST UNITL ALL THE SECOND GRADE TEACHERS HAVE MET TO AGREE THAT IT SHOULD BE REMOVED." Come on people, how retarded is that? I'm not faulting the teacher, I'm faulting the administration for tieing the hands - and numbing the brains -of educators by making policy that is not allowed to bend when the occasion requires it.</p></li>
<li><p>Lunch room: kids are given an orange cut in half (not quarters) - little kids don't eat it because they can't physically eat an orange cut in half. Ask why and we are told that if they cut the oranges in quarters the kids won't take a "full serving" . Well.... they aren't eating a "full serving" now because they can't physically get their little mouths to dig out an orange cut in half or peel it with their little fingers. </p></li>
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<p>I'm tired of typing, but I could go on. Some schools are great I'm sure but where we live, the county has made it impossible for good teachers to teach and I'm not willing to waste anymore time with backward thinking, mind numbing "policy". Let them keep it - I pity those who have to endure it for the rest of their high school careers, but for us, we are moving on.</p>

97

<p>I am a homeschooling parent. I'd like to offer the suggestion that there is no one perfect learning environment for all children. For those of you who have learned in public and private schools and been happy with it, that's great. But homeschooling can also be a wonderful and rewarding experience. </p>

<p>My oldest child has been taking community college courses for two years and is preparing to attend a small LAC in the fall. I feel that he has done very well for himself. He has an autistic spectrum disorder, and he had very few friends in the eight years that he attended public schools. When we started homeschooling, my husband and I were very apprehensive. How could we prevent our son from becoming a hermit? Our socially adept younger son made friends everywhere he went, and we had the opposite concern for him. How could we meet his strong need for social contact? It turned out that home learning allowed each of the boys to do very well socially. The homeschooled teen group offered a small (10-20 kids at most events) stable, and very accepting peer group for our oldest. It had been such a struggle socially for my son in school- one time the class was assigned to write about their best friend, and he had nobody to write about that year. He finally wrote about his little brother, though the two were not close in age. Not to sound snarky, but I wonder which of you would have gone out of your way to befriend him if he sat next to you in class? Some kids are going to be "different" or "weird" no matter where they are. </p>

<p>Our younger son enjoys attending the myriad activities sponsored by our homeschool support group, and he has taken group classes, played sports, and had many unstructured playdates. He is comfortable with people of different ages, genders, and races. He's very popular with homeschoolers and schooled kids alike. </p>

<p>Some of you may have the mistaken notion that homeschoolers stay home all day and don't interact with others. Actually, there probably are some that do it that way, but I don't know any of these families. We have MORE time than the average bear to socialize, as the kids are pretty efficient at getting their bookwork done. Generally, we do school in the mornings and have social time in the afternoon several days a week. In addition to that, we are out and about in the community when other kids are in school. We are always going to the library, volunteering at the local radio station, taking various lessons, shopping, having playdates, helping at our food co-op... My husband jokes that we're never home! </p>

<p>Just my two cents.</p>

98

<p>people homeschool to shelter kids from being bullied/exposed to taunts (usually really sensitive kids to...). They also do it so that their kids can get as much sleep as possible and get as little outside human contact as possible...</p>

99

<p>Rellielou, well said!</p>

<p>paulfoerster, I'm sure anti-homeschool association is looking for someone with your extreme insight and wisdom. Come, tell us how to create a utopian world.</p>

100

<p>Wow, it sure does seem like there's a lot of stereotyping going on! From the various posts, it sounds like a lot of people have the misconception that homeschooled kids stay home all day and don't socialize!</p>

<p>While that is true of SOME homeschooling families, it is certainly not true of all of us!</p>

<p>Perhaps the reason for the myth is that a large percentage of homeschooling families do so for religious reasons. It is true that some religious folks believe in 'sheltering' their kids 'from the real world.'</p>

<p>However, that is NOT a trait of homeschooling, but of their religious views!</p>

<p>Case in point: one of my son's girlfriends was not allowed to go anywhere with anyone, not even female friends, for religious reasons. She was not allowed to wear pants, but had to wear dresses all the time. Though she went to public school, it was difficult for her to socialize much because of those restrictions. (Don't ask me how she managed to see my son!) So this shows that religious restrictions can exist in both homeschool and public school situations.</p>

<p>Our family is in the minority of homeschoolers who did NOT homeschool for religious reasons, so we totally do NOT fit the stereotype. When he was 4, I enrolled him in a private preschool (that we couldn't really afford) because I wanted the very best education for him. At that time, I thought that homeschooling was nuts!</p>

<p>This private preschool assured me that they would work with him at his level. By kindergarten, he was reading Charlotte's Web (a 4th grade book) yet was forced to sit with the other kids learning the alphabet. </p>

<p>That's when we decided to homeschool.</p>

<p>My son took gymnastics lessons, martial arts, various workshops like rocketry, did Robotics in middle & high school...and, most importantly, attended a homeshool co-op twice weekly up until 10th grade, when he started attending community college thru their dual-credit program.</p>

<p>In all fairness to the religious homeschoolers, many of them now (at least in the larger cities) have co-ops, in which the parents share in teaching supplemental classes. This can make all the difference in the world! It truly is the best of both worlds...they get a taste of the classroom environment yet remain in control of their education. My son took classes in drawing, painting, sculpting, cartooning, speech, drama, piano, logic, chemistry with lab, journalism, economics, Shakespeare...the sort of classes that are difficult to teach at home. The co-op also offered the higher maths which are excellent for parents who might not remember their algebra or trig.</p>

<p>These co-ops are sometimes known as 'hybrid schools.'</p>

<p>The only drawback is that most of them, to my knowledge, are religious. That's why my son had to leave in 10th grade. He was raised spiritually eclectic, exposed to the various truths to be found in all the different religions, and couldn't handle the rigid dogma at the co-op. It was a shame, really, because he had friends there and it was a pleasant, safe environment in which 9th graders socialized with 12th graders and they were all very close-knit. Those who shared the religious views fit in nicely. I always wished that there were more non-Christian homeschoolers who could follow that model, but alas, I have not yet found them.</p>

<p>Anyway, at that time (10th grade) we gave him the choice to go to public high school, since his social circle had just been uprooted. He considered it...for about 10 minutes! He simply did not want to give up his freedom! He was accustomed to spending a couple of hours a day on structured schoolwork. Yet, this kid has always excelled in virtually every test he's taken, so he certainly did not lack for academics. It's just that they learn it much more efficiently when it's taught one-on-one or in a small group, and they have the freedom to work at their own pace.</p>

<p>As for socialization: My son can debate adults on a huge range of topics, and is, more often than not, more knowledgeable than they are. (In fact, sometimes I ask him, how do you know so much about that? I honestly don't know where he learned some of this stuff about history, politics, science, etc. Yet he learned it, and he retained it, because he learned it when he was INTERESTED in it...) He now has a job selling and fixing computers and is the top salesperson at a very large electronics store, even though he's the youngest. So please do not assume that all homeschoolers lack social skills!</p>

<p>It is true that it takes more effort to get the kids out when they're homeschooled. The parent does have to put forth the effort. It's easier to just let the school take care of everything. So homeschooling is not for everyone. Just as some public school parents are very involved with their kids' lives and some are not, so it is with homeschooling. </p>

<p>Also, those who homeschool for religious reasons may tend to favor keeping their kids sheltered and limited to only church activities, while those who homeschool for other reasons may tend to get their kids exposed to a broader variety of social situations. Since we fall in the latter category, I encouraged my son to meet lots of different people of various ages, ethnicities, and religious and political views. I found this healthy for him.</p>

<p>Homeschooling has more strengths than it does weaknesses. Provided the parents make sure the kid has lots of activities, they will likely be BETTER socialized than their public school counterparts, because they won't be stuck with only the same-aged kids, and they won't be stuck in an environment in which they get in trouble for TALKING!!!</p>

<p>The only major weakness I encountered with homeschooling was test-taking skills. There was no need for testing, since we always knew whether he was learning or not. So when it came time for college-entrance tests, we had to do some preparation. But that's not really a big deal. There are plenty of books for that.</p>

<p>As for college, since my son started cc in 10th grade, he was able to apply as a transfer student, so he had no troubles there. This scenario had its pros and cons. The con was that he was not able to take advantage of the full-tuition offers he received for being a National Hispanic Scholar Finalist, since he was not considered a freshman. (I wish I'd known then what I know now and I might not have let him graduate a year early.) The pro was that he now has 36 hours of college credit, in what is supposed to be 12th grade.</p>

<p>I know that homeschooling was a good fit for my son. He is a fiercely independent thinker, and doesn't conform easily. I really do believe that conventional schooling would have quashed his spirit.</p>

<p>I used to work at an educational testing company (one of the major ones in the country), and I was appalled at how they routinely let gifted kids fall thru the cracks. The system was simply not set up to acomodate them. There was no mechanism to deal with 'thinking outside the box' on standardized tests.</p>

<p>Well, my son thinks outside the box all the time! I consider this a strength - a trait often found in successful people. So no way did I want that beaten out of him by the system.</p>

<p>Bottom line is that homeschooling may not be for everyone, but I do wish that people would learn more about it before they criticize it. Statistically, homeschoolers do better academically than public-schooled kids, across the board. This is not necessarily an indication of social skills, but neither can you assume that they don't have social skills!</p>

<p>I know homeschoolers who are outgoing and vivacious and will readily talk to anyone, and others who are shy and introverted. Oh, wait, the same can be said of public-school kids!</p>