<p>And he's no baby either, so you'd better heed your own words and be respectful.</p>
<p>Byerly and I kid around a lot; I'm not going to lie. I'm also not lying when I publicly profess my LOVE for Princeton University!! :D He knows that it's all part of my "healthy adjustment." I still have respect for Harvard and the other Ivies and I know he does as well.</p>
<p>Thanks AP... and don't mind the tiresome, humorless and disrespectful adjunct perfesser!</p>
<p>Just clarifying: I am not an "adjunct perfesser". I am a tenure-track associate professor.</p>
<p>"Fight between Harvard and Yale"? What fight? This whole thread's little more than a battle that's wholly within the Yalie psyche - i.e between the instinct for reality and the imagination that their school is somehow at par with the one and only "Cream-son". </p>
<p>Bash Harvard as much, and for as long, as you want, and you still won't so much as dent its unequaled global brand. That's the hard, if painful, reality Yalies and coming to terms with the same may represent a crucial first step in "closing the gap", at least psychologically.</p>
<p>Huh? Whadahesay?</p>
<p>posterx - what Kyabazinga is trying to say is that Yallies can whine all they want about what's wrong with Harvard and how Yale is better, but the name "Harvard" still carries more weight than the name "Yale" does. </p>
<p>Whether it's justified or not.. that's what the complaining is about!</p>
<p>what if we’re looking for elitism, which school would give us the best experience? harvard, yale, princeton, dartmouth, or columbia?</p>
<p>Elitism? Princeton.</p>
<p>I’m not sure if the OP was totally unbiased and without hatred for Harvard (sarcasm, it’s obvious). Also, I have not read a majority of the comments (it’s a HUGE thread) but this is what popped into my head:</p>
<p>Both student bodies feel the same way about their respective schools (generalization, I know there’s exceptions). I think when it comes to these two schools, although Harvard seems to have the “ultimate prestige” factor going, I feel that you’d be hard-pressed to find anybody who would scoff at attending Yale, for goodness’ sakes they’re both excellent. </p>
<p>To me, it comes down to personal choice about the campus feel because the academics seem just about equal; for individual departments this may vary. I personally got a cold, unhappy feeling in Boston (in the summer time) when I visited there, but I didn’t actually get to check out Harvard. On the other hand, I like Conn. and this may be one reason for me to prefer one school over the other. My opinion may change after formally visiting both schools, but that’s where I stand right now. BTW, I’m not ‘hating on’ either school because I’m looking into both!</p>
<p>Good night everyone! :)</p>
<p>I think you would have to go with Princeton for elitism because of the eating clubs. </p>
<p>As for prestige, the NYT’s Findings column is about why we “buy” prestige items when they aren’t actually that important compared to what you actually do and how you actually are. In blunt terms, if Joe Bozo thinks Podunk is the best school in the world, why in God’s name should that matter to me? If the average person thinks Harvard when asked to name the most “prestigious” school, why should that matter to me? I’m not average. I’m not running for office and don’t need average votes. I deal with people who honestly don’t give a damn about SAT scores and degrees because they know who is smart and who is book smart, who can think and who can learn from books. In the groups that matter, no one cares if you’re Harvard, Yale, Princeton or, frankly, any other school from anywhere in the world - unless you’re joking around, unless there’s some athletic contest at stake. </p>
<p>There are places where identity matters. It truly helps to be a Townie in Boston politics because if you don’t have a story - “I grew up on the toughest street in Somerville” - or an ethnic connection, usually Irish but also Italian, then you have to earn your way into their world. Identity matters in boardrooms and conference rooms less and less because the world has become more of a meritocracy. Having Harvard or Yale on your degree doesn’t make you the smartest person at the table because smarts come from all over and the only connection it has with success is that you are intelligent and motivated enough to get that degree. </p>
<p>There’s an old saying and I don’t know the derivation that a Yale man - it was only men then - should be discovered. You can take that many ways but one meaning is you shouldn’t advertise your degree because you should be advertising your abilities. Then let them ask where you went to school, because then they’ll want to know about you.</p>
<p>An interesting-sounding book by a survivor of Princeton:</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/18/books/18masl.html?hpw[/url]”>http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/18/books/18masl.html?hpw</a></p>
<p>“Whiz Kid in College, Hold That Attitude!,” this review by Janet Maslin (Wow, is she still around?) considers this memoir by one Walter Kirn, about the games for getting into the meritocracy being precisely that: games. </p>
<p>The feeling that one is secretly a fraud and is going to be found out is, I think, pretty widespread.</p>
<p>I’d choose Yale over Harvard any day of the week. Unfortunately, I was a bad high school student and didn’t shape up until college, and transferring to Yale is damn near impossible.</p>
<p>umm… as a Yale student, i can honestly say that i think Yale takes its reputation as being more “fun” than harvard too seriously…to the point that they’re like TOO liberal. there are basically no restrictions on anything here. its almost ridiculous. a kid who lives in my entry way (im a freshman) basically got so drunk the other weekend that he ended up in yale hospital, and the dean gave him an excuse from taking his final exam, his health insurance covered all the bills, and no one told his parents. he basically said he was REWARDED for illegal behavior. which is true. a sophmore died here of alcohol poisioning the morning after halloween, and kids were basically just like, “OH WELL lets go PARTY NEXT WEEK.WOOOOO!”
so i think that before people go on and on about how much “fun” yale is, they should keep in mind how out of control it is. in the past month, i think the police have been to my entryway 4 times, whether its to bring home really drunk kids wandering the streets or to shut down parties and book kids smoking marijuana. i mean, people could always say that this stuff “happens everywhere because its college”, but i feel that at least at other schools they seem to care more and try to enforce rules, where as yale is too busy trying to seem “cool” to do that.</p>
<p>To be honest, I think that Yale recognizes the difficulty and danger in attempting to restrain behavior that will occur anyway, and realizes that being accepting of it is conducive to student safety. I don’t think it’s an active attempt by the administration to seem like the “cool” member of the HYP trinity.</p>
<p>Also, you are seeing freshman freed from their parents for the first time and using that to conclude it is out of control. I don’t think that situation is entirely representative of the behavior of older Yale students.</p>
<p>fluffy–Just a comment on the kid who went to DUH. The reason Yale doesn’t tell the parents is so people will bring fellow students to the hospital. If you’re worried about your parents finding out, you might not go to the hospital when you really need to go. As a freshman, I had no problem going to my freshman counselor when someone in my entryway was extremely intoxicated and needed to be hospitalized. I knew the froco would not punish the underage drinkers (which would have made the decision to report the problem more difficult) and I knew the student would not have negative family reverberations. He got his stomach pumped, spent the night in the hospital, and never partied so hard again. I echo amciw in saying that Yale cares more about safety than punishment.</p>
<p>you guys are missing the point of what i’m saying. instead of trying to act like you know everything just because i mentioned i am a freshman, you should READ what i’m saying. i understand that yale wants kids to go to DUH if they are feeling the affects of alcohol poisioning and BLAH BLAH BLAH. i got that whole speech during camp yale in august. the point is, at other schools, they at least try to enforce SOME sort of control over the situation so that things don’t get COMPLETELY out of hand. you have to admit that when your RC dean is sitting in the dining hall with you discussing how most of the students are going to get ridiculously drunk because its the only way they can have fun at a SCHOOL SPONSERED party, things are out of hand. why is it that a dance held in COMMONS, sponsored by the school ITSELF, can’t have SOME sort of control over it? this isn’t me being a killjoy or complaining about things that “they can’t control anyway”…this is me being reasonable. when 3/4ths of my entryway is in DUH, it wreaks so much of pot that i have to LEAVE my BUILDING for a few hours, and students are freaking DYING of alcohol poisoning, it seems to me that SOMEONE should say SOMETHING at SOME POINT. the kid who died wasnt a “freshman on his own for the first time”…he was a sophmore.</p>
<p>Fluffy - I hope you are expressing your concerns to people who are in a position of leadership. You have a compelling message and it needs to be addressed. I have read some of your earlier posts, and you have been articulate and insightful. This is a far more emotional issue and it is clear that you are disappointed with the drinking culture on campus. </p>
<p>I don’t think you can characterize students as being untouched by the death of a fellow student. I know my DD and others were devastated. Please respect them and his family, as we still don’t know with certainty what happened.</p>
<p>AA, I’m fairly sure the kid went to YNHH, not DUH.</p>
<p>FHP, I’m not sure how a less permissive alcohol policy would have prevented the kid from dying. People will drink excessive quantities regardless of the legality, but they will be less inclined to seek help if they know they will suffer repercussions afterward. If anything, restrictive alcohol policies create conditions more conducive to alcohol poisoning fatalities. I think the kid’s death was a result of him being poorly watched or his friend’s misjudging his toxicity - both factors independent of institutional rules - rather than Yale’s less than restrictive policies regarding drinking.</p>
<p>Regarding the freshman comment, I was just noting the pervasiveness of the “out of control” behavior is a result of them being freshman. I wasn’t saying that being older precludes such actions, but rather that freshman are especially prone to it, and thus that you are concluding it happens much more frequently in the overall Yale student body than it actually does. And seriously, has 3/4s of your entryway gone to DUH? I’d doubt that.</p>
<p>Harvard people: keep going. You’re warming me to Harvard.</p>
<p>^^From your posts on this board, it strikes me that you’d be happier at someplace other than Yale. Overt competitiveness and the need to dominate are not a big part of Yale’s culture.</p>