<p>Hmm, that almost sounded as if you were suggesting that’s blacks and hispanics don’t want to succeed because it’s just written in their nature. That ALMOST seemed that way, but i’m sure it’s not the case. =]</p>
<p>And I’m sure there are black engineers. It just only seems that there aren’t.</p>
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<p>One could similarly ask why are there so few Asian professional athletes. Granted, one might argue that US professional sports such as football tend to emphasize physical size and strength that Asians may lack, but that doesn’t explain why more Asians don’t participate in professional sports such as soccer where sheer physical strength doesn’t matter, compared to agility and footwork that Asians ought to have. For example, Cristiano Ronaldo is being paid over 9 million euro (hence, ~$15 mn) a year to play soccer for Real Madrid, in addition to many more millions in endorsements - far more than any engineer would ever make - so why can’t an Asian guy get that? </p>
<p>Note, some might point to the various successful Asian professional baseball players such as Ichiro. Yet note how these players are always truly Asian, that is to say, actually born in Asia, rather than Asian-American. Why is that?</p>
<p>The truth of the matter is that certain groups culturally emphasize and value certain characteristics over others. It’s not a coincidence that, for example, so many of the world’s beer companies were founded by people of German origin, even those that were founded in countries outside of Germany. It’s not a coincidence that so many ballet artists and choreographers are of Russian (or perhaps French) origin. It’s not a coincidence that so many of the world’s science Nobel Prize winners are of Jewish origin. It’s not coincidence that so many of the top baseball players in the world are of Dominican origin.</p>
<p>Poverty, poor schools in their neighborhoods, absurdly high rates of fatherless upbringing, and a culture that doesn’t care about education.</p>
<p>I hate saying this but it depends on where you live. What state/school do you go to? </p>
<p>I go to CCNY and we probably have the largest Black and minorities in Engineering class ‘population’ in the country. In fact, in most of my classes it’s minorities. I mean I guess overall the US has few engineers but if you look at demographics at individual states and areas, you could see the percentages vary.</p>
<p>GShine is exactly right.</p>
<p>Here’s a question to ponder: Most engineering schools have a society for black engineers and a society for women engineers. What if they had a society for white engineers and men engineers? (you’d never hear the end of that!) How about asian engineers? Maybe a society for blonde engineers or short engineers? Sure, that seems absurd, but is it not also absurd to segregate blacks and women into groups and then invite everybody else to join anyway? I can certainly see having special interest groups for various academic specialties, but not based on characteristics that don’t matter. Maybe they should just pool resources and have the “national society of student engineers” and not try to bring divisiveness to the group.</p>
<p>No, ikf725, you’ve not been paying attention for the last 50 years of US history.</p>
<p>It’s ok to discriminate against people at a whim, as long as they’re the majority.</p>
<p>The funny thing is that these minority/women societies at universities are mostly about socials and movie nights – and they get school funding for it. White/Asian/Male societies should be established and they should get funding for doing nothing as well. It’s just not fair otherwise.</p>
<p>Oh noes. Boo hoo.</p>
<p>Engineering is hard enough and engineers tend to hang with other engineers anyway (by choice or necessity.) Why close off the social environment any more than it already is? I’m pretty sure that gender and racial minorities in engineering don’t really want to isolate themselves (do they?). And if there are resources available to some students, why not share? Isn’t cooperation the basis of the many team projects assigned?</p>
<p>I am not black, hispanic, a female or even an engineer but…
Maybe these specialized societies are not about you. Gasp. It’s interesting how the posts critiquing them have managed to turn these groups to be about themselves. Perhaps they’re not trying to segregate. </p>
<p>They’re usually created, as with any group because those in said group have similar experiences or interests. A female engineer has likely experienced things directly related to her being a woman in a majority male workforce that she cannot relate to males. Other women engineers may share her experiences, concerns, etc.</p>
<p>Clearly, some posters can’t comprehend why she would want to join an organization for those in similar positions. Which is precisely why she isn’t coming to you, because you don’t get it.</p>
<p>It isn’t about excluding people; I doubt any of these groups formed with the idea of sticking it to the white males. </p>
<p>In any case, as the OP said, there aren’t many black/female/hispanic engineers. It may be encouraging to some to be around others who they don’t have to sit and explain, and re-explain, and explain some more because they don’t get it.</p>
<p>There are all types of specialized interests group ranging from people who are left-handed to autisic writers. If you want to start a right-handed, non-autistic white male writing engineers group, then do so, but not out of “Damn, the white males are getting screwed again, life is so unfair for us” spite.</p>
<p>In response to the OP: I think that engineering doesn’t attract as many people as it should because it is a tough major that requires a ton of work, even for people who have adequately prepared themselves. Whether blacks are represented in a proportion relative to their proportion in society, I don’t really know. It may tend to differ depending on the particular school.</p>
<p>Re: women as a minority in engineering - there had definitely been social factors at play here. Young girls like math and science and are just as good as it as young boys are. Somewhere in the middle school years, girls have traditionally lost interest in these subjects and therefore closed off opportunities for certain majors and careers. Luckily, there are more women teachers in the math and sciences today to serve as role models to girls. Hopefully, eventually every girl who is interested in engineering will feel comfortable preparing herself for this career path. (Okay, I’m getting off of the soap box now.)</p>
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Women in traditionally male careers had better figure out how to relate to men in the workforce. And vise verse.</p>
<p>Women (and everyone for that matter) will gain respect in their professions by being competent and easy to work with, not by whining that they have such a tough row to hoe.</p>
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<p>Those white males, always getting the short end of the stick.</p>
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<p>Quotes taken out of context are fun.</p>
<p>I did say women have experienced things that a male cannot relate to, didn’t I?
I can think of a couple of things women experience that men cannot relate to.</p>
<p>^^ As can I. But they shouldn’t whine about it or nobody will respect them. But men should whine about the lack of “unfairness” of these societies. That’s okay.</p>
<p>I don’t get what the fuss is about. None of my (white male) liberties are being stripped because of a women’s engineering society. I don’t really have a desire to join one, but judging from a post on the first page…I guess I’d be allowed if asked. I don’t care what the women’s engineering society is doing, and I’m pretty sure nobody else here does either.</p>
<p>What is the problem?
Should every single specialized group have an opposition group just so it will be “equal and fair?”</p>
<p>Children of all colors and genders should be nurtured in whatever academic areas appeal to them. But by the time a person is in college or the workplace, it is expected that they can hold their own. No whining. No favors. That’s jmho. Don’t enter a male-dominated profession if you can’t take the gender imbalance. Don’t pursue the fine arts if you can’t handle rejection. Don’t worry if you are an ethnic minority in engineering because nobody will care if you are good at what you do. </p>
<p>If support groups and bonding make people feel better, fine, but by the time you reach adulthood, you need to be able to stand on your own.</p>
<p>Sorry this has gotten off-topic. Why not more people in engineering? (1) Hard major. (2) Many who are interested are inadequately prepared. (3) It is not always clear to high school students exactly what engineers do.</p>
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<p>Yes. You know what else isn’t equal and fair? The honor roll, in high school, and now there’s the Dean’s List. There should be some sort of honor for the mediocre students and, of course, also the students who are failing. That’s not fair to just honor one group of students. </p>
<p>I also dislike how there’s an x-country club, like the Japanese club, or the Irish club, that anyone can join, but there’s no American club. I would like there to be an American club where we all speak English and discuss events in the U.S., listen to American popular music and watch American television, and act as Americans do.</p>
<p>Lastly, there should be no Engineering society or History society or English society. It should just be “the society” where everybody is automatically a member of, no matter their major. We are now segregating by major, and that is wrong.</p>
<p>That is not fair nor is it equal.</p>
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Surely you jest. There are women and minorities, in every field, who are discriminated against every day for being women and/or a minority; even if they’re the best.
Nonetheless, taking a line from Brown, you don’t get it and I honestly don’t have the patience to sit down and explain it to you.</p>
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<p>I think one of these already exist. :p</p>