<p>No, this thread was created by the OP to ask why Vanderbilt is a top 20 school in the US News rankings, and the absolute simple answer is that the US News editors decided so based on their criteria. Their criteria is explicitly stated in their rankings issues every single year. </p>
<p>The entire reasoning in the creation of this thread smacks of the attitude that there is no way in hell that some Southern school (eww!) could be considered "better" than a bunch of coastal schools.</p>
<p>my question is</p>
<p>WHY DOES INTOTHERAIN ALL CAPS HALF OF HIS POSTS. WE ARE CAPABLE OF READING YOUR POSTS REGARDLESS OF IF THEY ARE CAPPED OR NOT. </p>
<p>...oh and you got owned on the ranking thing. "WHERE DOES IT EVEN SAY THAT IT HAS TOP 20 LAW/MED SCHOOL. FACTS count opinions do NOT." ...why in USNews of course, and granted that may be what you are disputing but the fact remains, according to USNews...Vandy Law and Med are ranked top 20.</p>
<p>and why are you coming into the Vanderbilt thread trying to start something? If you dont like its ranking dont come here. If you like NYU go there. Everybody on this forum knows that the rankings provide a broad idea and after you hit the top 25 the level of education is about the same anyway, with different colleges being strong in different subjects. </p>
<p>Boxer>Intotherain</p>
<p>"whodunnit,
you're truly an idiot. don't talk if you have no idea what your saying. <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com...ord+endowmen%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com...ord+endowmen</a> t
Vandy is in the top 20 in terms of endowment. ^_^. owned?
$2.26 billion"</p>
<p>-Hey IntotheRain, you're still the idiot.
<a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7903156/%5B/url%5D">http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7903156/</a>
OWNED? If you want to complain about schools with large endowments that inflate their ranking, go complain about emory.</p>
<p>p.s. emory is a great school</p>
<p>Yes, I have been to Vanderbilt, several times, as well as to many other schools, in both professional and personal capacities over the last several years. Most recently on a college trip with my niece. We visited UVA, UNC, Duke and Vanderbilt in the South (believe me, there is no prejudice here, I am from the South) as well as a few others in the Northeast and the Midwest. We sat in on classes and talked to many students in an effort to be thorough. Frankly, I was surprised by what I saw and heard at Vanderbilt. All of the students when asked why they had come to Vandy, and what they liked about it, answered either "hot girls" or "hey, it's a top 20 school!" but no one seemed to know why (hence my original question). In my estimation, "hot girls" and wealthy alumni do not a top university make (note that I am only addressing the undergraduate program here). It really concerns me that students (with the encouragement of parents and counselors !?!) are making a pretty important decision based primarily on ratings they may not fully understand the meaning of! I work with a college age population and I have seen first hand that a prestigious name has a powerful pull on these kids, but I have also seen the negative consequences that can come with making this decision based upon name rather than real fit.</p>
<p>I have another question unrelated to the above, just curious: Is Peabody, more specifically the HOD program easier to get in to than the school or Arts and Sciences?</p>
<p>To the OP--</p>
<p>there is nothing wrong with having a wealthy student body. My friend's father got me a great internship at an investment firm. On your visit, the good-looking student body was probably mentioned because its so rare at top schools. Vanderbilt is a top 20 school because of its amazing faculty and resources, but the vibrant social life and sociable undergraduates make it a dream school for many high-school students.</p>
<p>The thread began by comparing several schools which US News makes the claim are not as good overall as Vanderbilt -- for example, Michigan and UC Berkeley, to name a few. The two I mentioned are among the best public schools in the nation and among the top 10-15 in the <em>world</em>, yet US News' formula robs them of being top 20 "overall" schools.</p>
<p>As a U of M student, every single department at our (large) university is in the top 20, most being top 5 or top 10. Yet Vanderbilt has no top 10 departments in anything, save education (Peabody is #5). Does that make sense to anyone?</p>
<p>Vanderbilt is a good school, but I don't think it has gotten to the point where it reflects the rank US News has given it.</p>
<p>"Does that make sense to anyone?"</p>
<p>Michigan is great at the graduate level. But at the undergraduate level, its acceptance rate is 50%+ and admissions process is more numbers-orientated than Vandy. The students at Vanderbilt are higher caliber.</p>
<p>for undergrad, def Vandy wins over Michigan. People look down Vanderbilt only becasue they barely hear about this school since its located in the south. Michigan's acceptance rate is 57% according to collegeboard while vandy is 35%. mid SAT score range? no need of talk, vandy wins again. Student:Faculty ratio? Vandy >>>>> Michigan. Maybe UM has better football. </p>
<p>I don't go to Vanderbilt btw.</p>
<p>You know, VUalum, I'm beginning to appreciate your posts less and less on this board. Either stop posting or get a grip on yourself. How long has it been since you've been to Vandy? Don't say "we" won't miss her when -I- happen to attend the school currently and don't have -your- opinion about the "hotness" of Vandy's girls or who is appropriate to be there. Seriously's trying to have a productive discussion of why Vandy is considered a top 20 school and you are contributing nothing to that and are in fact being insulting. Stop.</p>
<p>On topic, from my experience in the Computer Science and Math departments versus what I see from my friends at UCLA and UC Berkeley (public schools with better ranked programs), I find that Vanderbilt academics are much tighter-knit, friendlier, and just a nicer place to be. Course content may be a little less intense than the CS program at Berkeley (my compilers course only covered 5/6 of the assignments given for the compilers course at Berkeley), but we still work hard and have a chance to take more and different courses than we otherwise would. I have also found that research funding and other funding is much more available than they are at most public schools. Our professors are world-reknowned and best of all, I not only get to talk to them, I am friends with them! I am good friends with many of the professors and have found many avenues of research and doors of friendship open to me. For advanced students, they offer many opportunities - all my advanced credits applied, so I've been classified as a senior since the beginning of this year (my sophomore). The current plan is to start the master's program the middle of next year with all my undergraduate coursework complete. That would be the middle of my 3rd year at Vanderbilt, giving me a chance to graduate with my class (2008) with both a master's and a bachelor's degree.</p>
<p>Of course, there are negatives. The stereotypical fratboys and Vandy girls who have their degree paid for - there are definitely a few. Some kids definitely have the attitude that money is no object and that Daddy's connections will get them everything. I'm sure there are a few good frats/sororities (and I know plenty of decent members of these organizations) but it's just not for me. Luckily for me, those students (being those that are spoiled) are generally funneled into easier majors and classes, so I don't have to deal with them. The vast majority of the student population is kind, humble, intelligent, and generally a lot of fun to be around. You've just got a few bad apples, as you'll find anywhere.</p>
<p>Metheman, you merely repeated anything I'd read in US News. Just because a school is <em>smaller</em> does not make it better -- it just gives it an advantage in US News's formulaic ranking which uses student/faculty ratios, acceptance rates, and alumni giving rates. "Maybe UM has better football" was clearly written to be insulting to the intelligence of all readers and further discredits you as an informed writer.
The course work at Michigan is on par with Vanderbilt, but there's also all the benefits of going to a major research university. U-M's undergraduate research program (UROP) was ranked #1 in the nation, and is something I took part of my freshman year. It also has a variety of learning communities and experiences that reduce the size of a large campus to give a more "small-school feel." Not only do you get a student body with hundreds of organizations, a strong education, and the complete "college experience," you also become part of the nation's largest living alumni network at a school known for the largest research budget in the country, the largest stadium in the country, and a school worth every penny of being the most expensive public school in the nation [for out-of-staters].</p>
<p>Nice Matthew, but Vandy's better for undergrad (at least to me).</p>
<p>What undergrad programs is Vanderbilt so strong in? (let's only compare with UC Berkeley and Michigan, two of the best schools in the nation yet kept out of US News's top 20)</p>
<p>okay. vandy is overrated and overranked. no one should even deny this. the only reason your trying to dispute it is because you go there. but iam sure you know in your heart that iam right. vandy is an extremely overranked school. </p>
<p>[edited out - Mod JEM]much diff between 20 and 23? nah. also vandy should be in like the top 15. notice how it ranks all the UC schools and all the UT schools together in total endowment. ^^.pwned? also if your trying to say schools with higher endowment are ranked higher how about UMICH? it has twice the endowment of vanderbilt yet it is ranked lower in us rankings. [edited out - Mod JEM]</p>
<p>Using the 2004, 2005, and 2006 US News rankings for undergraduate programs (which is limited to only engineering and business), they are for Michigan, UC Berkeley, and Vanderbilt only:</p>
<p>From the 2004 Edition of US News:</p>
<p>Best undergraduate engineering programs
2 (tied with Stanford). UC Berkeley* 4.7 [#3 for 2005, now #2 for 2006]
7. University of Michigan-Ann Arbor* 4.4 [unchanged for 2005, now #6 for 2006]
38 (11-way tie). Vanderbilt University (TN) 3.3</p>
<p>Specialties:</p>
<p>Aerospace/Aeronautical/Astronomical
3. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor* [unchanged for 2005 and 2006]
[for 2005] 13. UC Berkeley*</p>
<p>Biomedical
[for 2005] 8. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*
[for 2005] 14. Vanderbilt University
[for 2005] 16. UC Berkeley</p>
<p>Chemical
3. UC Berkeley* [unchanged for 2005, now #2 for 2006]
[for 2005] 9. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*</p>
<p>Civil
1. UC Berkeley* [#2 for 2005, now #1 and tied with UIUC for 2006]
[for 2005] 8. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*</p>
<p>Computer Engineering
3. UC Berkeley* [#2 for 2005, now #3 tied with CMU for 2006]
[for 2005] 6. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*</p>
<p>Electrical/Electronic/Communications
3. UC Berkley* [unchanged for 2005 and 2006]
5. University of Michigan-Ann Arbor* [unchanged for 2005]</p>
<p>Engineering Science/Engineering Physics
[for 2006] 2 tied with Caltech. UC Berkeley*</p>
<p>Environmental/Environmental Health
2. University of Michigan-Ann Arbor* [#3 for 2005, #2 for 2006]
4 (tied with MIT). UC Berkeley* [#5 for 2005]</p>
<p>Industrial/Manufacturing
3. University of Michigan-Ann Arbor* [#3 for 2005, now #2 and tied with Purdue for 2006]
[for 2005] 6. UC Berkeley*</p>
<p>Materials
2. UC Berkeley* [#4 for 2005, #3 tied with Northwestern and Michigan for 2006]
5. University of Michigan-Ann Arbor* [#4 for 2005; now #3, tied with Northwestern and UC Berkeley, for 2006]</p>
<p>Mechanical
3. UC Berkeley* [#4 for 2005, #3 tied with Michigan for 2006]
4. University of Michigan-Ann Arbor* [#2 for 2005, #3 with UC Berkeley for 2006]</p>
<p>Nuclear
3. UC Berkley*</p>
<p>=============================================</p>
<p>Best Business Programs
3 (tied with Michigan). UC Berkeley* 4.5 [unchanged for 2006]
3 (tied with UC Berkeley). University of Michigan - Ann Arbor* 4.5 [unchanged for 2006]</p>
<p>Specialties:</p>
<p>Accounting
3. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*</p>
<p>Finance
3. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor* [unchanged for 2006]
4. UC Berkeley*</p>
<p>International Business
4. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor* [now #3 for 2006]</p>
<p>Management
2. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor* [now #1 for 2006]
3. UC Berkeley [unchanged for 2006]</p>
<p>Marketing
2. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor* [unchanged for 2006]
3. UC Berkeley*</p>
<p>Productions/Operations Management
4. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*</p>
<p>Real Estate
3 (tied with NYU). UC Berkeley* [now #2 for 2006]</p>
<p>Quantitative Analysis
4. University of Michigan - Ann Arbor*
5. UC Berkeley*</p>
<p>"for undergrad, def Vandy wins over Michigan. People look down Vanderbilt only becasue they barely hear about this school since its located in the south. Michigan's acceptance rate is 57% according to collegeboard while vandy is 35%. mid SAT score range? no need of talk, vandy wins again. Student:Faculty ratio? Vandy >>>>> Michigan. Maybe UM has better football."</p>
<p>MatthewM,
the onyl reason UMich has a higher acceptance rate is because its a public school and it has to accept a certain amount of in-state kids. vanderbilt is not ranked in top 10, 15, or hell even 30 in ANY area of academics. whereas Umich has top rated programs. are you going to say how good the peabody school of education is? well thats not liberal arts. OH WOW vandy has hot girls. does that make it a top university? no. the only thing vandy will ever be known for is being highly rated in playboy magazine. good job.</p>
<p>Michigan accepts 50%+. I think you are dancing around the elephant in the middle of the room. State schools are more numbers based; but even with this Vanderbilt has higher test scores and more capable students. Matthew, I don't see why you are frustrated that selectivity and student:faculty ratios are considered as a small part of a ranking (USNews). Michigan is a large state school -- no one is impressed with your long list of departments. Let me ask you this -- if you could attend a top research institute that accepted 95% of its applicants would you do it? Nobody is arguing about Michigan's graduate programs, but Vanderbilt has the stronger applicants at the undergraduate level.</p>
<p>intotherain, you keep flip-flopping. your earlier posts say that "USNews rankings are not relevant" and your last post endorses the graduate rankings to make inaccurate statements of the undergraduate progams. The bottom line is, Vanderbilt has always been a prestigious university. It has a world-class faculty and excellent resources and continues to move up in the rankings. Deal with it.</p>
<p>what im wondering is...
why are people from UC/UM coming into the Vanderbilt thread and trying to start s hit?</p>
<p>This thread makes my head hurt in the utter stupidity and useless of it. Who cares what Vanderbilt's exact numerical ranking is compared to Berkley and Michigan is? I'll admit, I didn't know that these two schools were below Vanderbilt in the US News rankings and I personally probably would have ranked them ahead of Vanderbilt. But who the hell cares? Why is this so important to people (on both sides of the argument)? You realize that there are several thousand colleges in the United States and thus the difference between being 8th and 38th is negligible in the scope of things. All three of these schools are excellent. Quit bickering, y'all sound like fops arguing over the quality of the canapes while people outside are dying of malnutrition.</p>
<p>I'm trying to finish it, I didn't start it. As someone who lives in Nashville I'm quite familiar with Vanderbilt University and almost decided to go, until I settled on Michigan.</p>
<p>I've already stated in this thread that Vanderbilt is a good school -- just not deserving a top 20 overall rank for undergrad as compared to some better schools (such as publics Michigan and UC Berkeley, although there are several other schools that are better than Vanderbilt but excluded from the "top 20"; I'm using these as prominent examples of world-class universities that were mentioned by one of the first posters). Vanderbilt has 6000 strong undergraduates -- Michigan has 6000 strong <em>freshmen alone</em>.</p>
<p>US News ranks schools the following: 25% peer assessment (the best indicator, imho), 20% retention, 20% faculty resources (30% classes <20, 35% faculty salary, 15% for highest degree in their fields, 5% student-faculty ratio, 5% of full-time faculty), 15% student selectivity, 10% financial resources, 5% graduation rate perfoamance, and 5% alumni giving rate.</p>
<p>The larger a school is, the quite obviously, lower the overall standards of admitted students are. That doesn't make them less capable. Is a 1600 SAT student any less intellectual than a 1500 SAT student? Is there a big difference with a 3.9 average GPA and a 3.8 when you have thousands of students? Nay, these differences are not significant.</p>