Will a bad GPA ruin my chances here?

Colleges & Universities A-Z Carnegie Mellon University
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<p>My GPA is not so hot. It's 3.7, which is ok, but not optimal for a school like Carnegie Mellon. Will that ruin my chances? Here is the rest of my application:</p>

<p>School: Competitive public (#100 on Newsweek ranking, #250 on Washington Post)
State: TN
Race/Gender: Asian Female
Income Bracket: 250k+</p>

<p>GPA: 3.7 UW, 4.2 W
SAT I: 750 CR, 700 M, 780 W
ACT: 34
SAT II: Haven't taken yet
Rank: Top 7%</p>

<p>AP Classes: Completed 6, passed 7 AP tests (AP Euro - 5, AP English Lit - 5, AP Calc -3, APUSH - 5, AP Physics - 3, AP Bio - 5, AP Lang - 4)</p>

<p>Senior year schedule:</p>

<p>AP Econ/Gov (We go to each class every other day)
AP Spanish V
AP Psych
AP Stat
Anatomy Honors
Great Books (Standard-level class, but I think I can get a rec letter from teacher explaining what it is)</p>

<p>Also taking Geography and Philosophy through dual enrollment.</p>

<p>Additionally, I took three college classes during the summer, with two through Gov School summer program (Religion, Music) and another through dual enrollment (Microecon). Got A's in all three classes.</p>

<p>EC's:</p>

<ul>
<li>Debate team ("Technical adviser" - in charge of handling evidence and stuff)</li>
<li>Quiz Bowl team (Restarted team, Captain)</li>
<li>Volunteered 150 hours at Youth Encouragement Services, program that works with at-risk, inner-city kids</li>
<li>Peer Tutor, 100 hours</li>
<li>Youth In Government Club - Attended Youth Legislature four years and Model UN two years, have positions (Blue Hour Floor Leader for Youth Leg, part of Secretariat for Model UN)</li>
<li>Played Cello, six years</li>
<li>"Resume adviser"</li>
<li>Math Team/Mu Alpha Theta (Uhhh...wrote prealgebra test)</li>
<li>National English Honor Society</li>
</ul>

<p>Also, I'm in the process of writing a novel. I should be done before the last of my apps get sent out. Planning to raise $75 from the books, with the proceeds going to an undecided charity.</p>

<p>Awards:</p>

<ul>
<li>National Merit Semi-Finalist</li>
<li>National Spanish Exam Gold Award (95% and above) - three years</li>
<li>Selected for TN's Governor's School for the Humanities (< 25% acceptance rate)</li>
<li>Top 5 in National History Bee for TN</li>
<li>Top 10% for school during last three years</li>
<li>AP Scholar with Distinction (lol)</li>
</ul>

<p>Other:</p>

<p>Downward trend. ): I had an incredibly rough year last year, unfortunately. I am planning on making this up through my midyear reports. If they don't reject me before then, that is.</p>

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<p>Is that your GPA without freshmen year? (They don’t count freshmen year)</p>

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<p>They don’t? My non-freshman year GPA would be a lot worse. That would be the only year I had straight A’s.</p>

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<p>Yeah, typically freshman GPA is not counted in the re-calculated GPA they use for admissions. At least, that has historically been the case.</p>

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<p>You didn’t say which major.</p>

<p>The AP Calc and AP physics grades of a 3 are bad - won’t sugar coat it for you. Why you didn’t take the SATII Math IIC and Physics is weird. </p>

<p>3.7 is low- but not for a female.</p>

<p>Not great – but which college/major ??
SCS not a chance
CIT maybe
MCS maybe
HSS no problem</p>

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<p>All of your stats are higher than mine and I got in. I think you’re fine!</p>

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<p><i>The AP Calc and AP physics grades of a 3 are bad - won’t sugar coat it for you. Why you didn’t take the SATII Math IIC and Physics is weird. </i></p>

<p>I guess they aren’t very good. Those are hardly my strongest subjects. I didn’t taken those SAT II’s yet because I haven’t taken any of those yet. I want to do Econ (HSS), so I don’t really think those will be a big issue for me.</p>

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<p>Don’t worry about AP scores. They don’t look (or care at least) unless you choose to submit them for credit.</p>

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<p>You need SATII in math at CMU to be a competitive applicant- even for Econ.</p>

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<p>I didn’t realize that you needed a SAT II in Math to apply. I’ll rethink what SAT II’s I want to take.</p>

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<p>Read the instructions:</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.cmu.edu/admission/forms/2012/apply_freshman12.pdf[/url]”>http://www.cmu.edu/admission/forms/2012/apply_freshman12.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Tepper students need strong math preparation -it says so in the instructions, and requirements are an SATII in math plus science although science is flexible.</p>

<p>Your math grades will be a concern. There’s no shortage of females at TEpper-- so any advantage previously noted as a female only applies at CIT, SCS, MCS.</p>

<p>NOt trying to bust your bubble here-- you should apply, but note this is no slam dunk given the math scores and lack of SATII. You need to be over a 700 for safety. While AP scores aren’t required, they are reported on the common ap (and possibly on what your high school sends out) - a 3 in Calc for CMU is concerning.</p>

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<p>A poor AP Calc grade can be explained by a poor teacher or poor test day. You need a good score on the Math II to let them know that your basics are good and, luckily, it is a test for which you can do a lot of preparation. Get the official SAT II book from the college board, and take a test to see what is involved. If you need a lot of refreshing and prep for Math II, get a tutor or take a class. It is actually easier for kids fresh out of precalc and has only a few killer problems. Mainly you need to be familiar with the material and fast, very fast. HSS does not require the math exam but you should submit two other scores. If you are a non-english speaker, the slam dunk on your native language SAT II is a given and an easy 800. You say you are asian: there are SATII in Korean, Chinese, Japanese…my D is taking the spanish with listening in November to give her one good score on an SAT II.</p>

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<p>I got a 3 in calc because I was forced to drop the class in the middle of the year by my parents.</p>

<p>I could take SAT II Chinese, but I haven’t taken the language in a class setting for years, so I’ve forgotten a lot of the reading. And not getting a 780 or so just looks incredibly bad, especially when you indicate you’re a native speaker. I think I’mjust going to take Spanish instead.</p>

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<p>Take a practice test before you sign up for spanish SAT II. So many native speakers take the language tests that unless you get an AP-5 in spanish you are not going to get a high score on the SAT II. The colleges will give you some leeway as a non native speaker but anything less than a 650 is not helpful. My D took the AP test along with all the other native speakers and they all get 4s and 5s but the AP spanish non native generally get 3-4s. It isn’t fair that the native speakers skew the curve but that is the way it is…</p>

<p>Why did your parents make you drop a calculus class? Dropping out of a math class is more harmful than the low score. Now you are not even taking a math–except stats which some schools do not count as math. Does this mean that you only have 2.5 credits of hs math? This may be a problem for admission to many universities that require 4 credits of HS math. Even if stats are counted you could be short a .5 credit. You need to talk to your counselor about this before you apply to any universities.</p>

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<p>Your GPA is fine - see [Admission</a> > Admission Statistics](<a href=“Home - Computing Services - Office of the CIO - Carnegie Mellon University”>Home - Computing Services - Office of the CIO - Carnegie Mellon University)</p>

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<p>Maybe your daughter’s teacher simply isn’t rigorous enough. Despite seeming like an easy subject, AP Spanish is an INCREDIBLY rigorous test. Next to Calculus and Physics, AP Spanish the class that has been the most difficult to me, no doubt in relation to the level of preparation needed. However, I believe such hard work has paid off, as my teacher has not had a single 3 in the last several years. Also, I bet if I looked at statistics by race, I’d find that a significant amount of high scores are from Asian and non-Latino white test takers. </p>

<p>Getting a 650 is also just above the mean, not really what a school like Carnegie Mellon is looking for.</p>

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<p>I had a really bad grade and they were concerned about my GPA. I assure you, it was an incredibly hard class, and I probably wouldn’t have gotten a very score. Even my first semester, I was very happy with getting a C+. Although I had a big fight with my parents about it, I guess it was for the better that I was no longer taking such a difficult class and had more time to focus on other things.</p>

<p>Why in the world wouldn’t a college count Stat AP as a math? It might not be the hardest thing in the world, but I’m sure it’s more rigorous than a lot of other things that they accept for math credit, especially given the level of rigor it is taught by my school. </p>

<p>Also, I don’t want to sound rude, but I don’t understand how you think I could’ve taken Calc AP but not have enough math credits to graduate. Is it normal where you come from where people skip entire levels of high school math? I have already taken four years worth of math beforehand given at a high school level (two in middle school and two in high school), so I am fine. </p>

<p>I guess your kid(s) were fine arts people and math was never something you had to give them much thought.</p>

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<p>I respectfully disagree with fineartsmom.</p>

<p>The OP said Tepper—and the admissions instructions read Math plus a science preferred. The OP will be competing with others submitting these scores demonstrating and ability to handle the rigorous and quantitatively/analytically driven curricula at Tepper. Handing in language SAT in lieu of the science is not all that impressive - especially if it’s simply an Asian Applicant taking Chinese or Korean just to have an 800 - -that doesn’t show academic preparation, that just shows you speak two languages.</p>

<p>If you want a spot at Tepper-- do well on your Math SAT II to balance out the 3 on the AP Calc. If you dropped the class midyear, then the class isn’t even on your transcript-- so it will look like you “self studied” for the exam. You should jot a note somewhere in your common ap or have your GC state that the school required you to take the exam. And for goodness sakes, please don’t tell any Adcom in writing, on an application or an interview that your “parents made you blah blah blah” - doesn’t look good for lots of reasons which we will not dwell on. If you need to explain why you dropped the course-- just say you had to drop the class and you are retaking it this year (and hopefully your mid-year calc grade will be an A-- which will vindicate the junior year math stuff). Sorry- Tepper is quantitative and you need to have the stuff on paper to show you can hack it.</p>

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<p>This reply is just as confounding as fineartsmom’s.</p>

<p>First of all, the class is still on my transcript. I received a copy, and the class still counts towards my GPA .</p>

<p>Why would I say that the school required me to take the exam? My principal wouldn’t let me take it in the first place, actually, and it took a bit of a hassle to get him to let me. </p>

<p>Getting an A on that Calc class is a miracle. Believe me, that class is genuinely tough, and it’s something that very few of our top math students can do. (However, if I lived a couple of miles over, I probably could’ve gotten an A in our neighboring schools’ calculus AB class). I’m confounded by what made you think I was retaking the class anyways, because I explicitly stated I was taking Stats AP this year, which I guess isn’t a “real” math.</p>

<p>I never indicated that I wanted to go to Tepper. In fact, just like with saying I was taking AP Stats, I said that I wanted HSS. Tepper doesn’t seem to even offer an undergraduate economics degree.</p>

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<p>OP…calm down and re-read the responses that people took the time to send you. You asked for feedback…accept gracefully or ask for clarification if something doesn’t sound right. If you don’t like the responses, you can ignore them, but there may be some gems of advice in there that may serve you well.</p>

<p>AP spanish IS a tough test and particularly tough for non native speakers. It is easy for my daughter because she is a native speaker. She and S went to school abroad and S took the AP spanish and spanish SAT II without any class or prep precisely to get (what is for him, the easy high scores). AP English for him was a nightmare for the same reason it will be a walk in the park for you. Frankly, these tests are like some type of rigged game and you have to figure out the strategy and combination of tests that presents you in the best way and still meets the university or program requirements. For example, at our school, they advise the non-native spanish speakers to be very well prepared and cross their fingers when they take the spanish SAT II…or take english lit if they need a high score on an SAT II. </p>

<p>The math/stats remark was not a personal insult (you need to read these responses carefully!!!) …it is just reality. Quite a few universities and programs do not treat stats as a math class. Many do. All the advice you are getting from here is check carefully the requirements of the university and the program you are applying to. If you don’t meet minimum requirements, you need to either have that addressed by your counselor (extenuating circumstances) or apply elsewhere.</p>

<p>As a PhD economist with a specialization in econometrics, I live and breathe stats and it is not math (lots of math symbols and numbers…but a different discipline entirely). Whatever the college says…math is not stats and stats is not math. When you return to taking calculus in college after a year hiatus from math it will be a shock. Thus, if you want to study engineering or physics or even economics, there may be some concern about not finishing calculus in high school since the program may be looking for AB calc at a minimum. CHECK with your college or program. Your preferences were not clear in your post in terms of the colleges you were thinking of applying to so if the advice was not appropriate to your goals…well, ignore or clarify…smile and nod and learn to be gracious in accepting help (even when you don’t perceive it as helpful). This advice will get you further than anything related to standardized tests…</p>

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<p>Sorry. I didn’t want to sound angry; I was just incredibly confused. Some of the answers really did seem nonsensical to me.</p>

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<p>I know AP Spanish is a tough test. That’s why my teacher is preparing our class so much for it. The class is incredibly intense. </p>

<p>I also understand why the SAT II Spanish could be hard too. However, it also seems to me that it is easier to get a good percentile compared to the other SAT II language tests, and I have performed quite well on Spanish standardized tests. (Like my posted profile said, I am a three time National Spanish Exam Gold Award winner) Maybe I won’t do very well, but that’s why I’m taking the SAT II’s twice.</p>

<p>Also, I’ve already taken both AP English classes. Got a 5…and a 4. Oops. No English this year though. Yay?</p>

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<p>What kind of college requires AB as a minimum? Are they just going to automatically deny entry to the thousands of students who don’t have access to AP programs? What about people who don’t have access to accelerated math programs? The idea that any school would require a specific AP class is absolutely ridiculous. I’m sure there’s a even few people at a math-related field at MIT who lacked taking AP Calc, if only because of their circumstances. </p>

<p>And yeah, yeah, I know that calc is the only real math, but Stat, not Calc, is what I’m taking, and nothing is going to change that. If Carnegie Mellon is going to reject me over that, then fine. </p>

<p>Yeah, yeah, I understand the purpose of sucking up and being polite in real life. But I’m not sure why I need to accept nonsensical advice from a stranger over an internet message board. Maybe practice makes perfect, but being on College Confidential is hardly practicing for anything. I do appreciate your attempts to help me, but the only thing I’ve learned is that I need to take the Math II and that my 3 grade on Calc is supposedly abysmal.</p>