<p>Other viable midwestern safeties might include Kalamazoo (little personal knowledge, but a friend's son recently chose it and is happy, and its in "CTCL"), Beloit, and St. Olaf (which is a couple miles from Carleton and visitable on the same trip as Carleton and Macalaster).</p>
<p>breathing, another possible safety would be Earlham. My son's at Carleton (and I agree with others' assessment on its low preppy quotient); he loves it there (starting sophomore year)--friends, academics, professors, everything has either met or exceeded our high expectations. However, Earlham was his safety, and he told me that was the hardest one to write the thanks-but-no-thanks letter to.</p>
<p>And I meant to also say that one advantage of Carleton's trimester system is that a student can sample (or make a meal of) many different disciplines, which is great for the seriously curious student. With three classes every 10 weeks, you can dip your big toe into a lot of subjects--or take a dive into a few.</p>
<p>If your daughter can get into those selective liberal arts colleges why has she ruled out the ivy league schools as those are probably also within her reach? Or at least just as much of a crap shoot.</p>
<p>My son will be a sophomore in college this fall and when he was searching he thought that he'd like a LAC because he thought a LAC would be more intimate and, frankly, I think he thought the Ivies would be too intimidating. He visited Amherst, Middlebury and Bowdoin and liked them but something was missing, even to his 18 year old eyes.
He ended up going to a large Ivy (partially because some of the LAC's rejected him, ha!) and he likes being around the grad students which make up the bulk of the students and often teach his classes. He doesn't "party" with the business school, law school and med school students but their presence and the types of special visitors that their grad schools attract has made my son's college experience much broader than it otherwise would have been – his summer internship was associated with the business school. He would eventually like to go to grad school and being around grad students all the time makes that seem much more "real" to him. For example, his freshmen resident tutor was a PhD candidate and his resident tutor this year will be a third year law student living just down the hall - that's alot of wisdom to tap into.</p>
<p>Looking back, I can see that the LAC’s give a kid their version of a great education but the large universities (don't have to be Ivies) have many of the same benefits plus things the LAC’s don’t offer.</p>
<p>Just my two cents...............</p>
<p>OneDown&OneToGo: This may be true of your son, but some people really know that they want LACs--and don't find "something missing" in them. Her daughter seems really into the idea of an LAC and doesn't want a campus bigger than 3000 students, so it makes sense that she's not looking at the ivies. Not to say that she necessarily should't throw an application at, say, Brown or Dartmouth (the ivies most known for having an LAC-like atmosphere) and then check them out closer if she gets in, but the ivies aren’t for everyone--and their are some benifits of an LAC that a larger school just can't provide (and visa versa, of course, but if you want the LAC feel, the benifits of a larger university just don't seem worth it). I say this as someone who applied to Wes early instead of Brown after a long decision making process, and I've never looked back-- despite it's benifits Brown was just too big for me, and it's small for a uni!</p>
<p>Back on topic:
Another possible safety is Goucher college in MD, which is along the artsy/alternative lines of Vassar, Bard, Wesleyan, etc, and is one of the "Colleges that Changes Lives." Very pretty campus is a suburb outside of Baltimore.</p>
<p>If she/you are willing to look at the West cost, Lewis+Clarkcould be another good safety—it’s right outside of Portland, which is a great area for outdoor activities.</p>
<p>for a female applicant, vassar is just as selective as carleton.</p>
<p>momrath, peace indeed. And I apologize to the OP for hijacking this thread briefly for our inevitable argument over alcohol. Although I do feel compelled to point out that, much to my dismay, Williams doesn't offer sub-free (or any other theme-type) housing, viewing it contrary to the integrated community ideal.</p>
<p>Seconding the recommendations of Beloit, Earlham, Goucher, and L&C.</p>
<p>And if Lewis and Clark is on the table with its west coast location..... by all means don't miss giving Whitman some consideration. It's much more selective than L&C, and is considered probably the second best LAC on the west coast after Pomona. I've known several kids who went there who are just over-the-moon about it. While it's pretty selective, it's not as much a crapshoot as Amherst, Williams, Middlebury, etc.</p>
<p>
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It's much more selective than L&C, and is considered probably the second best LAC on the west coast after Pomona.
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</p>
<p>I think some Claremont McKenna and Reed students would probably argue with that ;) But yes, Whitman is another good one that is safer. Also, if she decides she's interested in city schools (which I think would make the outdoors-y stuff harder, but maybe not), Occidental in LA is another one that I liked a lot, and would most likely be a safety (though I don't know what its stats have been in the last couple of years).</p>
<p>Has anyone mentioned Colorado College yet? It has a very unique scheduling system (the block plan), but if your daughter looks into that and likes it, it seems like it could be a good fit, and it’s not as selective as the big name east coast LACs, while still being a very good school.</p>
<p>Maybe your D shouldn't be applying to any of these schools ED....IMOH ED is for kids who have their minds made up and won't have "buyer's remorse" if they get the ED acceptance and have to withdraw their other apps. (a concern I have for my own D--you should have seen prom gown shopping!) Everyone here has brought great info and perspective, and suggested some other great schools, but you and D visited these schools and she hasn't come up with a clear leader. Just something to think about.</p>
<p>However, the ED process helps students decide and really craft an application. My D says it helped her enormously because GC wasn't so swamped, she was done sooner, etc. </p>
<p>Perhaps EA is a good option. Bard has several EA options, and an acceptance in hand is a great boost for senior year.</p>
<p>Keilexandra: We really like the fact that Williams has no themed houses or special dorms. It does foster a cohesive community. And it also leads to more diversity in friendships.</p>
<p>However, if Williams isn't for you, that's fine. There are many other school that seem to better meet your criteria.</p>
<p>Carleton, for sure.
Check out Grinnell and Kenyon. Maybe look at Kalamazoo, Beloit, Lawrence in Wisconsin.
These are all midwestern, since that's what I know.</p>
<p>^^ I'm all in favor of a cohesive community--like anything, the Williams housing system has its pros and cons. I just wanted to mention it since another poster had suggested opting for sub-free housing as a way to avoid excessive drinking (not a sure-fire way, obviously, but perhaps more effective than not opting in).</p>
<p>That was me that mentioned sub-free housing... and, no, I didn't know Williams did not offer that option. It's good information to have out there. My son gave some careful consideration to Williams, but he didn't know sub-free housing was not an option. He ended up applying elsewhere anyway, though. </p>
<p>In any case, aside from some individual schools that might not offer sub-free housing, I believe it's pretty common and can be a great option for kids who prefer less drinking in their midst.</p>
<p>Have you thought about Weslyan. I received my masters from there and it sounds like a good match.</p>
<p>If your D would consider a women's college, she should look at Smith College. It has a wonderful supportive, caring sense of community. Its known for academic excellence and small classes. Students are provided with terrific advising and mentoring and available, committed professors. Smith creates women leaders, and has a strong, involved alumni network.</p>
<p>Smith is part of a 5-college consortium (with Amherst, Hampshire, Mt. Holyoke and Univ Mass). You can take classes at any. There is a free shuttle bus to get to classes at the other campuses.</p>
<p>Whitman is also a great school if she wants to be on the West coast.</p>
<p>I second the suggestion of looking at St. Olaf--it's right there next to Carleton, gorgeous campus, students are completely in love with it (even as Harvard grad. students years later), it is one of the Colleges that Change Lives, higher acceptance rate due to its being less known and Lutheran (Lutherans are BIG on education, and good at it), student body of just under 3,000 so it is slightly larger than many LACs, but I have never heard anyone mention it as being big. Brand new science bldg., lots of incentive $$ to encourage top achieving students to attend, nationally known in math, and international study, among other things. For instance, graduates of Bowdoin, St. Olaf, and Pomona could find a huge "huh?" reaction, in another part of the country, and yet find that the academic world is very impressed with their degree, anywhere within 2,000 miles of the college. (We live in a HYPMS town and our academic friends have always heard of St. Olaf, usually know a student from there, and always speak highly of the place).</p>
<p>Bowdoin, where my son has just begun, also seems to be a truly wonderful place, I would second all the above opinions on the place but do not know about any curriculum weaknesses, but maybe it shows that I am still sad that he did not choose St. Olaf........St.Olaf would be a very good and viable and attendable safety, as almost all the schools that have been mentioned are INTENSELY hard to get into. Intensely!</p>