Work experience...

Colleges & Universities A-Z Massachusetts Institute of Technology
1

<p>Recently, Ben mentioned something on the Caltech boards that made me think...</p>

<p>I have great scores on my SATs, good AP scores, great extra curriculars (hours of tutoring, science/math clubs, cultural/language clubs and honors societies), and I've worked concurrently (15 hrs/week ish) with school my entire high school career, after my father lost his job (poor guy has to put me and my twin through college at the same time). My brother's also been working, and we're hoping the combined income along with financial aid and my dad's new job this year will get us through. It wouldn't be such a problem if both my brother and I weren't going in at the same time.</p>

<p>The thing is, as a result of having worked, my grades have suffered. I'm by no means failing or near-failing (except for Art, which was the bane of my existence), but I'm a B+/A- student. I've taken the hardest class load available to me my junior/senior year (graduating with something like 13 AP credits), but my class rank is low due to my grades at my competitive school (public school, 1000 students in my class, last year we sent 5 students to MIT, in addition to a significant amount to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford). I'm around the 20th percentile.</p>

<p>How would MIT look at this? When I mention it in my essays, I can't help but feel like I'm saying "plz pity me & accept kthxbye," but in reality I've gained so much from my work experience. I'd like to show MIT that, but at the same time, I feel like its only fair I should talk about the effects on my schooling due to the fact that it's taken up such a significant amount of time and effort.</p>

<p>On my application, should I mention that work interfered with school, or should I just list both and let the admissions officers assume such? Would it sound too much like an appeal to pity if I did mention it?</p>

<ul>
<li>Timur</li>
</ul>

2

<p>They won't care about art, and you can talk about this in your essays (I would suggest writing your essays about something less boring and more creative which would make you stand out more, and then putting this in supplementary material). But I think MIT would expect you to be getting a straight-A average even while working 3 hours a day.</p>

3

<p>They might be okay with it. I worked starting my sophomore year, but during my senior year I worked 25+ hours per week to help support my family and pay for anything I needed (i.e. school stuff and college app fees). Even though my academic background was really strong before..once I took on the job, my rank significantly fell (i was still in the top 5% though). I explained the situation in my app. and I guess they were cool with it b/c I was accepted EA.</p>

<p>btw, would your twin happen to be hakan? might be coincidence, but i don't think there are many timurs with a twin.</p>

4

<p>River: That's what I was thinking, as well. But when you have 8 hours of school a day followed by three (minimum) hours of work, an hour commute, that's half your day. Give another two hours for the sum of all your morning habits, cooking, and eating, and you're left with ten hours for sleep and homework. Sleeping six hours, you have four left for homework and studying for six AP classes. I generally spent my time studying, which is evident in my exam grades. They range from 93-100. And my average on the AP exams is a 4 (rounded). This year I'm taking another 6 AP classes (full load), as well as taking two exams for which I'll be studying myself. I'm confident I'll get a 5 on at least all the ones I'm taking classes for. </p>

<p>I've taken steps to make sure my grades improve this year, including starting work later in the year (I have about one month to go) and only working at most 15 hours, instead of 15-20. My girlfriend has also moved (went off to college), so the two-three hours a week I spent with her can be dedicated to school.</p>

<p>For those of you keeping track at home, that's 40 hours a week on school, 20-25 on work, 30 on sleep, 2-3 on girlfriend, 10 on misc things from showering to to eating. Assuming the minimum for all the varying ones, that's 102 hours out of 120 in the weekdays. I mean, I get all of Friday's homework done over the weekend (even though I still work Saturdays), but as the week chugs on and on I keep lagging and lagging. Having to do physics problem banks, biology lab write-ups, computer science lab projects, reading for English, translating lines of the Aenid for Latin... it all adds up, especially when you consider I have tests to study for every week, and quizzes almost every day. I hate the busywork end of it, the homework. </p>

<p>Over the weekend I study for the AP exams I don't have classes in, as well as tutor my peers in computer science and physics.</p>

<p>Sometimes man, there just aren't enough hours in the day. Admittedly I have my vices. I spend a few hours on the weekend surfing through Wikipedia, and I know I could have broken up with my girlfriend to get those few hours each day back... but if MIT would rather I do that, then MIT isn't the school I thought it was. That would mean it wants a robot, not a student. If MIT wanted that, they could get their comp. sci department together with their MechE department, throw in some biology, chemistry, physics, and math majors and build themselves a robot that can evaluate science/math problems.</p>

<p>I'm not a robot, and I'd rather retain my humanity while I go to college. I can only hope MIT sees that. I'm not a guarentee, like most of their other applicants probably are, but I'm a damn solid investment.</p>

5

<p>Aldren: Indeed, my twin is a Hakan. I take it you went to West as well? :D</p>

<p>EDIT: message me on AIM: TCSahin. :D</p>

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<p>Yeah, I went to West..i just graduated. I know you from state last year..and i know katie.</p>

<p>I understand you're situation...I was kind of in the same rut, so I dropped latin (a highly unnecessary class considering me and jonathan were the only ones actually doing ap work...hankins was nice and all, but veal was better). I would just keep in tough with the admission people and get their advice. I informed them of my situation and they said that given my circumstances, they wouldn't hold dropping or my slowly declining rank against me (as long as I put it in the app). However, being MIT, you still have to stand out. Like River said, you need to have exceptionally creative essays. I spent freaking forever on mine making sure it was original and an accurate portrayal of me and my goals. If you need any help, just let me know.</p>

7

<p>I would love all the help I can get. Do you have AIM or any other IM service?</p>

<p>Johnathon got a 5 by the way, he's the first person at West ever to do so. To my understanding, there were 3 people doing the AP thing last year, which of the others was you? Or I guess I'm mistaken. Heh.</p>

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<p>Timur,</p>

<p>You can AIM me at 'h4x0rtang'. You shouldn't have a problem explaining yourself, and MIT would most definitely understand. They keep saying they look at the context surrounding your application, and this is part of that context. I know because I was in a similar rut last year (except my parents got sued for a million dollars, long story, don't want to get into it).</p>

<p>Feel free to IM me. I don't think it will sound like pity as long as that's not what you're asking for. Instead of talking about the problem, talk about what you're doing to solve it.</p>

9

<p>"my parents got sued for a million dollars, long story, don't want to get into it"</p>

<p>Those were your parents? Oh, if I would have known, I wouldn't have.... oh well.</p>

<p>*Albert, kindly bring me another pina colada and adjust my umbrella. Thanks.</p>

10

<p>We won the suit, River. It was unfounded and the guy was retarded. But lawyers pull a crapload of money.</p>

11

<p>oh damn.. where's the money for this pina colada coming from then?</p>

<p>*checks credit card balance...</p>

<p>*** why didn't they tell me I lost the suit?</p>

<p>I guess I am sorta retarded.</p>

12

<p>what river phoenix sued mborohovski's parents? haha im confused.. some one want to clue me in on whats going on.</p>

13

<p>They were joking.</p>

<p>Come on man, work on those critical reading skills. ;-D.</p>

<p>Oh, by the way, I just notice they retroactively changed all the SAT verbals into SAT Critical Readings. 0.o. A part of my past is gone.</p>

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<p>Work is definitely considered - we have a whole section for it on the app. It's understood that working a lot affects other things.</p>

15

<p>Being realistic though, it is very difficult to get in if you're not in the top 10% of your class. My EC told me that of those ranked, 42% were valedictorians and 90% were in the top 10%. Granted, that one statistic alone is never enough to base your admissions on.</p>

<p>Work does affect a lot of things, but how hard would it be to turn over something like 20th percentile for class rank? I realize the process is holistic, but considering the "caliber" of students that apply, what does it take to be "worth it" if your rank isn't up there?</p>

<p>I've been informed that it's not, as many believe, the minority students who make up that 10%. So that definitely means that I have a chance, but will great scores, recs, and essays make me just as competitive as the next guy? I also know that many people apply who are stereotypically "perfect" (valedictorians with perfect SATs, etc), and I know that no one has a "good chance" at MIT, but will it at least place me well in the run?</p>

<ul>
<li>Timur</li>
</ul>

16

<p>Timur,</p>

<p>It's really based on whether or not you match the school. Those with perfect scores just aren't a good match. Forget about trying to be what MIT wants, and instead be yourself. If MIT wants you and you'd fit in, you'll get in. If MIT doesn't take you, then it doesn't deserve you and/or you wouldn't have fit in.</p>

<p>I've read your essays, you know my comments on those. Stop worrying as much as you are. :p</p>

17

<p>...</p>

<p>You know what? You're right man. I've been worrying way too much about this. Hell, I know who I am, and I know what MIT is, and I'd be well off to have MIT and MIT would be well off to have me. It's up to them to see that, now. :)</p>

18

<p>Timur, it's all about context - being 20th percentile at some places is way more impressive than being 10th percentile at other places. And grades and scores are only one piece of the puzzle anyway.</p>

<p>I'd recommend talking about your job a bit beyond the "jobs" section. Most folks sacrifice extra-curriculars when they work as much as you do. It seems from reading your post above that you've remained dedicated to your extra-curriculars and sacrificed perfect grades instead. There's nothing wrong with this choice whatsoever, but I would address it somewhere in your app so the reader has a better understanding of why you made the choices you did.</p>

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<p>Also just to clarify, I didn't mean to say those with perfect scores aren't a good match, haha. I meant to say SOME of those aren't. :)</p>

20

<p>
[quote]
Admittedly I have my vices. I spend a few hours on the weekend surfing through Wikipedia, and I know I could have broken up with my girlfriend to get those few hours each day back...

[/quote]
</p>

<p>"Girl friends and Calculus are mutually exclusive"</p>