<p>Thanks for the IB response, momrath. Are you an educator? Our family lived overseas teaching at international schools earlier (why he is good at Japanese :)
We miss the caliber of HS we had there, along with many other things about the way of life.
And Itstoomuch - what is "Scottaa book"?</p>
<p>Does he actually have a chance at Amherst or Williams???
I think we have this feeling that some other species gets accepted to places like that.
If he really has a shot at these places and Dartmouth, we will have to come up with a way to make a visit trip.
Has anyone by chance been to the Dartmouth summer sports camps? They have a soccer camp that basically sounds like a tryout you pay for. It is for jrs interested in applying and is lead by the varsity coach. But it costs $700.</p>
<p>You have received input on safeties, matches and reaches. Obviously, Amherst and Williams are reaches for him, but they are so for everyone who applies. His being fluent in Japanese and having lived overseas may be a good hook for him, and may make him very appealing to those reach schools. No guarantees, but you won't know unless he applies. Amherst will pay for him to visit, if he is accepted, as I think Williams does, too. The FA packages at these schools are usually very good, in our case, cheaper than the state U.</p>
<p>Orjh, From what youve told us, Id say your son has the ability to get into any college in America, including the most selective. There are no guarantees of course but assuming that his scores end up where you project theres nothing in his profile that would keep him out and a lot that would make him a desirable candidate. </p>
<p>His intangibles like life experience, recommendations and essays will also be influential. Being a talented writer will help him convey his personality in his application.</p>
<p>So, in answer to your question, yes, your son could be a contender at Dartmouth, Amherst, Pomona or Williams. HYPSM are one notch up in selectivity but not impossibilities. Hell still need a balanced list including less selectives and sure things, but theres no reason why he shouldnt include some highly selective reaches as well. </p>
<p>I am not involved in education but my son was fortunate to attend two excellent international schools in Asia. This experience was a hook for him and would be for your son as well. That combined with his athletic ability, geographic location and academic standing would make him appealing to many topnotch schools, especially Dartmouth, Williams and Amherst where he seems to be a good cultural fit. </p>
<p>If there is a possibility of his playing sports in college, he should begin contacting the coaches now. There are many parents on this board who could give you details on how to approach athletic recruitment. But even if he isn't interested or qualified on the varsity level, the fact that he's actively involved in sports is a plus at these schools.</p>
<p>Id say the biggest challenge for your family is going to be financial. It sounds like youre borderline you may squeak by with just enough need based aid or you may need a merit boost to get over the top. In that event, finding the right balance of merit aid and academic rigor is a further complication. It's definitely doable, however, and this board is a wealth of information on what's available.</p>
<p>Do a search for name scotta, or scottaa in CC. Look at his profile.</p>
<p>Thank you all SO much! Finding the courage to post today was the best thing I've done so far as a parent getting ready for the whole college process. I may be glued to this site for awhile :)
You all have given us a new perspective on possibilities and dreams, and just reading some of your words has boosted my son's confidence. THANKS and good night.</p>
<p>orjr - to answer your question about my S2's school - he goes to Juilliard, which, unfortunately, probably won't do you any good. I do agree with many posters, though, that your S's athletics may put him in a different situation that my S1, who is not an athlete. Duke, for example, had exactly 1 scholarship that was available to him, because he was not an athlete, minority, or female. (moot point, as he was wait-listed there.)</p>
<p>The question you want to ask colleges is this: How does merit aid affect any need-based financial aid? </p>
<p>Depending on their answer, then ask: Does it replace any part in particular? What part? How do outside scholarships affect aid - both merit and need-based?</p>
<p>Also be aware that different schools meet need-based aid differently. For instance, with similar EFCs (each school figures their own number) Cornell offered my S1 a $500 grant, with the rest in loans and work-study. UVa offered him only loans and work-study. Penn offered him close to $10,000 in grant, a work-study, and no loans. And a guarantee that his "need" (as Penn determined it) would be met without loans all four years. (Guess which he picked?)</p>
<p>Many colleges have this information right on their websites, so you might be able to find this out before you even visit.</p>
<p>And to echo what others are saying about all selective schools being a "reach" -- note that my S was offered admission to several very good schools, but waitlisted at Duke. Reasons could be any of a number -- they had too many white males from Georgia. Maybe somehow they knew he liked Penn better. Or they didn't like his essay. Point is, cast a wide net.</p>
<p>orjr: Hello again! I ditto momrath - very good advice. </p>
<p>Yes to showcase camps and also the Dartmouth camp. The key is your Son's grades will make him interesting to coaches at top schools, so you want to put him in as many camps or showcase tourneys as possible where those schools will attend. My S played baseball and football. He will play football in college because he is more passionate about that sport, but was recruited a ton in baseball as well. Baseball recruiting is more similar to soccer because of the select/travel side of it which is really what matters. There are recruit camps specific to scholar athletes (Headfirst Baseball for example) and I assume you can find the same thing in soccer. Some Ivy's will have their own camps and they will list the other coaches who will attend. You can also find out by emailing the coaches and asking them what camps they recommend. You'll be surprised how many will be happy to hear from you and readily give advice! The key is you need to make contact now. My S visited Amherst and loved it, but will probably end up at Carnegie Mellon or U of Chicago for their business and econ degrees. We're narrowing...</p>
<p>Might want to look at some of the Patriot League schools-Colgate, Holy Cross and Bucknell. These 3 are easier to get into than Amherst/Williams but offer great educations and in the case of Holy Cross and Colgate very strong alumni networks that are a big plus in job placement.</p>
<p>You are all awesome. I am learning so much. I want to re-read the whole thread. My S is shy to contact coaches, but I think he should. He isn't a "star" athlete - no all-state or anything, but plays on the top level travel / club teams. He always thought academics would be his route "in". I'm hoping the next college showcase tourney in May will help us learn alot about the whole athletic recruiting game. We have alot to look at now, thanks binx for the best line: "cast a wide net".</p>
<p>OK everyone - we're back and want to update you on the work we've done. With all of your help and suggestions, we've come up with a list of 20+ schools divided by difficulty of acceptance. From here my S will take over to winnow the list down to 12 - 15 to learn more about, and ultimately maybe 9 for application.
For review - he wants a smallish, residential campus with good academics, not too liberal / granola / political, and the possibility to play sports is a plus. Have fun, study hard, not step on each other to succeed. IB diploma, 3.93uw, 2130 PSAT - not yet taken SAT. Will take Math II and Eng. Lit as his SAT II's. Very good rec. and EC, but hasn't cured cancer or anything. He will definitely study abroad and merit aid is important to us.
Here is the list - we are really looking forward to your comments, suggestions, and info:
BIG reach: Dartmouth, Amherst, Williams, Stanford, Duke, Pomona
Reach: Middlebury, Davidson, Claremont-McKenna, Emory, Whitman
Probable: WUStL
Safety: (this is the hardest) Trinity U, Gonzaga, Denison, Southwestern, Linfield
other possible safeties we don't know much about include - Whitworth, U San Diego, Point Loma, Azusa Pacific</p>
<p>We await your wisdom!</p>
<p>orjr,</p>
<p>IMO, You have not classified your reaches and matches correctly. I would say you are reach heavy and match light. </p>
<p>Furthermore, if sports are important at all, Stanford, Duke, Dartmouth, & Davidson are very high-level (Division 1) and Williams /Amherst/Midd are nipping at their heels (as top Division 3 schools). This means sports will not assist in admissions-- whereas at Trinity or Hamilton, it might help.</p>
<p>Finally, you have a heavy dose of jock/beer/snow schools (not necessarily bad, but you might want to toss in some different 'personality' schools, too, as this is so early in the process).</p>
<p>HUGE REACH = Dartmouth, Amherst, Williams, Stanford, Duke, Pomona, Middlebury </p>
<p>REACH: Davidson, Claremont McKenna, WUStL</p>
<p>MATCH = Emory, Trinity, Whitman (? maybe not, because you live nearby?)</p>
<p>SAFETY = Denison, Gonzaga, Southwestern, Linfield, etc</p>
<p>I suggest you check out some other matchy schools like Hamilton, Conn College, Kenyon. Pay attention to schools lacking 50% boys and schools lacking kids from your geographic area-- the right scenario on these two factors could bump a reach to a high match.</p>
<p>Finally I also suggest looking into a few reach schools that have different "personalities" while still not being too granola: Haverford, Rice, Occidental could all be suitable based on your S's wish list.</p>
<p>Good luck! :)</p>
<p>PS MERIT AID-- most of the schools you have on your list are not good for merit aid!! A very important thing to research.... Some of the great merit aid schools can be found on the merit aid thread...</p>
<p>Thanks, SB, we are open to all suggestions. I agree that it is much easier to spot reaches than matches. I will look at the merit aid thread.</p>
<p>Merit aid schools likely to fit?</p>
<p>Vanderbilt, Centre, Rhodes, Case Western... basically all the schools curmudgeon's daughter liked (similar kid-- high academics, a little conservative, and sporty.)</p>
<p>Thanks - I just spent some time wandering through the merit aid thread till my head started spinning. This is so much more difficult than I thought. We'll read up on all the new recommendations....</p>
<p>orjr, I think SBMom has given you good advice and some good names to research. Ill just add a few thoughts.</p>
<ol>
<li>Your son may end up with two lists: one for colleges that only give need based aid -- on the premise that your income is borderline and you may qualify -- and one for colleges that are generous with merit supplements. Yes, it is confusing, but dont despair. Its early, help is available and you seem to be as able anyone to synthesize the mountain of information thats out there.</li>
</ol>
<p>[If you already KNOW that you can't swing it without merit aid, then eliminate the colleges that don't offer it NOW. I have the impression that your financial situation is borderline workable, but if that's not the case then the sooner you face it the better.]</p>
<ol>
<li>For the three sports-oriented reaches that we were talking about Dartmouth, Amherst, Williams Id like to explain that even if your son doesnt end up as a contender for varsity, his inclination towards active ECs fits with the schools profile. Fit is very important to LACs and smaller LAC-like universities, much more than to the larger Us, like, say, Stanford. </li>
</ol>
<p>Especially at Amherst and Williams an physically active, outdoorsy kid (varsity OR club) who can bring something else to the campus community in your sons case international experience, entrepreneurial interest, journalism is a good catch as they need to cover a lot of bases with a small population so the kids tend to be multi-dimensional. </p>
<p>Again, these three plus Pomona and Stanford give no merit aid. They may be flexible with needbased aid (which is actually a disguised form of "merit") but there's a big "it depends" attached to that maybe.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Your son needs to work on developing an application strategy how does he want to present himself? Sometimes its referred to as a handle or persona. Basically what would differentiate him from the rest of the smart, talented pack. The aspect of his resume that Id be interested in hearing more about is his experience in Japan. This is less common and more desirable than you may think. It could form the basis of his essays, resume, recommendations and become a hook for him.</p></li>
<li><p>Do your best to visit and interview as many schools as possible. For small schools it makes a big difference on both sides. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>To the school because they favor kids who have demonstrated interest and can explain in their application why they want to attend. </p>
<p>To the student because s/he can get a firsthand impression of the culture of the school in the case of LACs usually quite distinctive. Because s/he can make contacts in the admissions department who will help throughout the process. </p>
<p>And especially in the case of less selectives, because s/he can see that safety doesnt necessarily mean lower quality. It IS easier initially to identify and love the super selectives, but visiting, talking to students and professors, bonding with real life kids who are thriving can really help move less selectives up in the preference order.</p>
<p>Orjr, I disappeared for a few days, and I don't have time to read the intervening pages. If he can be recruited as an athlete that puts a whole new complexion on matters - maybe what I'm reading is recruitable for DIII?
Anyway, my daughter is at Dartmouth, and other schools she looked at carefully were Rhodes, Trinity University in SA, ELon University, Univ of Richmond and Sewanee. These will all be merit possiblities. Univ of Richmond also gives fair merit aid, although around here they are not thought to be quite as generous as Rhodes. You might also want to look at Wake Forest and Furman, they can give good aid.
Rhodes deserves a close look - sports are big, generous with merit aid, and urban. Also Memphis is an airport hub, so travel is a little cheaper (Davidson is close enoug hto Charlotte to have cheaper travel too)</p>
<p>of all these schools Dartmouth, Williams, Duke, Davidson and Furman have similar flavors (although Furman definitely has much less drinking than the others)</p>
<p>Another filter: Schools with a 40/60, M/F ratio. I would imagine the chances of acceptance and aid could increase.</p>
<p>Thanks - I agree, we've been going over SBmom's info, and I'm happy to see you back cangel. I'd love to hear from you about Trinity and Dartmouth. If he is going to take the bold step of going far far away, Dartmouth (he thinks) is his dream. For some reason he is also more open to Texas than other non-coast places. Duke and Davidson are near relatives. We are trying to gather enough info. to decide which college coaches to approach, and which colleges we can visit. Probably only one trip east, so we need to make it count! But it does look like we're closing in on our list of 20+ to investigate.</p>