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<p>For many motivated students who cannot afford a suitable college, it may be more worthwhile to go to community college to save money, then transfer to finish the bachelor’s degree at the state flagship or similar school, than to go to a small low selectivity school where the motivated student may have a hard time finding a peer group or suitable course offerings.</p>
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<p>Agreed. The UVA admit probably prefers larger schools, but there would be a good deal of overlap in the caliber of students at all the schools mentioned.</p>
<p>I was going to PM this to 3great</p>
<p>but why not post it publicly the question was simple</p>
<p>how many users here are Ivy Alums and
did the site originator graduate from an Ivy or a second tier,
did he need an Ivy education to figure that there was a need for this type of information,
did he need to go to an Ivy to determine that a revenue stream exist withthe advertising.</p>
<p>none of those questions have anything to do with an ACT/SAT or admissions committe prayer.</p>
<p>and like all things there is a market place for education, some more expensive than others some with preceived value and others less value…</p>
<p>however, I don’t see/hear anyone talking about the countless unqualified legacies, developmental admits($$$$), actors/actresses/diplomatic admits and university swaps that take places and spots from all the meritous applicants that respond on this board, but that is another reality and very true among Ivies. All this is for you regular folks that have to work to show that you are deserving, but some very undeserving people aren’t worried about the seats/admissions that they are entitled too.</p>
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<p>The “put the kids first” camp has dwindled quite a bit in the last few years. Cue the oft-repeated advice about being able to borrow for college but not for retirement! 
If you want to feel that you’re not being selfish to do so, remember that it’s a blessing to be able to not need financial help from your children in your old age. And if at the end of everyone’s college years your financial picture brightens, you can always help pay off their loans.</p>
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<p>Bay, where are you? Someone owes you a dollar!</p>
<p>Schoolhouse, your posts have nothing to do with the substance of this conversation. Zero. Let it go.</p>
<p>There are a gazillion threads where you can share your “Ivys aren’t all that” philosophy. Or the well-worn “what about actors/actresses/diplomatic admits stealing spots from the meritorious” meme. Closer to two gazillion. But if you can’t find one, start one of your own. The fun will commence forthwith.</p>
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<p>Can you cite some examples? Unless you are working in the admissions office, you won’t know if they are true. Perhaps there may be a handful of cases that may be the exception but I don’t believe what you said is pervasive nowadays. The Ivies were bastion of the rich and privileged years ago, but much has changed since.
Where do you think the money in financial aid for your “meritous” applicants come from?</p>
<p>I think the question was a pretty much a straight up and down yes or no,it’s obvious that defining a second tier college/university is subject based on what you preceive the value is. Nevermind all of the variable that go into the equation it’s pretty much luck all schools claim to want to maintain academic integrity, but let’s fact it they do make compromises for a number of reason and if you thin they don’t you’re fooling yourself. Nevertheless, I love this site it great for laughs to see all the angst that goes into.</p>
<p>What resources does this school offer in terms of research opportunities, working with faculty, possibility to take graduate courses?
I know a student who was admitted to MIT, left after one semester because it was too demanding, then enrolled in a very non-rigorous school where she was the star student, received all the awards and glowing recommendations from her teachers. Majored in a STEM field. She did research internships over the summer at top schools (many are geared towards students at colleges that don’t offer research), then went to grad school on a very prestigious scholarship. Looking back, she probably would not have done as well at MIT.</p>
<p>I vote the admin lock this baby up. The title thread question was somewhat misleading. It should have been “would you send your kid to a non-ranked, private college that gave unasked admission and merit$, instead of a prestigious institution that people clamor to be admitted and is instate” . The OP has resolved the issue quite a number of posts ago, but people keep on chiming in with their opinions while seemingly not have read the majority of posts(since there are so many). So the opinions miss the mark.</p>
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<p>ooooooops. my bad, heh. Some of them still fit the bill, but all of them definitely do not.</p>
<p>“Second-tier” is SAT of 9001000? Even granting that you’re probably not including the Writing score in that calculation, I think that’s third or fourth tier. “Second-tier” is more like Fordham or American.</p>
<p>As far as your situation, I’d probably advise her to split the difference (if you can afford it): go to a decent school with generous merit aid, rather than the expensive school that would cost an extra $5K or the low-tier regional school that offers full aid.</p>
<p>As an admission consultant, I suggest you let your D go to the best school she can go. The quality of education, networking opportunities and challenges she will face are worth the higher tuition. There are reasons why all top executives and scientists are from certain schools.</p>
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<p>The top scientists aren’t all from certain schools as an undergrad. That’s false. For grad school, yes, it is very important to go to the best school. However, I agree with others that you need to go to a decent school (probably as good as a state flagship) with a good education.</p>
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<p>And just what is this almighty school that gives you the fast track to CEOdom?</p>
<p>What kind of strikes me as sad about this whole conversation is that we’re even having this conversation insofar as the structure of tiers, the choices, and associated costs or access to institutions and the very real fact that parents have to struggle with such slippery notions at all. The fact that students with such low performance histories would be in a position to pay or borrow such godawful sums for a private school is mind-bending to me.
As a college kid’s parent origionally from another country, the nuances of top privates and tiers was truly mind-blowing back in 08 when we started our search for our high-stat kid. The intellectual (and economic) partitioning in the US is increasingly and notably stark. I feel fortunate that I was well-educated in Canada on my own dime as a youth, because as a civil servant twice-married, my mom would have been destitute today instead of enjoying the lifestyle she does – or alternately, I might not have had access to what I consider a decent education.</p>
<p>I don’t know the solutions but I can’t help but wish for a genuine meritocracy, starting in grade school, where there is some kind of even standard and some kind of practical fit of opportunities to capabilities, including vocational training, for ALL children of all socioeconomic and intellectual walks. Our way now just feels like the wild west 
and I wonder how much potential talent we miss out on as a society having the viscitudes of personal finance driving who ultimately gets access to an outstanding education. Sigh. End of rant!</p>
<p>The OP had figured out by post #106 that the whatever-tier school offering a full ride was not an option. Why is this thread still going? mhmm had it right on post #169.</p>
<p>I struggled with this one too - and did conclude that they do bloom where planted. DS1 is at a state flagship, an undergrad in almost all grad level coursework, could graduate early but will remain and complete an honors thesis, will graduate debt free and with $$$ for grad school that, in all likelihood, he will not need because his graduate stipends/earnings will cover tuition/room/board at least. Certainly, he has not had an incredibly academic challenging road so far, except in graduate classes, but, as he will be in Phd programs soon enough, and perhaps, his academic challenge is just slighly deferred. DS2 had his first “B” last quarter, loves his school, remarks about the peer group all the time, and, will most certainly graduate with debt, and keep us parents counting the days until the last tuition invoice is done and paid. His academic challenge is now, and his graduate one, if he goes that route, is on his dime.</p>
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It’s innteresting how you only live 10 min away from me. :o</p>
<p>Don’t assume that just because it’s a name school with good stats for SAT’s ACT’s and rigorous admission standards that the place is filled with geniuses that are going to change the world. There’s something to be said for being the smartest fish in the pond and if D is going to Grad school someday anyway what will matter is her grades, her EC’s/civic involvement and internships and her test scores when she applies!</p>
<p>Conversations about the “value” of schools of differing rigor always sparks a lively debate on cc. At least this discussion , for the past week, has been a polite and civil conversation . Not punctuated with demands for “proof” of one’s opinion or repeating one publication on the topic.</p>