I don’t know. I just saw what UA put out. I know certain less than perceived top schools have them.
The entire ranking thing amazes me. We are at one of the top HS in TENNESSEE and UTK, BAMA, MTSU and ole miss dominate. Our valedictorian is at UTK ONE Ivy Leaguer. Baseball player.
I assume most brilliant kids end up at their state flagship.
Bit the ones that throw money at the OOS kids make it appealing. And many of these kids will do just fine.
Alabama has one of the most generous scholarships available to National Merit Semifinalists in the country, so it does not surprise me that many would enroll there.
College Scorecard launched in late 2015. According to Forbes methodology, they first started including College Scorecard in their 2016 ranking. A summary of the 2016 methodology is at Top Colleges Ranking 2016: The Full Methodology .
I think the 940 is for all classes at UA, frosh to senior, so if they’re getting 225 a year, the 940 total makes sense.
The 940 at UA is legit. They use merit funds to attract NMFs. OU has backed off its NMF funding and isn’t in the lead anymore. 25% of students at UA have 31 or better ACT. 4-5% are NMFs.
23-31 is a pretty wide range. It’s 26-34 at UT-Austin but 75% of its class is top6% auto-admit. Florida was 30-34 but don’t auto-admit.
Hmmm so 267 out of 317 were made scholar by OK themselves using money to boast high scholar enrollment, only 50 were free standing scholars, compared to Harvard’s 219 who were all scholars themselves without college making them scholars with money. It’s possible Harvard has way more NMF who can’t be claimed as scholars unless school spends money like OK, Bama, USC etc. This list of who enrolls most number of scholars seems rigged and artificially inflated.
Agreed. From UA website…
“To be considered for the National Merit Scholarship at UA, students must be recognized by the National Merit Scholarship Corporation.”
There are 50,000 students NM “recognized” annually. From this pool UA provides $ and they are then defined as “scholars”.
The 940 are not NMF (who get $ from NM) but NM Recognized who are given UA money.
I recruited NMFs with a full ride at U of Houston for a couple years so I’m pretty well versed in the process.
Rough numbers here. 50K are recognized (Commended, NMSF and Finalist). Commended are top 5% of PSAT test takers. That’s ~ 35K. NMSF is ultimately ~1500 and 13,500 become finalists. There is another higher designation of Scholar but for Natl Merit Scholarship Corp and reporting purposes they don’t sway the numbers.
UH bought contact info for all certain PSAT selection index cut-offs in 20 states where we thought we would be successful. Given Alabama’s success, they may do this in all 50 states. You reach out to those students and convince them that they get a full ride if they select your school as their #1 choice with NM Corporation by early the next year. That’s the only way they count towards your numbers.
Alabama has a terrific program and package for NMFs and has a national reputation for sports. Many kids who don’t care about sports, Greek or the South will pass. Since test scores are highly correlated with income, many recruits are well-off and choose other options. Yes, the state of Alabama has a lower than average selection index and Alabama residents will attend UA in higher numbers. Florida and Georgia residents have had strong, affordable in state options. I suspect UA draws really well from other Southern states but also pulls its share of kids from conservative middle income areas around the country.
960 National Merit sponsored kids on campus uses up a lot of merit funds but UA is generous with funds for others as well which gets them to campus paying in-state or lower rates. These 960 NM kids could fill a dorm by themselves but hopefully they are integrated well with other top students.
Many “tippy top” schools don’t provide funding for NMFs. Chicago and USC have done that to move up the ranking and provide marketing fodder. They may pull back from that at some point. UT-Austin is another school that offers no funding for NMFs. They get less than 100 per year but they CAP some NMSFs who go onto to become finalists. It allows them to use their financial aid for kids in need or other campus priorities.
Another university that offers amazing merit aid to NMF is University of New Mexico. It’s a complete full ride. That doesn’t seem to have propelled this school into a higher ranking OR onto the list where the most NM scholars attend college. And it’s a great school.
So someone is great at the PSAT - what if their GPA is a 3.2 or something - they still get these great free rides?
While most of these students may end up top notch, it doesn’t seem to me that all necessarily are.
It’s crazy to me that schools look at SAT/ACT for admission…and yet are using a test they don’t accept as an admission tool to give out in many cases the best scholrships.
@tsbna44 at UNM if someone is a NMF, they get the NMF award (right @WayOutWestMom ?).
Many other merit awards do consider GPA.
FWIW, my top notch (ACT, not SAT) lad had UAlabama on his list and got a nice financial package from them, but it was beat by both Pitt and U Rochester - within 2K for both, but the latter two were better. We were told by folks on here that UA would likely sweeten their offer (beyond full tuition) if we showed them his other offers, but he liked the other two schools better so there was no point in doing that.
It doesn’t happen to all top notch kids, but many of those kids have options if they apply strategically and have the application to support their value beyond high test scores. If it’s just test scores and grades it’s more difficult.
I don’t want to diss UA though. Kids from our school have gone there and loved it. As a pp said, it sure helps if they like sports. My guy didn’t. Their hang up on all things sports turned him off when we visited, esp compared to schools/students that focused on academics and research during our visits.
I don’t understand where schools are test optional because of maybe the inequities of those that can’t afford for prep courses, but I guess the same logic where kids take prep courses for the PSAT doesn’t matter (and get $$)
@tsbna44
RE: UNM National Merit Scholarship.
Only the designation as a National Merit Scholar matters. GPA is not considered. ditto for the National Achievement awards (African American, Native American, Hispanic)
For other scholarships (Amigo, LUE, WUE, etc), a specific GPA is part of the requirements for eligibility.
My son isn’t into sports and loves it. He went (for engineering over Purdue who gave him $10K). He went for the Ridgecrest dorms vs. Purdue which has all sorts of housing issues. Hated living there but the idea of having his own modern room in the heart of campus vs. being in a triple, stuffed in an off campus alternate location (at Purdue) - well that scenario did not appeal to him. Also, being 3 hours from home instead of 6.5 - being in range of mom - i think comforted him. Everyone chooses for different reasons. He’s in his 2nd year off campus and loves it.
So yes UA is a great school and their kids are doing fine - if the kid wants to do fine.
Funny, my daughter got $28K from UA (4.53 Wtd, 32 ACT) - and zilch from Pitt. We’d have loved to look there. I only read great things. It met her needs except maybe cold. She was waitlisted Honors and in with no $$. And ended up at Charleston - so from a ranking/perception thing, even went lower.
We debate all this…many/most kids don’t seem to care.
You definitely need higher than a 32 ACT to get money from Pitt. I think 34 is the minimum?
UA attracts kids (and parents) for the money, no doubt. I don’t know of any who went there from my school in PA without significant money being a factor. I’m sure the distance plays a role there. Other schools don’t need to spend so much.
Yeah - their website said 33 is “typically” the minimum. There is no stated but they note it.
But it was TO and we called and spoke to an admissions counselor and he said given it’s a TO environment and a 32 is strong that we should submit it because it shows them a lot.
But given that’s contrary to what they publish, then we second guessed it…well after we got none.
But I think in reading the CC a lot, few make out with big merit at Pitt. Many assume they will or feel entitled but it’s not the norm. They have the Cathedral of Learning where as low as a 28 you can get $$ - it’s from URMs. And then the merit - you read a lot of $3K or $5K or mostly none. So even a 36 ACT is no guarantee, etc.
Nonetheless, things work out for a reason. My daughter could have gone to many well thought of schools - from W&L to Florida to UGA to others - and she chose the 16th of 17th rated. For her it was right…at least up front on paper.
And she’s a leader and a winner - and I suspect and hope she’ll do well in life regardless of where she attends.
Obviously your student was strong if they pulled a better deal at Rochester and Pitt than Bama. Congrats to them. That’s awesome - but I think rare. So a real accomplishment.
Yes, if you get the NM selection index cutoff for your state, the HS GPA only factors into whether you’re one of the 10% of semifinalists who won’t make finalist. I saw some kids getting 1200s on the SAT and still getting finalist. Some with second quarter. Get finalist and get the $$. And someone who barely misses the selection index cutoff but gets a 1500+ SAT doesn’t get the full ride.
The UNM scholarship looks great but may not be as much as UA’s. UNM offers “Approximately $20,000 per year — covers base tuition, fees, and housing. Renewable for up to 4 years”
Requires 3.3 GPA each semester to keep it. Does it cover books, study abroad, computer, research stipend? A few schools go all out. UH covered books with $500 per year and a fifth year if you were a pharmacy or architecture. The UH president went to OU and started the same program there. UH only had funding for 70 NMFs per year.
One year, my list from NMSC in February came back saying that 82 had picked UH as first choice. We couldn’t afford them all so I quit calling them back or pitching and the melt got us down to the 70s. I suspect UNM doesn’t recruit as hard as UA (or UCF) does. They also have less name recognition and are more remote. Fine place to go to school and near mountains but a tougher sell. UH has since decided to put NMF funds into Tier One scholarships and spread the money over more students. Just a different choice.
Quite a few from our Texas HS go to Alabama for full pay or with a scholarship to get close to in state pay. Nearly all get in but a counselor emphasized that you’ll have to pay OOS rates, like Arkansas.
@WayOutWestMom can you please tell exactly what the full ride at UNM offers. It sounds more robust than the above poster is indicating.
It should be noted though that a 3.5 GPA is required to get CBNRP recognition in the first place. The PSAT score is not sufficient by itself to qualify.
“GPA Criteria: Students must have a 3.5 GPA or higher”
National Recognition Programs | SAT Suite of Assessments – The College Board