Your GC may be steering you wrong

Parents Forum
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<p>I know much of the attention on these boards are about straight A students getting into IVy's and other well known colleges. But we discovered succcess is obtainable for the under achievers regardless of what you are told by your GC</p>

<p>Guidance told my kid during his Sophmore year that he would never get into a 4 year college with an 83 average and that he should plan on attending a Tech school or a Community college. My son's reaction was then why bother with high school if he can't go to college? he wanted to drop out and play bass in a metal band. My wife being the brains of the family had him meet with admissions at a local 4 year college who informed him that an 83 would indeed get him into a 4 year college. They gave him a tour and let him attend a music composition class, he was hooked!. The college also informed him of a program where a HS student can take an intro course in certain subjects and receive credit for it. </p>

<pre><code>After fighting tooth and nail with the GC who said that college programs were for the serious students " on a college track" . My wife harrassed the school administrators till they agreed to allow him to take a philosophy intro course as an elective during his junior year. He aced the course and got an A on both his midterm and final along with a glowing letter of recommendation from the professor. ( my wife cries every time she reads it). GC's reaction was to ignore that success and instead taunt him on his weakness in Gym ( I swear I am not making this crap up) and hand him more brochures for community colleges.
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<p>During spring vacation that year we made the rounds of all of the colleges
he was interested in. while at one he saw a brochure for Harvard's summer school program.
We figured no way he would get in. He wrote the required essay and then ran into a brick wall because GC refused to recommend him( Hvd requires an administrative and teacher rec), we did an end run around the GC and got the assistant principle to write the required adminstrative recommendation. To our surprise he got in and got A's in both courses , best of all he came home in August as an adult. Best $8000 we ever spent ( we sold one of our cars)</p>

<p>September comes and he is riding high. Teachers who were throwing him out of thier classes two years ago are now stopping him in the hallway and offering to help him with college recommendations and advice on his essays. His confidence and GPA begins to rise.
He scores a 1200 on the SAT and does well on the SATII. Perhaps not the greatest scores to work with but we were finding some darn good colleges within his reach. </p>

<p>How about the GC? he sees the list of colleges my son is applying to and tells him no way will he get into any of them, that he is setting an unobtainable goal and should only apply to Community Colleges. The GC was not totally wrong. Our kid applied to 19 colleges and our son knew as well as we that he stood almost no chance of getting into 15 of them. Fortunately by this time our son had figured out that the GC was full of it and was just avoiding meeting with the GC</p>

<p>In Mid march we had been on pins and needles since Feb 1. March 15 we get an acceptance letter from UC-Boulder. A collective sigh of relief followed a week later by acceptances from U-Vermont,and Bennington College. Friday April 1 rolls in and as we expected the thin letters start showing up, he opened 6 or 7 rejection letters that day. That was a tough weekend he knew it was coming but he was still devastated. Fortunately his friends were around that weekend and kept him distracted. Monday came and 5 more rejections and one acceptance. </p>

<p>After that tough weekend he pulled himself together and contacted the 5 colleges he received offers from, He arranged visits and interviews with professors and ultimately found a college that exceeded his expectations. it even is a so-called top 50 liberal arts college.</p>

<p>I don't know if the GC is incompetent,ill-informed, playing politics or just doesn't like kids with blue hair. But the point is that this is too important of a process to rely on what one person tells you . Do your own research The Princeton Review was fairly accurate for us ( except for some of the student descriptions) . </p>

<p>While we went to some extra ordinary lengths with the Harvard summer school thing and the class at the local college, he would have likely gotten into 3 of the five that he was admitted to without the extra effort.</p>

<p>If your kid isn't doing well or wants to quit take him/her to a college and have them talk to admissions. it might change thier life and yours :)</p>

<p>Bill</p>

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<p>Good on him! And you and the missus! </p>

<p>Unfortunately, I know lots of stories about teachers and GCs trying to kneecap students, my knees included. </p>

<p>There is great value in learning how to end-run or go over obstacles. And there is value in learning to identify people who don't want you to succeed. it is a shame to learn that lesson in high school, but there you have it.</p>

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<p>all i know is that AFTER i told my gc i was conservative, she recommends pomona, wesleyan, brown, and amherst...what is with that?</p>

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<p>First, congrats to your son on his college acceptances! Nice show. It also sounds to me that your son was seriously underchallenged in his school and needed to experience college level courses to really get hooked. For that reason, the $8k for Harvard summer school was money well spent. I''m glad you were able to afford it and your son did so well in the course. </p>

<p>The GC sounds truly awful. Does your S really have blue hair? My S has a friend who is wanting to dye her hair blue. She dyed it pink last year .</p>

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<p>Bill, that's a good story. Congrats to your son, and to you. Are you at liberty to tell us the other two schools where your S was accepted? It's nice to know who'll look beyond the obvious.</p>

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<p>Cujoe: Wesleyan for a self-described conservative? ROFL!</p>

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<p>Stories like this just make my blood boil. There are so many great colleges out there for "B" and even "C" students that any guidance counselor that says such students have "no chance" is either (1) woefully uninformed or (2) simply too lazy to get informed. I'm glad this all worked out for your son and I hope you will stick around CC's parents board - we could use your insight and wisdom!</p>

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<p>I think a letter to your school board and your principal is in order about that GC. Though I often hear about uninformed, disinterested GCs, this one is downright harmful and should not be inflicting this sort of thing on the students at that school. Had you not been as proactive as parents, things could have really been different for your son. Who knows the other students and families who took this guy at his word. This is one battle I would not hesitate to fight.</p>

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<p>Wow, BMoyilan--thank you for this amazing story. It sounds as if your son ended up with the worst possible GC and the best possible parents--on the whole, a pretty good deal ;). The fact that you gave him so much faith and encouragement, and that he rose to the occasion so beautifully, seems like a great predictor of future success. Congratulations!</p>

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<p>Good for you, your wife and your son! </p>

<p>Once he graduates feel free to print the GC's name and e-mail address here. If it wasn't an insult to metal bands I'd say he should quit and play bass in one.</p>

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<p>Wow! That is a terrible GC! Our College Counselor is a bit like that. She told me I had not a snowflake's chance in hell of getting in Georgetown.. well, that was depressing.</p>

<p>She also told another student just recently (who's planning to do early graduation) that the student had no chance at UCSB. Sheesh.</p>

<p>It's great to hear that your son rose despite the reservations (too light of a word for the situation, but my mind isn't functioning as well as it should be..) that the GC had..</p>

<p>P.S. I wish your son luck at Sarah Lawrence. :).. (assuming that's where he's going..)</p>

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<p>Here's my story....my GC said i had no chance at any UC, or USC....IN MY FRESHMAN FIRST SEMESTER GRADES. my mom did not understand what my guidance counselor was saying so i said to her in korean that UC's and USC will accept me in the future so i wouldnt want my mom to worry about me. So, i worked my ass off. from 1st semester freshman's GPA of 3.4 to a overall 4.53 gpa in the end of junior year. I did not even talk to her until the day i got into UCLA, USC, and UCB. I told her about her ignorance to see my desire to succeed in life and she refuses to admit she ever said i would never get into the top schools in California. Now, she treats me and couple people who got into top schools like if we are king. I agree, GC only look for smart kids. They treat people who have a lesser GPA than top 15 percent like dirt. yea, i feel you. the day my GC said that, that just made me even more want to prove her wrong.</p>

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<p>BMoyilan, thank you for that very-much needed post on this board. I don't know whether your school's GC is typical or not, but I do know it is very difficult for kids who do not have steller grades + test scores to know where to aim for college. ANY kid with motivation can go to college, though sometimes it may take extra work to repair problems in a high school record. </p>

<p>This board, unfortunately, is not a lot of help to students who lack the top stats, because it does seem to be dominated with kids whose accomplishments are so stellar that they seem unattainable. I don't think it's intentional, but the kind of comments often posted here would tend to scare kids and parents away .... I mean, if some kid with a 1450 SAT and 7 APs ends up rejected from all of his top choices, what chance does the kid with a B average and a 1200 SAT have? </p>

<p>So success stories like yours are nice to hear. As a parent, I don't think I'd allow my kid the luxury of 15 apps to reach schools....too many $$ .... but then, without the help of a knowledgeable gc, I guess it is hard to sort out the reach schools from the match schools.</p>

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<p>I think that the college admissions process is SO random in general that a lot of the top schools are crapshoots more 99% of the applicants</p>

<p>Luckily for me, my GC was much nicer. She helped me with an administrative hassle I had earlier in the year when a racist teacher at my hs refused to enroll me in her class :( (disclaimer: I was trying to indepentendly study the BC part of Calc in a Calc AB classs) Its just a matter of finding the right people and sticking to them. My counselor is really nice and I stop by her office every now and then to check up on how things are going. After my acceptance to a reach school, she was the first person I called. She had provided so much support during the college app process that I felt I was obliged to let her be informed about how the results turned out. Heck, initially I was looking at cc's as safeties and Ivies + Elites as uber-reaches. I applied to a LOT of reaches and got in to a few, luckily I had no difficult choice to make.... Blue Devils here I come !!!!!!!!!!!!!</p>

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<p>Although my S has not had any racist teacher (thank goodness!), he has had a most helpful GC. It hurts to read about GCs who go out of their way to undermine the confidence and the college prospects of the students in their charge.</p>

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<p>One can only hope that the GC didn't "sabotage" the OP's S's reccommendation forms in any way that led to those "thin" envelopes</p>

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<p>Congratulations to your son! And a what an excellent job of parenting you and your wife have done - finding the right motivation for your son to find his path in life. In the face of quite an obstacle, no less. Bravo!</p>

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<p>Reminds me of a story I heard last week from a friend of mine. Her GC told her to apply to community colleges like most of the other women in her school. She refused to accept his advice. Long story short: BA Stanford, MD Stanford.</p>

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<p>This has been one of my greatest problems. My D's GC is very nice but his goal is placing all of his students into state schools. Everything is geared that way and because those schools don't require things such as SAT IIs, etc., my D was never told at the proper time to take those tests (UGH!!)</p>

<p>There are 3 GC's in my D's school. Yesterday, another student went up to my daughter and told her that he and his GC were working together (creating new weighted classes for him) in order to overtake my D's class rank. (He and my daughter are #1, and #2 and there difference in GPA as of yesterday was .008-they never have seen it this close)</p>

<p>My D's GC is not as aggressive- he would never think to come up with new classes. I know her GC thinks she's great (will probably write a great rec) but he never seems to know much about the upper tier schools (what they're looking for)- just that there are always a few students every year that are accepted. He'll be the first to say that he doesn't know exactly what those schools are looking for.</p>

<p>This has been so frustrating-I hate the "I don't know anwers". I'm so glad I found CC!!!!</p>

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<p>I will never forget going with my Dad to meet my GC while a junior in high school. My family was Jewish and the GC recommended Notre Dame, Boston College, Villanova, Georgetown and Marquette. All good Colleges, but all affiliated with the Catholic Church. I thought my father was going to have a seizure. I ended up at UNC-Chapel Hill ( 1972) and never looked back nor met with my GC again.</p>

<p>Chuck</p>