<p>mythmom, Absolutely things happen to families along the way, that don't get factored in. Some families had large medical debt 10 years ago (not going into the fafsa today), others send relatives $ abroad, others help elderly parents/granparents financially (some get money for college from grandparents, but other grandparents are in part supported by their children). Some families accumulated debt while sending their kids to private elementary/hs for various reasons and that debt is not going to help with financial aid (only tuition payments for a kid currently in a private school perhaps).</p>
<p>Adding to NYdancemom's comment #11, I don't live in upstate NY, but I know her statements ring true regarding home values. The economy in that region
is shot. Those who have decent jobs in Utica, Rochester, Buffalo, Ithaca etc. may have a mortgage lower than the national median, but that doesn't mean that paying for college isn't a tremendous finanical burden for them.</p>
<p>I think most folks are responsible enough to realize they must save and start early for thier children's education. But.. as mythmom has pointed out things do happen to preclude that. Lay-offs, out-sourcing, downsizing, disasters, public and private, ie., 911, divorce, and so on. Not everyone making 100K plus has spent it on expensive vacations, new cars, and mc'mansions. I think those who have been able to save 15% of thier income per year, which is basically what it takes to afford one private college for one child, should be commended. But, I think most folks out there, for one valid reason or another have probably not able to, thus it is home equity, or nothing.</p>
<p>There is also a balance between saving for college and providing your kids a rich enough lifestyle to make them the sort of interesting and intellectually curious people to want a good education! As a single parent, I could have forgone all travel for the sake of saving for college, not sent them to camp, not given them music lessons. We did all this on the cheap as much as possible, and I worked for tuition at the camp, drove older cars. But some of the money spent in these years has created who they are, kids with good instincts, some good skills, and a creative approach to life. I will be trading house equity for tuition in the next few years, and maybe gaining a double wide in the country for retirement! But it's been an interesting life, and there are many, many less fortunate.</p>
<p>Great point GLM! I invest in my children hoping that they will be broader human beeings than I am, the same way my parents did for me. I want my kids to WANT great education!</p>
<p>It's one thing for someone to save $500 per month toward their kid's college education when they're making $150K a year. But when most people's kids were born, they weren't making near that. We were just getting started, buying our first house, setting up a business, saving for retirement, etc. We could not save anywhere near that. We were lucky to put away $100 per month for our kids' educations at the beginning.</p>
<p>And we aren't on the 4 year plan. We were trying to save for at least a 6 to 8 year plan for each of our children. That makes a difference. Who wants to take out loans and refinance their homes for an undergraduate education when graduate school, med school, or law school is just around the corner?</p>
<p>Maybe some have done it, and my hat's off to them.</p>
<p>With 3 years of double degree undergrad left, my D is already starting to think about grad school. She will need to think and plan well, because I am not paying for it.</p>
<p>edad,
I don't know where your daughter goes to school, but I've heard many parents who had sent their kids through OOS public or private undergrad schools, but won't pay for grad school. Personally, I'd be glad to help my kids go to grad school. I wish my folks had helped me!</p>
<p>I paid for grad school myself, and lived to tell about it. Eating Ramen noodles builds character.</p>
<p>We don't plan to fund grad school either.</p>
<p>Grad school hits at a time concurrent with building some final retirement funds for myself. For the middle class, I'd think funding retirement should take precident at a point. My kids may not end up with a career from their undergrad. Hopefully grad school with provide that, as well as money to pay back loans.</p>
<p>If you can't get funding for grad school from the school you probably are not that good. The exception is professional grad schools which will payoff and are worth the debt.</p>
<p>doubleplay: If you can, T think it's great. I will help if I can, but I won't live at austerity as I am now. Financial help will come after vacation (modest) and home improvements (modest), not before. It's too easy for me to become a martyr. Although my parents were quite comfortable, I actually paid for my entire education: NYS school, regents scholarship, OVR (had very serious asthma) and tuition waiver and TA-ship for grad school. However, although I am strong and self-reliant, I can see scars. I will help my children as much as I can without totally going into extreme deprivation mode (as I've been for three years and probably three years to come.)</p>
<p>To remove the violins a bit from what I've presented as a sad story, I live in a lovely home with a flowered backyard in an adorable town. We have a beach, theater, restaurants and SUNY Stony Brook next door where I can watch graduate students perform divine music for free whenever I want.</p>
<p>My "vacation" for three years running has been to swim in my pool (DS takes care of), pool part of house at purchase, and attend Stony Brook film festval with pass, birthday present from Mom. </p>
<p>House is not new, not McMansion, but things are not stripped to bare essentials since miraculously we have kept our house. I would not be adverse to downsizing to free educational funds if I could find a house enough cheaper to make costs incurred worthwhile.</p>
<p>Just wanted to rectify the pathetic (though true) picture I painted.</p>
<p>Well, the fact is that highly selective colleges, which only give out need-based aids, have little trouble fully enrolling a class. Since such colleges typically have 40-50% students on aids, it would seem that the financial aid system at such places is working well enough for those who need it.</p>
<p>As many here had already pointed out, the problem lies in the cost of state universities where financial aids are less generous and do not necessarily cover full needs. Here, such places may be out of reach for families who did not plan successfully or who are in the lower income bracket.</p>
<p>There are undoubtedly many reasons underlying rises in the cost of public state universities. Virtually all states had cut back in funding such places in the past decade. State universities have also increased their spending to attract better national ranking. For a variety of reasons and very deservingly so, professors' salary had risen sharply in the past decade. </p>
<p>I don't have solutions to offer. I do have one observation. I do see a lot of students who fail to take education seriously at our public universities and will receive little benefit for their time there. I have little doubt that costs at such places will come down significantly by removing such students.</p>
<p>So making college more selective in general would lower the overall cost? I am all for it, after all there are plenty of CC. Most of the kids I teach should be in CC, if at all. And lets be frank about it - most of high paying jobs do not require college degree. The gardener makes more than I do...</p>
<p>We invested in real estate to cover the incoming college cost. We have two kids, so we purchased 2 properties that are currently rentals. One might eventually, if we live long enough, become our retirement place. The second one is for sale the spring our oldest leaves for college (or sooner). The money we generate from renting covers mortgage and all the taxes, there is little left in terms of true income, if any at all. But...we did put a lot of money down on those properties, and such we have "invested". This way we really have no money to spare on a month to month basis, and thus we are "forced" to save. If this strategy works, I will let you know in 5-6 years :-). Maybe one of our kids will choose to be a gardener? Then I am looking forward to a nice retirement :-)</p>
<p>Mini, I appreciate your hammering on the point that "affording" a private college is a choice that we make, and we can't expect to make that choice without significant sacrifice. Assuming there are not extenuating circumstances, many of us could choose (for example) comfortable home + the occasional luxury + state university or we could choose austere lifestyle + extending the mortgage for 15 years + private university.</p>
<p>There is a 3rd choice available to many, and I don't know why more people don't consider it. Any fairly bright kid who is in good health and has good physical conditioning can earn an ROTC scholarship. These scholarships pay full tuition & fees (different services award different amounts for different majors) + a generous monthly stipend ($250/freshman, $300/sophomore, etc.). Yes, there is a cost. 4 years of service as an officer with a decent income. S2 is applying to USC, and the only way he will be able to attend there is if he receives an Army ROTC scholarship (which we believe he will receive).</p>
<p>Everytime I have brought up ROTC scholarships on CC, people will reply that no one should do that unless they <em>really</em> want to serve in the military. Of course the student should be willing to serve, should understand what that entails, and should plan to put in their best effort. That doesn't mean they have to be die-hard military, though. They just have to be willing to serve for 4 years and to repay their educational debt to their country.</p>
<p>During this time of war, many parents would not want their children to choose this option due to the risks involved. To put this in perspective, in the first 3 years of the Iraq war, there were 3.92 deaths per 1,000 person-years. "The death rate for U.S. men ages 18 to 39 in 2003 was 1.53 per 1,000 -- 39 percent of that of troops in Iraq...Those in the Navy and Air Force have substantially lower death rates than civilian men ages 20 to 34...The number of wounded in Iraq through March 31, 2006, was 7.5 times the number of dead; the rate at which wounds are incurred was one per 33 troops per year." 1 It is difficult to assess the meaningfulness of the numbers of wounded since this includes minor injuries as well as amputations.</p>
<p>I sure don't want to hijack this thread and start a debate about the war in Iraq, so if anyone wants to share their thoughts on that with me, feel free to PM me. I'm not much of a debater, so I'll probably just hear you out. I really just wanted to present this as a real and viable option to those who want to send their children to a private university.</p>
<p>Timely, Good for your son2. However, given that the ROTC budget is limited, ROTC can either become highly competitive or will award a lower benefit should there be a large number of applicants. That is, your suggestion will not alter the basic dilemma being faced by parents here.</p>
<p>A coworker of mine has a son doing 15 months in Iraq. When he comes back and gets out, he gets free tuition to a state school. Of course he'll have to get past, psychologically, what he has seen and been forced to do over there. Fifteen months in the "triangle of death" comes with an all expense paid trip to the VA for PTS syndrome. Estimates are that most Iraq veterans will suffer from this. Moreover there are stop-loss initiatives, extensions, multiple tours, and so on. I understand, relatively speaking, that the odds of coming home in one piece are in your favor physically.. but mentally. I have forbid military recruiters to talk to my children in HS. I understand it is an avenue some kids pursue once out of HS, but all things considered, I think I'd move heaven and earth to convince my S or D that I could in fact afford to send them to that state school without them entering the military. I respect the choices other kids may make in that regard. I just hope my kids don't find their way there.</p>
<p>Because of being a NMSF my son was recruited by the army on numerous occasions. He was offered the chance to "play in the band for the president", never mind that he's a violinist. I heard him say, "You know, playing for the president doesn't get me off." This really surprised me because I've never heard my son say anything vulgar before. I wouldn't have put it that way, but I share his sentiment. Even funnier was the recruiter's response. He replied, "If you mean President Bush, I don't like him either, man."</p>
<p>What a strange phone call. ROTC is definitely not the place fpr my son. LOL, but I appreciate timely's sharing because it might be a good option for some young people. Like Nightingale, whatever my political beliefs I respect the choices young people make. The politicians are another story.</p>
<p>Nightingale, I understand your forbidding recruiters from talking to your son. My son glared at me for passing him the phone. I thought he could take care of himself, and he did, and gave us both a laugh. (No disrespect intended to Nightingale, young people with no other options, or sadly, those dedicated young people who are injured or killed in Iraq or elsewhere.)</p>
<p>"So, what is your motivation for making financial sacrifices to pay for private education?"</p>
<p>I believe that Vassar is currently the fifth most expensive school in the nation. I pay more for my child to attend Vassar than I pay for my other child to attend an Ivy League school. Both of my kids are getting a fantastic education; both are BWRK who love to learn. </p>
<p>Both schools have large endowments and have fair and generous financial aid offices. However, it is still a financial sacrifice to finance these schools, at least for us.</p>
<p>My teenage kids, who forget to take out the garbage and bring in the recycling bins when they are home, do not forget to thank us on a regular basis for the opportunities they have in their private schools. They've worked with incredible professors and met people from all walks of life and all ends of the earth.</p>
<p>Someone I know whose kid is in Vassar (ahead of mine) had told me that the school is worth every penny. He was right. He's not rich either.</p>
<p>My kid often calls to tell me about something incredible that has gone on there and ends the call with saying, "And <em>that's</em> what makes Vassar Vassar."</p>
<p>I'd hope that any parent who is paying for a college education - private or public - full fare or with financial aid - has a kid that feels that way about his or her school.</p>