I’m the one who was asking about the study details. My tablet seems temperamental about accessing pdfs lately, sorry if it annoys anyone.
Here’s a non-pdf source for you, @scholarme.
http://news.brown.edu/articles/2015/05/rape
thanks CF
In post #28, I referred to a study commissioned by the US Bureau of Justice, to be performed by WESTAT, to develop and test two different ways to collect self-report data on rape and sexual assault, because of the known deficiencies of the current NVCS survey that some people on this thread like to cite. The WESTAT study was initially scheduled to be finished last September, and I mentioned that I was trying to find out what happened.
Shannan Catalano, the project manager, kindly responded to my inquiry. She says, “The pilot test is scheduled for completion in the spring of 2016, and we expect the final report will be released in early summer of 2016.” So we’ll see next year what WESTAT comes up with.
Is the actual questionnaire published anywhere?
So the 18.6 number from the survey of attempted and completed rapes freshman year is pretty close to my 19.9% extrapolation with the round number of the roughly 2000 female freshmen and the percentage numbers as stated by @northwesty in post #82. Maybe that 12% of foiled attempts would have been an extra 240 completed rapes (of 2000) or 58 from this study of 480 students had the women not resisted so successfully.
For @Bay:
The study defined rape as “vaginal, oral, or anal penetration using threats of violence or use of physical force, or using the tactic of victim incapacitation.” Thus, the study data do not conflate other forms of sexual misconduct such as unwanted touching or verbal abuse with the incidence of rape.
So unless your husband engages in these types of activities when you say that you aren’t in the mood you would not report your lackluster physical contact as rape.
@saintfan, Northwesty is wrong. Post 82 is wrong. Northwesty was talking about first semester and he is wrong about first semester. 43 percent fewer women suffered from attempted or completed rape first semester than northwesty said. Some of you are worrying me. 
The link to what I believe is the questionnaire:
http://www.midss.org/content/sexual-experiences-survey-short-form-victimization-ses-sfv
The questionnaire starts with:
Then there are questions about various sexual behaviors that the respondent might have experienced.
Here’s the relevant question for vaginal sex:
(c) is the question for incapacitated rape. (d) and (e) are the questions for forcible rape. (a) and (b) were asked, but the answers were not reported in the journal article.
@northwesty, no, I don’t think it’s impossible. Rape is severely under-reported. Of the 3 women I know who were raped, none of them reported it (2 by ex-BFs, one entered in to a relationship with the rapist; a relationship that was eff’ed up on multiple levels). Plus, of the 20% figure, there are various degrees of non-consent, some degrees of which some women put up with (it seems very rare, for instance, for a woman to level a charge of rape against a partner who she loves even if he/she takes her forcibly or without 100% consent).
And who says that rape levels aren’t down? You can’t accept that it was more prevalent (and even more undercover) in the past?
BTW, why are you so sure that the school is Syracuse? Did the report state that? Last I checked, there were a few universities in upstate NY.
“Women felt compelled and obligated to have sex and in my view, that is not consent.”
Feeling compelled and obligated is not the same thing as being forced (with threat of physical violence). This is as nonsensical as saying - I see a beggar on my street corner asking for food - feeling obligated to give him money from my purse is the same thing as if he pushes me against the wall and takes money from my purse.
Sorry. “I felt he’d dump me” / “I felt guilty because he paid for a nice dinner” is a different story from either “I was incapacitated and couldn’t say no” or “he held me down.”
“Unfortunately, lots of men rape when they can. This is the fact, and no amount of denial will make it untrue.”
Do you trust any man, ever, CF?
Got it on the numbers - I used the numbers that @northwesty quoted in post #82 and if they are incorrect then I retract all my “math” and accept the correction.
So I would answer yes to this about my H having sex with me even when I said I wasn’t in the mood, because he verbally pressured me and went ahead anyway. I was forcibly raped, then.
saintfan,
The way the study describes “forcible rape” does not encompass everything that was asked about in the survey. That is why it is important to look at the questions, and not just a summary of the results.
I hypothesize it’s Syracuse because one of the authors is from Syracuse. And there aren’t that many private universities in upstate NY that are the right size; it has to be a school with about 2000 female freshmen.
Bay. Go back and read the questionnaire. You would answer yes to (a). Now read the part where I said,
quote is the question for incapacitated rape. (d) and (e) are the questions for forcible rape. (a) and (b) were asked, but the answers were not reported in the journal article.
[/quote]
You would not have been forcibly raped, under the definition used by this article, because you would not say that he threatened to physically harm you, and you would not say that he used force.
Yes, this is the point I was trying to get at. Context matters, and the surveys don’t tell us the context or the woman’s feelings about what happened to her. It is quite possible that many women put up with a lot of sex they don’t want, but don’t mentally consider themselves to be “forcibly raped,” even if that is how the law or a study defines what happens to them. Perhaps they don’t report it because they don’t want the man to go to jail for what he did, even if she didn’t particularly like it. She deals with it and moves on.
I’m not saying there are not plenty of women who are scarred for life over their encounter, I’m just wondering if these studies conflate relationship dynamics with criminal rape in every case, where it is not really the same.
All this talk about Syracuse U…
Reminds me of the author Alice Sebold. She wrote a book called The Lovely Bones and had to stop while she was writing it to write her memoir Lucky. Why? Because as a freshman at Syracuse U she was raped. When she reported it to the police, one of them told her she was “lucky” because a woman had been raped at the same place years before but that woman had also been killed.
It haunted her so much that she began to write The Lovely Bones (about a young girl who is raped and murdered) without even realizing how much it was informed by her own particular experience. She paused in writing her novel, wrote her memoir (about her rape) and then continued with the novel.
In her memoir we find that she reported the crime to the police, and the man was eventually caught and sent to prison. He was released after several years, but she was still suffering. She was in prison far, far longer.
While she was still a student she began writing violent poems about what she would like to do to her rapist. Her teacher, in a small seminar, asked the other students to comment and one woman refused. That woman began to skip class so she wouldn’t have to comment. She attempted suicide. Guess who else had been raped?
CF,
Okay, so are you saying I was raped but not forcibly raped?
I’m trying to understand how someone who had sex with the guy because he physically forced her, or because he threatened her with violence, can be said to be putting up with that sex. She didn’t have a choice. In what sense is she putting up with it?