Advice sought re math track

<p>Streak, My D was in the middle track in Math, partly as another poster had pointed out, I wanted her to have a solid grounding in basics. But by the end of her sophmore year, she developed a deeper interest in math and decided to skip pre-calculus. She self-studied in the summer and passed a school-sponsored test to go straight into calculus in her junior year. By her senior year she was doing well in the AIME test. Opting out pre-cal did not affect her in AP or SAT tests. She is currently a double major in English and Math in her second year in college .</p>

<p>So it is possible to go onto a more advanced track without doubling in math. The test-out option should be available in every school since it is there to accomodate transfer students. That said, I agree with others here that these options (doubling or testing out) are probably unwise if the purpose is for college admission reasons.</p>

<p>padad,</p>

<p>As I mentioned earlier in this thread, our son took a similar path. When I posted though, my addled brain couldn't recall the course he opted to skip. It was FST (Functions, stats, trig, I think).</p>

<p>He scored a 5 on his AP Calc exam, so I don't think it hurt him too much.</p>

<p>mafool, Sorry I skipped most of the posts on the thread but just went back and read yours. Otherwise I would have referenced yours. My apology.</p>

<p>Did your son have to test out the precal course? My D's school was pretty strict with skipping courses and would only allow it by testing out. To my annoyance, D skipped out of chemistry (Sophomre) and biology (Freshman) as well and just went onto the AP courses. So she did one every year of her high school except for her senior year when she ran out of courses to skip. It was precisely this reason that I urged her to attend a LAC rather than a university with graduate programs so she won't be taking graduate courses prematurely. Even there, she is skipping.</p>

<p>Streak why not let him take a math course at a local community college during summer and see how he does? The good thing about this is his grades need not be reported to colleges he is applying to. Also he is done with a math course during summer and can pursue another math course of his choice during the regular school year.</p>

<p>
[quote]
The good thing about this is his grades need not be reported to colleges he is applying to.

[/quote]

Not true. The college applications ask for all college courses you've taken, which would include summer classes. So his grade would need to be reported. </p>

<p>And if not reported, colleges would wonder how he skipped a prereq for the later courses.</p>

<p>Rather than taking one at a Community College, which could possible be faster paced than expected, or not match up with the H.S. curriculum, I also second the idea of taking the 8-week Math classes offered in many places during the summer. Those are specifically designed to either catch-up or accelerate your child.</p>

<p>Why don't you call your school district Math Supervisor and discuss with them. They would probably be able to recommend acceptable summer courses.</p>

<p>I just re-read the original post: the student is in 8th grade, and he's not a math wiz. There's no way I'd put an 8th grader into a community college course (even a summer one) unless he was a math genius and needed advanced work to keep him sane.</p>

<p>Most of the entering 9th graders at my D's particular school are enrolled in Algebra 2, with several in Precalc or calculus. The school counselors suggest that any incoming freshmen who want to accelerate their math courses should take precalc in the summer. That's seen as the math course that is easiest to take in a compressed amount of time. </p>

<p>D's school inverts the science curriculum, with students taking Physics in 10th grade rather than 12th. That's why many of the students opt for a summer precalc math course prior to 10th grade. If Physics was offered in 12th grade, I'm sure that fewer would take the summer coursework.</p>

<p>It's a good question to be asking now, Streak, and one lots of us have faced. My D decided not to double up at first, then found that she couldn't fit in AP Physics before graduating. So she took pre-calc one summer and had absolutely no trouble going right into calc in 11th. The math director at her school was very against it but she did just fine. She's strong in math but certainly no prodigy. In retrospect, it may have worked out best the way she did it. She was able to do the doubling up in the summer when she didn't have competing classes to pay attention to. The main thing is to stand back a little, just provide your child with information about the pros and cons and let him make the call -- and remember the issue can be revisited down the road.</p>

<p>In California some schools offer Hon physics in the 9th grade and some students opt to go to a community college and get their math requirement over with during the summer in order to take the Hon physics class during the regular school year. The advantage of the community college is that if a student feels he cannot cope he can withdraw or drop from the course before a certain period of time in which case it would not show up on his transcript. On the other hand he might enjoy the course so much that he might want to take that class. Son is no genius either but the community college classes and the environment worked better for him. So it all depends on the student and his personality. The 8 week math course suggested by chocoholic sounds good too if he is not ready for pace at the community college.</p>

<p>My D did precalc at a local college the summer following 10th. She really enjoyed it. Had just started driving and found the whole experience exciting. She didn't actually take the class for credit, at least I don't think so. She took her high school's precalc final at the start of eleventh, did fine on that so went into calc.</p>

<p>I haven't read every post here, but here's my two cents. You certainly don't NEED by any stretch to graduate at the most advanced math offered at your school ESPECIALLY if it's not your strength/passion. You run the risk of burn out, not to mention some B's or below that would easily have been A's with a slightly more normal schedule. Kids get into ivys every day without even taking regular calculus, let alone calculus 2. AP Stats or maybe even AP Econ are both good options. IMHO, it's great that he's good in math, but let him spend time doing what he loves.</p>

<p>
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"Most Rigorous Courses" question is not that he was #1 in all possible subjects, but that your son elected to take the highest levels of classes in his studies that he qualified for in his area of interest and required classes.

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Goaliedad's definition of most rigorous is different than the one at D's school or our town h.s. By GD's definition, even remedial classes would be considered most rigorous if they were the only ones a student qualified for. At our schools, most rigorous means most rigorous offered in the school. I did ask D's GC if girls who opted not to double up on math & science would still have a chance to be designated rigorous schedules, and he said "Of course." He would recommend a girl who loves languages, like your son, double up in those, rather than math or science. In fact, at her h.s., the AP Art History course is the killer. I think a call to the h.s. GC would be a good idea. Going heavy in math/science is not always the tougher schedule.</p>

<p>I'd let him take what he loves. It seems that everyone and his brother doubles in math/science. A double language kid would look pretty interesting, I'd guess.</p>

<p>
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Kids get into ivys every day without even taking regular calculus

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</p>

<p>I have seen contrary statements on some other threads, so could you kindly be specific about how many young people you personally know who got into Ivy League colleges (which ones?) with no calculus course in high school?</p>

<p>Token, aren't we always being told that a kid is only judged against how he performed within the opportunities available to him? Many schools don't even offer calculus. Are you saying those kids are shut out of elite schools? Calculus isn't needed to earn a top score on the SAT, so I can't imagine it's a requirement.</p>

<p>I honestly don't know tons of ivy admitted kids, and everyone I do has had calculus. But I can't believe a kid who wanted to major in, say, classics would need it. Wouldn't it be more appropriate for that kid to take evey language, history, & humanities course he could cram into his schedule?</p>

<p>I know a couple of Ivy admits who took regular (not honors, not AP) calculus. Schools: Dartmouth, Columbia, Penn. These were non-science kids all the way - the one who went to Columbia didn't have AP science, either.</p>

<p>To my knowledge, introductory calculus is offered at all Ivy League colleges. Presumably, these classes are intended for the students who did not take calculus in high school.</p>

<p>For example:</p>

<p><a href="http://webdocs.registrar.fas.harvard.edu/courses/Mathematics.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://webdocs.registrar.fas.harvard.edu/courses/Mathematics.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>(and scroll down a little)</p>

<p>I know that Harvard offers (noncredit) courses as low in math level as precalculus, but that's based on placement testing. I wonder, really, if there are very many students who are admitted to HYP (not to mention the other five Ivy League colleges) without a high school course in calculus on the high school transcript.</p>

<p>I know a kid at an ivy with a strong humanities background and no calculus or physics in h.s.</p>

<p>Well, regardless, I believe OP said her S was interested in science as well as languages. You just can't do the upper level science without the upper level math, so it's good to plan ahead. Laning up once actually stuck into a track is more difficult than doing it before HS even starts.</p>