<p>Just like it is illegal to discrimate in a private sector job... it applies at a private college.</p>
<p>At admissions conferences, it is talked about. You must look at each, individual student.</p>
<p>Yes, private schools have more leeway. But, they also remain quite wary.</p>
<p>Private schools still receive public funds...don't forget that. Federal work study, federal loans, and federal grants for packaging students. They also receive funding for programs for the state, and federal government. </p>
<p>Power to legislate to over private schools receiving public funding.</p>
<p>Just like it is illegal to discrimate in a private sector job... it applies at a private college.</p>
<p>-It is illegal to discriminate overtly, yes, but people can still be hired and fired for pretty much any reason an employer chooses in many states.</p>
<p>Private schools still receive public funds...don't forget that. Federal work study, federal loans, and federal grants for packaging students. </p>
<p>-Indeed schools do get federal funds, however, if they were truly required to follow the same practices that public schools follow, practices like mandatory religious classes and religious preference in admission would surely be illegal.</p>
<p>Yes..that is hire and fire at will... but if an employer exposes that the reason for firing was discrimination or maybe damaging of character... it is actionable. (That is why employers are recommended to not indicate reasons in writing.)</p>
<p>Dealing with religion classes of a private schools...would be an entanglement of church and state. </p>
<p>But honestly...people are making things out to be more than it really is.... as a practice ...schools like to stay on the safe side...whether it is private or public...whether or not they are necessarily legally bound to do so. </p>
<p>I guess we'll both be watching legislation and court cases, to see where this topic heads. Because, of course, it is open to interpretation.</p>
<p>I have to give it you... you put up some good arguments and made me think... I wish you lots of luck in school.</p>
<p>I'm done arguing though.... I need to get some work done. :-)</p>
<p>to drive over 65 in a 65 m.p.h. zone. Should we conclude then that it does not happen?</p>
<p>Very not the point...it's still, as you point out, illegal.</p>
<p>Yes, you cannot discriminate agaisnt different races. But affirmative action, whether its "bonus points" or a simple "wink wink" on the application, there are definitely lowers standards of acceptance, and AA is discrimination. What do you think AA is? It exists and is very real. It's designed to bring certain races up, and therefore, relatively, bring other races down. It's discrimination plain and simple, and through the millions of posts of AA supporter BS I have read, I have never, ever heard even ONE remotely valid reason to continue AA. NOT ONE.</p>
<p>Peter Parker:</p>
<p>to quote you, "Courtjestr19's post sickens me with his ignorance. Okay, you've been discriminated against. WHO CARES. It didn't effect your education or your performance in class. Yeah, I'm white, but some big kid at school didn't like the way I looked apparently, and he kicked my @ss. Now like your discrimination story, it was tragic, but just because some guy mutered a racial slur at you doesn't have to deal with jack over your learning capabilities or how you are presented on your college applications."</p>
<p>you are a hateful person. im sorry you cant settle this with a civilized discussion, i tried to point out the other side, and instead you go and throw explitives at me. if you have done your homework and looked at other posts of mine, not on this thread, fine, but i believe a white person in a predominantly hispanic community deserves AA consideration. this is more along the definition of what it should be than what is actually practiced, and i believe there are problems with the system. did i say it was perfect? no.were ever told that you were inferior because of what race you belonged to and have a desire to just sit home and do nothing? please correct me if im wrong, but it doesnt look like it. am i crying "RACISM"? im saying that it exists, it has personally happened to me, not that i go looking for it. if you want the story, ill tell you what happened. i almost lapsed into a depression because of it. you say that has nothing to do with my work ethic? you are completely and utterly wrong. and my stats are good too, i can compete with any of the people on CC, its just that i see stuff happening to other kids that arent as strong in their character, like my little sister, and i dont want her getting knocked back due to what other people have to say. </p>
<p>i wasnt pushing ideas on anyone if you actually read my post past what you quoted, i was showing the other side. i did so without screaming at anyone or calling anyone an egotistical jerk. so please offer me the common courtesy that i believe i have offered to you by actually reading your post. thank you.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Private schools still receive public funds...don't forget that. Federal work study, federal loans, and federal grants for packaging students. They also receive funding for programs for the state, and federal government. </p>
<p>Power to legislate to over private schools receiving public funding.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>This same statement came up on the law school forum but the same principles hold true at the undergrad level. The attorney who responded stated the following:</p>
<p>Let's not forget, though, that as a matter of federal Constitutional law, Equal Protection applies only to situations where the government is an actor (through the 14th amendment to the states and through the 5th amendment to the federal government), such as in state universities (as was the situation in both of the cases that you mentioned). Private actors, such as private universities, who may not be considered to be state actors (and whether or not a law school, who receives, for example, grant money for research and federal loan program assistance for its students, is a state actor is not a question that has a certain answer), are not bound by these rules, though I believe that most private law schools will look to these Supreme Court decisions as guidance in their programs.</p>
<p>funny how somepeople go about their daily lives as whites 'cause they don't need a reason to claim "hispanic-ness" or "blackness" but once it comes to ticking that box to get a edge in the admission proccess, they do their research and look for black/hispanic traces in them.</p>
<p>and (probably) the same people say affirmative action isn't fair. hypocrites.
be black or hispanic for a week in the united states, come back and tell us if it's the same as being white.</p>
<p>Question... do colleges is prodominately "white" states have to match these quotas? like a college in vermont/new hampshire or maine private or public.</p>
<p>what quotas?</p>
<p>I'm the poster of the information that sybbie referred to from the Law School forum. Just so that everyone is clear, generally, except in some very specific circumstances, the protections provided by the U.S. Constitution (as interpreted, and some would say, expanded, by the courts) apply only to the government, not to private actors. Yes, that's right, for the most part, the Constitution dictates what your federal and state (and by implication, local) governments may and may not do with respect to "suspect" categories such as race, ethnicity and national origin and fundamental rights such as privacy, marriage and free speech (one exception, for example, though is the 13th Amendment, which allows private discriminatory conduct in housing to be regulated). In order to regulate private behavior, the "private" party must actually be acting in some way as a "state actor". That's why public universities, such as the University of Michigan Law School, which are clearly state actors, were the defendants in these recent affirmative action law suits. </p>
<p>The cases are all over the map as to what constitutes state action, but the Supreme Court has held that the grant of a license by the government by the government does not make a private actor into a state actor, nor does the leasing of government property or does certain school funding. As I mentioned on the law school forum, private colleges and law schools (since admission to law school was the basis for the recent affirmative action cases) would have to be proven to be state actors before these requirements would be applicable to them. That said, I believe that most private colleges and law schools will take the guidance doled out by the Supreme Court and take it into consideration in their own admissions policies. </p>
<p>I'm not a constitutional law scholar, and if there is one available, their input would be appreciated, but it is not a safe assumption that the recent Supreme Court decisions regarding affirmative action are applicable to or binding upon private colleges and law schools.</p>
<p>People spend so much time attacking affirmative action on this board. I have yet to hear attacks agains athletic recruitment, alumni preference, potential donors, or how about males at liberal arts colleges, etc etc.</p>
<p>Admissions counselors are not simply stating that a person is black...lets admit. It doesn't work like that. So please stop saying that.</p>
<p>At competitive colleges ...clearly admissable are admitted, clear denies are denied. It is the students in the middle where the soft factors come into play. These are students are average, some below average, others slightly above average. Some students are admitted because they had an amazing interview, so I guess that is unfair for shy people. Some people get an extra wink wink because they had great travel experience and would add to classroom discussion so I guess people who are poor lose that wink. Some people are admitted not because they are the best in the middle pile but they are the best for a particular team; and the team has to be filled, and besides the star athlete was denied because his GPA was horrible. Some people are admitted because its the only applicant from Washington. One applicant was admitted because its the first applicant from a prestigious school we've been trying to get applicants from. Oh a potential donor...admit. Alumni child...admit</p>
<p>Are getting the picture?</p>
<p>People are getting a leg up across the board.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Courtjestr19's post sickens me with his ignorance. Okay, you've been discriminated against. WHO CARES. It didn't effect your education or your performance in class. Yeah, I'm white,
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You don't care If blacks get discriminated against, well, I don't care if YOU get discriminated against in the college process. You probably deserve it.
welcome to the real world. everything won't always go the white kids way okay?
There are tons of all white schools in the United States (at least 95% white or so qualifies as "all white") take your pick and stop whining if you can't stand affirnative action.</p>
<p>The white administrations know why they practice it. take it up to them w/ your "sueing" and don't blame it on blacks. we didn't create the rules (like we actually create any rules :roll eyes: ) make your mouths at them. lol</p>
<p>Let's be serious now,admit it, you'll practice affirmative action yourself if you were some president of Havard and you know AA's one of the programs giving your elite college/university that "diverse" reputation.</p>
<p>Ultima said</p>
<p>"You don't care If blacks get discriminated against, well, I don't care if YOU get discriminated against in the college process. You probably deserve it."</p>
<p>So you're admitting that there IS discrimination in the college application process...</p>
<p>And if you want to speak about bringing one race down to bring another up....How about restrictive housing covenants to prevent people of certain races to build wealth and live in certain communities? How about rampant discrimination in hiring? How about police racial profiling?</p>
<p>Give me a break...how much are you really being brought down?</p>
<p>Spend some time in the communities with lacking educational systems and then come back and talk.</p>
<p>Let's not forget who is in power at colleges and in admissions...</p>
<p>So are they discriminating against themselves?</p>
<p>A key factor in discrimination is power and you must always ask who has it.</p>
<p>Latoya, power is meaningless without support.</p>
<p>Imagine if AA was taken away...How would the black community react? And the hispanic? What about the Native American tribes? And let's not forget about the white's who need those three groups' support.</p>
<p>This arguement can go on forever. The most important thing is what is morally right. Only you can decide for yourself.</p>
<p>
[quote]
"You don't care If blacks get discriminated against, well, I don't care if YOU get discriminated against in the college process. You probably deserve it."</p>
<p>So you're admitting that there IS discrimination in the college application process...
[/quote]
</p>
<p>No, i'm not admiting that there's discrimination in the college application process.
I was only trying to use Peter's point of view. he think's it's discriminatory but i don't care for him 'cause he (peter) doesn't deserve to be cared for. lol. (j/k)</p>
<p>The truth is: there's so much discrimination against minorities.
Even more so, the unvoiced forms of it that's just there and we know it.
So, I find it a little odd that Peter's making a comparison that's not even any where near close.</p>