<p>My daughter's friend was accepted at Harvard, MIT, Columbia, Reed, and University of Washington. Her parents are divorced; father has money, mother does not. Separation agreement provides that father will pay approximately $10,000 per year in tuition; he refuses to pay more. Due to father's income, the child received no aid and is thinking she must attend University of Washington. The guidance counselor is leaving the child on her own, telling her to write letters to the admissions offices, but time is short before she must make a decision. I don't think the child's mother is equipped to intervene. Should I intervene by making phone calls to the colleges? Should I tell the child to make phone calls? Should I get on the guidance counselor's case even though I have little faith in this counselor? Is there any likelihood these schools will come through with more money under these circumstances? I believe her first choice is Columbia. Thanks</p>
<p>It depends. How much contact does the daughter have with the father? She will need to fill out the forms asking for a waiver for non-custodial parent.</p>
<p>I think you have no choice but to stay out of it, except for offering moral support and possibly turning up some helpful information through this forum or other sources. I don't believe the schools would (or should) speak to an uninvolved party, and the GC shouldn't discuss any student with another child's parent.</p>
<p>It's a sad situation. What is the student's relationship with her father like? Is it possible that she could ask him to contribute more (leaving the mother and the separation agreement out of it), and might he do so simply because he loves her and can afford to give her a private education?</p>
<p>A friend of mine went through a painful breakup two years ago. Her ex-husband, a very successful accountant, refused to make any information available to her for the FAFSA. This severely compromised her son's options. Fortunately, the son ended up with a full tuition scholarship at a good third-tier (per US News) school. If your d's friend must go to UW, she can receive an excellent education there, particularly with her obvious talents. As for what her relationship with her dad will be in the future - well, she'll be the one to decide about that, though I believe he ought to be thinking about it now.</p>
<p>Make sure that she sends the school a copy of the court order, so they know what he has been ordered to pay, along with the waiver.</p>
<p>Sometimes the schools will give consideration, but only if the kid, mother and GC really get on the ball and are aggressive about it. But in my experience, schools of the sort you are listing do not. She is considered the same as a kid with an intact set of parents whose father refused to pay more than $10K a year. </p>
<p>Federal and undergraduated college methodology solidly puts the responsibility on the shoulders of the parents when it comes to financing a college education. Think of it as a more generous extension of the high school situation. It would be unheard of for a kid to apply to Choate, Andover, Exeter and then cry poor when Dad or Mom refuse to pay. The schools will certainly not pitch in. In fact, it is even more restrictive because most public highschool options are firmly tied to where the family chooses to live. Well, some of that same thinking goes into an undergraduated education until the kid is 24, married, is a veteran, has dependents or is guardian of the state. </p>
<p>If divorced parents could get out of paying for colleges using a separation agreement and then having the kid cry "poor", it would become a planned strategy in every divorce. Many of our social programs where payment were meant to be a last resort have become front line pay programs so of course college tuition would be no exception. So, the parents are the front line in this endeavor and a kid with an estranged parent who is divorced is in the same boat as one with a parent who just won't pay more than X. I don't agree with the system and wish that it is legally challenged--how can we agree that 21, 18 are legal ages for everything, and then except college tuition? Only for the lobbying of the colleges who would be literally up the creek if that change is ever made.</p>
<p>It is really too bad that this situation didn't come up before applications are due because the girl's best chances of getting more aid would have been by applying to colleges like Washington U, University of Chicago, Rice, Emory, Duke, Vanderbilt, University of North Carolina, and Smith that give excellent merit aid to top candidates.</p>
<p>The reason that the need-based colleges like Harvard aren't likely to give her more aid is because if they did, it would open the floodgates for more selfish wealthy parents to have divorce agreements limiting their college payments to $10 k a year. </p>
<p>I truly doubt that the colleges will take the agreement into account. If the girl would like to go to a higher quality college than U washington, she could do a gap year and reapply to college, focusing on excellent colleges that are likely to offer her good merit aid.</p>
<p>If I recall correctly, the FASFA does not require the non custodial parent to enter information. Do any of her schools only require the FASFA (UW should be one, but maybe none of the others listed.</p>
<p>Similar situation here. My son's father will not contribute, and there is no way to force him. This really illustrates the problem that single parents (let's be frank, it is single MOTHERS +90% of the time - just look at the billions in uncollected child support) may encounter around college expenses when the father is able to contribute but cops a narcissitic attitude. From the school's point of view, it could be fraud, so they are reluctant to assist because it would, perhaps, open the floodgates for others to request the same. From your point of view, you and the child are just sc****d, and there is no recourse. </p>
<p>If he will not relent, she could go to Washington, become a star, and transfer for the last two years - use the $40K then. Her major field will be a yardstick for the total amount of loans she would feel comfortable assuming - her father may agree to help her pay them off.</p>
<p>Reed wants Profile and has requested verification for every year we have applied to include w-2s & 1040s and all forms- also information about bank accounts- etc.
I imagine many private schools are going to want the PROFILE as well.
Do you know what her EFC is? Reed does meet the EFC- but of course for those of us who have to borrow the EFC that still leaves us short- but they don't require any unsubsidized loans to be part of package.
I also agree that she may want to find schools that offer merit- she must be quite a student to have those choices. I do know that schools that use PROFILE can and do interpret EFC in their own way- my nieces at Colgate get way more "need" based aid- than they would qualify for at other schools- I assume because they are top students- so there is some leeway for schools that say they only offer need based aid- often once you are admitted you may find that there is lots of merit aid as well- however at a school like Harvard or Columbia- that may be pretty competive and hard to count on.</p>
<p>Yulsie, I know a number of families that are intact where the parents disagree on what should be spent for college. One parent I know refused to pay for an ivy league school because he felt that Pitt was every bit as good to prepare for med school and he was hell bent on the kid becoming a doctor. And both of his kids did go to Pitt and then med school though I know the older one was accepted to Yale. It was a shocker to alot of people as the family did have the resources to send the kids to private school. I have seen a lot of problems between parents that arise over this issue as well where one parent wants to undergo a program of austerity, borrow, sell, downscale to pay for college and the other does not want to do so. Being married does not mean the parents are of one mind on this and I know many families that have financial problems because one partner is less responsible than the other. My good friend is going nuts because her husband is most indulgent about these things, with no plan or idea of how they are going to pay for all of this. Their D wants to go to Barnard, and their budget says $20K a year because of all of the debts they have, and they have been living above their means for years, mainly because of the H's inability to budget or refrain from buying and getting what he wants. This is not a college problem, it has been there for years, but the college tuition is just another bone of contention int he same vein. If it is up to the H, the girl is likely to find her tuition unpaid one term and she can't register, very humiliating. And believe me, it happens all the time at schools where parents are later or cannot come up with the payment. Anyone with experience with colleges will tell you this is not an unusual occurance.</p>
<p>It might be possible to reopen the court decision and ask the father to pay more. I'm just mentioning this NOT advising it.</p>
<p>What an awful situation! If the daughter wants to go, she should definitely call the schools and at least tell them the story. The GC is totally dropping the ball and needs to be smacked around by someone with a better understanding of the profession IMHO.</p>
<p>I understand why the schools have the rules they do -- if the daughter gets financial aid, then essentially other parents are paying for her education while her deadbeat dad enjoys his money. But it is really unfair to a student like this.</p>
<p>Yulsie, I'm sorry about your situation. I know you did not write to ask for sympathy, or anything. You have a very talented son.</p>
<p>Hanna, it is unfair to every student who has parents who will not pay when the financial statements say they can. It is unfair to be stuck with the parents you have.</p>
<p>The most important thing you can do in admissions to prestige colleges (and to pay for them) is to choose your parents well - if you don't, it's your own fault! </p>
<p>Everyone should consider themselves warned. ;)</p>
<p>A student who is capable enough to be admitted to MIT & Harvard- should be eligible for merit aid even if her family can't/won't pay the EFC, I am wondering since it sounds like the dad isn't cooperative and that the mom also has difficulties if the GC did not at least suggest schools that offer merit aid?
I can't think of anything that would help in time for this student- but I hope other families are paying attention.
Some schools only offer need based aid people and that is the schools definition of need- not your own! :(
There is a highly rated honors program at UW- and I believe for some students they even waive tuition.</p>
<p>I would suggest not giving up harvard</p>
<p>contact the admissions office and tell them your situation</p>
<p>Jami and those of you in the know, have you ever seen a single case where a school accepted such a story and gave more aid? We know someone in this boat and the very knowledgable counselor says they never make exceptions. This makes sense to me as it really would open the floodgates, but I'm wondering if it ever happens for someone a school really wants.</p>
<p>Sasha, while you may be genuinely concerned, you have to take a step back out the situation. Live on a few more days and you will see that there are 3 sides to every story: yours, mine and the truth. And if you ever notice the one that is telling the tale of woe, may sometimes paint a picture using a limited frame of reference.</p>
<p>Because there is an court agreement the child probably could not get a non-custodial waiver because the father does financially support the child (where the waiver is basically for kids who recieve nothing financially or socially from the absentee parent. most of the time you must demonstrate that you or the child has had no contact). </p>
<p>Even with the agreement in place schools beleive that parents have a moral and social obligation and are first in line in funding their childrens education. when this is not done the parent is esentially saying that someone else's parents should pay for thier child's education (where do you thing the endowments come from-alumni some who are the parents of others). Need based financial aid is given according to what the school beleives a family can afford to pay, not what the court says a parent should pay and not what the parents want ot pay.</p>
<p>A lot of this is closing the barn door after the cow has left because what they could realistically pay as a family given the best and worse case scenarios should have been discussed (at least between D an mom because mom knew how much Dad had a legal obligation contribute) before the college process took place. </p>
<p>Dad has apparently decided to pay his legal obligation and nothing more(it may sound nice but he is within his right to do this). </p>
<p>I hate to sound cruel but if child wants a $40,000 sticker school and know that they have no money what is the plan. while the support order is also suppose to help maintain the cost of providing the child a home even when they are away at home, Daughter and mother should look at their finances. Since the finances are not mixed, Mother probably also has an EFC.</p>
<p>Dad- $10,000</p>
<p>Mom is also tasked to pay something based on her financial situation (if mom is not working she may have to get a job to help pay for this school)</p>
<p>What amount currently given as child support can be contributed to the cost of this bill </p>
<p>Student has an EFC (summer earnings)</p>
<p>Kid takes on an afterschool and summer job (in the words of Jamimom, works extra shifts saves everything)</p>
<p>They may have to take out loans (not a concept that I agree with)</p>
<p>other options;</p>
<p>Depending on the state, mom could go back to court, ask for an upward modification on support and ask for a review based on the college cost (the court still however won't make him ay the $40K as mom would still have to contribute)</p>
<p>Daughter may have to go where her money can take her</p>
<p>Daughter may have to take a GAP year and apply to schools that have merit to fill the gap using Dad's $10,000 as a jumping off point.</p>
<p>Of course no school is going to make an exception for a wealthy kid because the divorce agreement only calls for him to pay X, nor should they. This idea that every child deserves to go to the finest college (at a cost to others) is alive and well but makes no more sense than that every child deserves a Mercedes because it's among the finest cars.</p>
<p>For better or worse, kids applying to college have to live with their parent's means and values. They have had to live with them all of their lives. The child of the wealthy dad probably got to live in nice homes in good neighborhoods and go to wonderful ECs and summer programs. The kid who qualifies for full aid probably did not have those benefits growing up. We all live with different advantages and lack there of.</p>