Andover, Exeter, Hotchkiss

Prep School Admissions
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<p>First - let me respond to those saying “what is the climate.” There is NO definitive answer for that. One person may love a school and someone else may find the same climate austere and off putting. So you HAVE TO go to the campus and find out. There is NO substitute. Even if you have to borrow the money from a relative - get on a cheap Southwest flight, rent a car and visit. It’s the only way to know. My D LOVED Access Exeter, didn’t like Exeter as it existed during the regular year. </p>

<p>HOWEVER: EtonDad is correct. Over the past few years a number of staff members, and alum ( including me) were vocal about Exeter going in the wrong direction. It was always a small college, “sink or swim” school, but --frankly-- became even more so. Let me give you an example of contrast in cultures:</p>

<p>One parent told me a story of when their child was asked to leave Exeter for academic reasons, not a single student or teacher was there to say goodbye. Not even in the dorm. The parent described the atmosphere as cold and heartless. (and I’m being polite in my vernacular).</p>

<p>In contrast, at Taft, when a student was asked to leave, every student wore black in protest and lined the halls to hug him as he left. And some teachers. And this was not necessarily a “popular” kid. Just part of the family.</p>

<p>EtonDad has it right - it’s been acting like the Marine corps and Hassan realized that Exeter would suffer long term without a “course correction.” So one change is the implementation of pass-fail for the first term to take the intense pressure off high achieving students. The other was in the “welcome” video sent to new admits this year that showed a kinder, more engaged campus. Next we’re hoping for a change in “attitude” among some of the faculty.</p>

<p>So take it for what it’s worth. The current headmaster (Hassan) is the BEST thing that has happened to Exeter in decades. In the example I gave above, I pointed out that had that particular Exeter student been given a different academic advisor (a teacher I met on campus) the student (who was gifted) would have thrived. So it wasn’t a surprise when talking to the parent that the name of the same teacher was mentioned as the ideal that would have made a difference. I sent a note to Exeter and said “make him the best practice model.” </p>

<p>As for other schools…</p>

<p>Andover, is equally tough but emphasizes that it picks nice kids. One CC parent said when her D did a revisit at Deerfield she got a hug from her interviewer. (and so on and so forth)</p>

<p>So climate is everything. My husband banned me from revisit day so he could form his own opinions. But he texted his impressions and his observations of my daughter’s reactions throughout the day. She’d have done fine at any school, but one emerged as the clear favorite.</p>

<p>If you can’t visit a school - then throwing darts at names on a wall is as good as anything. They are ALL good schools with pros and cons. Some are just more nurturing than others. But then again - depends on the kid.</p>

<p>For those going to Exeter, expect it to be in cultural transition - and I mean that in a good way. It’s been long overdue. It’s possible to be a tough school and still be a nice place. Looks like that is what you’re going to get over the next few years :)</p>

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<p>Also think of a long line of 300+ students all lining up to apply to Ivy, top colleges. Now matter how good a school is, HYPMS won’t take all kids from one school. This is another advantage of smaller schools like Hotchkiss.</p>

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<p>Etondad lends excellent insight. We have seen little to no handholding at Exeter. It is like a small college and offers a world-class educational experience, probably unmatched, but it is not for everyone because it requires an inordinate degree of discipline, integrity, grit, and hard, hard work that most teenagers don’t necessarily have in their quiver (and shouldn’t be expected to, frankly). We have several children and know, for example, that Exeter would be a proper fit for maybe two of them only. Our current student, however, is thriving and we are grateful. Extreme rigor was what she wanted but she’s also had plenty of fun, too, and enjoyed opportunities I can’t see her getting elsewhere (other than maybe Andover - ha). She has gone from relatively shy/reserved to a Harkness warrior (though still nice!) excited about and ready to conquer the world. We have our issues with the school, for sure, but we are very satisfied on the whole.</p>

<p>I see the confusion about structure/independence and so forth. In visiting the schools you mention a few years back, I felt that Exeter did offer more structure and rules than Andover did and I preferred that as a parent sending one’s child thousands of miles away. A safety net, so to speak. Perhaps the problem lies in defining the term “independence,” which can mean a host of things positive and not so. Whatever the case, a child who doesn’t have a solid moral compass, serious self-discipline, organizational skills, and focused work ethic is far more likely to “sink” at either school (academically or through stress and/or discipline issues – and there are all too many kids flailing about and getting themselves into trouble, to my mind).</p>

<p>Sorry I don’t know more about Hotchkiss, though I know the area well and it’s lovely if, yes, a bit more of a hike to the airport. (And I agree that size should be a consideration.) Anyhow, congrats on your acceptances! I think all three schools are fantastic but believe you will know, straight away, which one fits you best after a visit (though don’t be fooled by all the swag and extra excitement they put on display during those days! It can ring a little disingenuous and not accurately reflect a true day in the life). Personally, I would never choose a B school without visiting - it’s just too important.</p>

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<p>I cannot speak to Andover myself, but I can tell you a bit about Exeter. My son attends PEA. There is no “hand holding” per say as far as people checking if you are doing your homework, did you have all your servings of fruit today, did you take a shower, etc. They expect a certain level of maturity and self-sufficiency from the students they accept. </p>

<p>It is very, very rigorous academically. My son has very little free time. He usually takes Saturdays off unless of course he has to go to class or there is a big project due. Otherwise, he is either in school-(classes/sports go from 8am to 6pm everyday except Wednesday), or he is doing homework. He has had several nights where he was up until 1 or 2 am finishing papers. It is not for the faint at heart for sure and not the right school for everyone.</p>

<p>What Exeter does have though is support. The faculty is amazingly supportive. They will meet with students, help students any way they can. There are opportunities for students to seek out peer tutors, the advisors can help as well. One caveat to this support. The student needs to SEEK OUT these opportunities. They will not just come to them. The child has to be proactive and know they need the help then ask for it. </p>

<p>Don’t get me wrong, he does have fun. He LOVES going to Exeter. But he is also disciplined enough to know when it is time to get to work. Yes, if you are not self-disciplined you could get into real trouble academically and it wouldn’t take long. Things move at a very brisk pace. </p>

<p>I hope that helps answer your question.</p>

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<p>^^ I couldn’t agree with you more about Tom Hassan. He will go down as one of the great principals (they don’t use the therm Head) in Exeter history. He his trying by force of will to change the direction of this very large ship. He has been there 5 years now and is finally able to have the credibility and authority to shift the school culturally. It will be exciting to see how Exeter changes–for the better.</p>

<p>They take the idea of “goodness and knowledge” very seriously and like Andover, its motto is “non sibi” (not for one’s self)–and it is common to have someone at the school speak about “non sibi” in a way of doing things (small example-- the college counseling center will not let students “collect acceptances”-- because in doing so it hurts other students --so its “your top one and you’re done”-- the Academy will not support an application in RD, for example, if a student has gotten his or her early acceptance --regardless if it is ED/SCEA or EA.)</p>

<p>Are there things that are maddening?-- of course-- for example, the arts do not have adequate facilities --and that is a focus of a major fundraising endeavor that is soon to happen according to the Bulletin–but even after that building is up, it will still need more (the plans for example do not include an adequate large concert hall-- the Academy has to borrow the Exeter High School hall for the Christmas concert-and that won’t change after the new building is up.).</p>

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<p>For me at least, the size of Hotchkiss appeals to me more than the size of Exeter and Andover. I feel like for high school, it is better to go to a place where you know almost everyone; it makes it a much more friendly atmosphere. On the other side, many people totally disagree with me and love the size of Exeter and Andover.</p>

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<p>Our experience with Exeter has not been quite so cold and impersonal. I write this as a counter point to some of the other views expressed here.</p>

<p>DC is a prep, in advanced (relative to Exeter) math and physics, playing a sport, and active in ECs on campus and some off, very rarely is up much past 1030/ 1100 and often finds time to take a weekend day off and catch up on tv shows or movies, reading for pleasure etc. DC is hoping to make Highest Honors in the term just ended and based on mid term grades thinks this is not an unreasonable goal.</p>

<p>DC reports great relationships with both teachers and other students, absolutley loves shcool and had started calling it home over the current break.</p>

<p>is it hard work? yes. is it a boot camp? Not from what i see. I see smart, organized, motivated kids having fun learning together and having the freedom to be smart. But I also seem them as having the flexibility to be the kids they still are. I see the support there to make sure they don’t go off the rails too far. Maybe a bit, but not too far.</p>

<p>Is it a place for a kid who needs to be told to do homework, or study, or plan ahead to be ready for the paper due next week, or brush teeth at night? Probably not, but i am not sure i think this should be the case at any boarding school. </p>

<p>I don’t ahve extensive experience with other schools, just don’t make your decision based on posts about Exeter being a cold and hard and uncaring/ inhumane place.</p>

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<p>Andover parent here. Much of what is being said about Andover in this thread, by folks who aren’t affiliated with PA, is just plain wrong. The Exeter interviewer who said that Andover students are totally independent, make their own schedules, etc. is wrong. The school seeks to instill independence in it’s students, but that’s something that evolves over time. For new 9th graders, there actually is a good bit of hand-holding. Ninth graders live together in 9th grade dorms with house counselors who also serve as their academic advisors. These adults check in with their advisees daily to make sure that the kids are finding their way and learning the ropes. They monitor the kids’ academic performance, and if anyone is having trouble, they get support for that kid. They routinely check in with parents too to let them know how their child is doing. There are the usual rules about signing in and out of the dorm and keeping rooms reasonably clean, and lights have to be out at 11:00. In my daughter’s dorm, the stuffing the towel under the door trick would never have worked, and there were penalties for students who did not have lights off at 11:00. There are also regular dorm meetings that the kids must attend. So, all in all, I would say that there’s a lot of structure for 9th graders, and I would even describe the 9th grade dorm experience as almost nurturing. </p>

<p>After 9th grade, however, students are expected to be much more independent. The adults are still there if needed, but it’s up to the student to seek them out when they need help. While we heard from our daughter’s 9th grade advisor on a regular basis, we never hear from her current advisor unless we contact her. Our child does meet with her from time to time, but I have no idea how often. There are still curfew rules, required dorm meetings, work/duty assignments, etc., but after 9th grade, there is no time that lights have to be out. </p>

<p>Academically, I think the school is probably very similar to the way that etondad describes Exeter. While not all the classes are around a Harkness table, many are and almost all are discussion based. If you are not prepared for class, everyone knows it. The course work is very very rigorous. Even lower level course are called “college biology,” “college chemistry,” etc. The workload is ridiculously heavy, and there are time-consuming sports requirements for everyone, even the non-athletes. In order for kids to handle the work, sports and extracurriculars, they basically don’t sleep. There is virtually no free time. The grading is brutal. The grades are not curved up. There are no extra credit opportunities. You get what you get, and if the class average on that APBC Calculous test is 69 and the highest grade is 78, you still get what you get. </p>

<p>Like at Exeter, there’s plenty of support for students who seek it out. But you do have to seek it out and ask for help. Teachers have open conference periods each week and on more than one occasion a teacher has met with my daughter on a Saturday afternoon or a Sunday night or whenever it can be worked out. There are peer tutors, a writing center where you can get help with your writing, a counseling office for kids struggling with stress, etc. </p>

<p>Still, Andover is not for the faint of heart. You have to real grit to survive the place. If you don’t start out with it, then you have to develop it. It’s not for everyone, but for driven, independent kids who can manage their time and handle the stress, it’s a fantastic place. My daughter works her tail off, but she loves it. She is getting a world-class education. And, yes, she’s having some fun too. </p>

<p>I can’t speak to Exeter or Hotchkiss, but for the right kid, Andover is an awesome place to be.</p>

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<p>^^ Thanks, Mrs. Weasley, for your insights. The idea that Andover might be mistaken for Putney was always silly. </p>

<p>Bottom line-- great schools-- go and experience them once more and go where you feel most at home-- after all, it will be home for four years.</p>

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<p>They are all great schools and we liked different aspects of each when we visited during the application process. Thank you for the helpful responses from current/former parents. Two other questions: Athletics. She is a good but not superstar athlete. She plays three seasons at her current school and loves being on a team. We are wondering if she will be able to participate either on a team (whether JV, Varsity A or B) if she is not a recruited athlete?</p>

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<p>I also thank you, Mrs. Weasley; you read my mind (my daughter graduated Andover in 2012). I also agree with etondad. </p>

<p>I also think that the kids are so heterogeneous at these schools that there’s not necessarily one perfect match: your child may well thrive at any of these great schools.</p>

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<p>Depends on the sport. Generally kids can start–and are encouraged to do so–new sports at school and will begin on a JV-- they can move up to Varsity as they improve. Obviously some kids come with significant experience and will go directly to a varsity-- but, except for postgrads-- boarding schools are not like colleges-- by and large kids are not recruited athletes and teams are not made up of only recruited athletes.</p>

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<p>I like Mrs. Weasley’s story of apple pie and ice cream description of boarding school life at Andover.</p>

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<p>chloes – “Apple pie and ice cream”? What does that mean? I’m just describing what has been my kid’s experience at her school. It is what it is.</p>

<p>As far as participating on a sports team at Andover, in at least in some of the sports, there’s a level below JV that practices, travels and competes against other schools. And to play at that level, you don’t have to be good at it.</p>

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<p>Excellent, excellent, and more excellent posts on both Exeter and Andover. Extremely helpful. You’ll notice in my post above how I mentioned that Exeter was so hand holding, rules, rules, rules and Andover is just so independent and a whole lot of fun.
I knew that these 2 extremes couldn’t possibly be what it’s really like. I wrote what I wrote so others would come out and say, “No, it’s not like that… it’s like this…” I think it worked and it’s exactly the kind of posts that possible future parents need to hear. I just knew that these 2 schools had to both be more toward the middle than what it seems like everyone is posting about these schools. Thank you so much for your posts. If other parents/grads/or current students or even the same posters have more to add, it’d be wonderful to hear more and more about these schools.</p>

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<p>I got very different take-away’s from Etondad and ExieMITAlum’s posts. To me, Etondad is saying Exeter is a challenging place but Exie is saying Exeter is a horrible place. And coming from an alum interviewer as Exie is, it sounds to me there was some sort of mainstream concensus on Exeter heading to “a wrong direction”, which might be true IDK. Just out of curiosity, did the headmaster openly address this “wrong direction” and a plan for a fundamental change of Exeter culture?</p>

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<p>The Principal (gotta get the PEA lingo) Tom Hassan would never make a speech about such things-- rather it comes from the actions he makes–and even then he needed to be in the job a few years before making those changes (It is very much a faculty ruled place–like a liberal arts college–and the principal has only so much authority and no authority in any curricular area-- he can recommend but it is the faculty who dispose.). </p>

<p>It isn’t that there was a wrong direction in terms of a radical shift or a fundamental change – I would see it, in nautical terms, as a course correction. Like all institutions is can start become a bit too much of what it is–and Tom is just asking that the tiller be trimmed.</p>

<p>It is a wonderful, amazing place. I am quite prejudiced here, but I think it is the finest secondary school education in the US. My D loved it-- and my S will be going as a prep in the Fall. She wanted him to attend very very badly. I would never send my S to a place which was horrible–and I sincerely doubt ExieMIT was saying it is horrible-- just that it is an unique place with a very special culture that is not for everyone-- and Exeter is aware of that fact. </p>

<p>It demands more from the student than the student ever thinks they can produce–and the vast majority of them exceed even those expectations. Many find that even Harvard or Yale or CalTech can’t compare with the intellectual rigor they found at Exeter. But it comes at a price-- it is tough–it does not coddle and the students revel in the Marine Corps attitude. </p>

<p>That is why the Academy does not put on a “dog and pony show” during revisit days (see the schedule on exeter.edu–not much differnt than an ordinary day-- the prospective lives the life for a day and determines if it is right for him or her–and there will be no ice cream trucks parked anywhere) but in fact Mr Gary and Mr Hassan will go out of there way to say that you should carefully discern if Exeter is right for you–that they hope you will find that it is–but if it is not, they wish you the best and urge you not to accept the offer.</p>

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<p>Thanks Etondad. Exie, sorry I must’ve misread you. I know you agree with EtonDad on why Exeter needs a “course correction”, but do you agree what Etondad said (I have a feeling that you don’t):

</p>