<p>On a similar note, I know that Bill Maher and Coulter, both Cornellians, are debating each other on Monday. Does anybody know how one can view the debate?</p>
<p>omg there's an ann coulter advertisement at the top of this page</p>
<p>NOOO there's one on the top of my page AND one on the whole left side!!! ahhh make it stop!</p>
<p>Poor Keef really looked rattled. What a phony....he's like some pothead (communications major - same thing) from Chico State claiming to have graduated from Cal.</p>
<p>Olbermann destroyed her. Was that 1 of 1.01 statistic accurate? If Keith could take just as many classes as her at the Arts classes for a tenth of the price, what was the point of going to the Arts college?</p>
<p>Coulter, Comedian Rush Limbaugh, O'Reilly, HANNITY, ESPECIALLY HANNITY, and Glenn Beck are all idiots. Fox Noise is a complete joke, as is the Republican Party, now led by Rush Limbaugh.</p>
<p>Olbermann destroys Fox news every day. It is always fun to watch.</p>
<p>Ew..Coulter ads. She's sooo ugly, lol. I see why peopel say Man Coulter now.</p>
<p>I dislike her...however Fox news is more credible than MSNBC, and I don't see where they fit into our conversation of Ann's article? MSNBC is the media extension of the Obama administration.</p>
<p>Just ask Chris "I feel a THRILL going up my leg!" Matthews.</p>
<p>While Coulter has been lambasted on this thread for inaccurate claims, these objections have consisted for the most part of minutia, such as, putting commas in SAT scores, an 's' in Communication, not acknowledging Penn's Dept. of Communication, and not adhering to the Ivy League's strict definition as an athletic conference.</p>
<p>Save for noting a similar acceptance percentage between CAS and CALS, no one has examined the accuracy of Coulter's essential point, that CAS not CALS has selectivity consistent with inclusion in the Ivy League. </p>
<p>There is a significant difference between CALS's and CAS's SAT scores. CALS's SAT 25-75% is lower than CAS, lower than fellow Ivy Penn, and lower than non-Ivy's such as Georgetown</a>, Johns Hopkins, and USC. Other colleges besting CALS in SAT's include non-Ivy's Northwestern</a>, Rice, Vanderbilt and Emory.</p>
<p>........................CALS.............CAS........Georgtwn.......JHU...........Penn..........USC
SAT CR 25-75....600-720......650-740.....650-750.....630-730....650-750....620-720
SAT M 25-75....630-740......670-770.....650-740.....650-760....680-770....650-740
ACT.....25-75....27-33..........29-33...........29-33.......28-33........29-33........28-32</p>
<p>If Olbermann had attended USC he could hardly boast of having an Ivy League credential, nonetheless, he would have graduated from a college of similar selectivity to CALS.</p>
<p>@JW Muller</p>
<p>Being part of the Ivy League has nothing to do with the narrowly focused — and marginal differences of — selectivity you keep listing. Rather it relates to having a history, over the course of many decades, amongst certain eastern university "elites" regarding their collegiate sports conference. This has been mentioned more than once in this thread, and it is correct. Also, it has been presented more than once that CALS is an integral, and fully fledged, portion of Cornell. Cornell is Ivy League, hence CALS is Ivy League. It is as simple as that.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Save for noting a similar acceptance percentage between CAS and CALS, no one has examined the accuracy of Coulter's essential point, that CAS not CALS has selectivity consistent with inclusion in the Ivy League.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I don't think anybody is denying the fact that CALS is slightly less selective than CAS, and ergo, has statistics that are more along the lines of a Georgetown or a JHU than Harvard, Yale, or Princeton. </p>
<p>
[quote]
that CAS not CALS has selectivity consistent with inclusion in the Ivy League.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>And I'm not certain what this means. What does selectivity "consistent" other schools have anything do with a sports conference? When Penn and Brown had higher acceptance rates and lower test scores than a lot of other schools in the League, nobody was calling them out on the fact that maybe they shouldn't be part of a sports conference.</p>
<p>Even so, when any of the other seven schools decides that a principal part of their mission is to educate and conduct research on important topics affecting agriculture, food development, plant science, natural resource management, or animal behavior, or yes, even communication or developmental sociology, I would love to see just how 'selective' they can become.</p>
<p>Look. I don't think anybody is denying that Olbermann is a bit over the top in boasting about himself and his credentials, even if everything that he has said has been true. Quite frankly, I look down anybody who boasts about any school being in the Ivy League -- it's a damn sports conference and good for some friendly banter about sports rivalries. But that's about it.</p>
<p>And you say that we are complaining about minutia, but the fact of the matter is that every substantive point in Coulter's column is wrong. All of Cornell is considered land-grant. All of Cornell is considered private. All of Cornell is part of the Ivy League in that all undergrad students are eligible to be varsity athletes. There are many distinguished alums of the Ag school, including former heads of state. There is no large difference in the acceptance rates between the colleges. And the average SAT scores for both colleges are quite higher than the number that Coulter quoted. </p>
<p>But this is all besides the point. The point is that Coulter engaged in a ridiculous ad hominem attack on Olbermann, lambasting him for not attending the "real" "Ivy" Cornell, which just doesn't make any sense. All seven undergraduate colleges are seen as equals among students at Cornell -- whether it be from an athletics perspective, an academic perspective, an extra-curricular perspective, or however else you would like to dice it. There is more variation in aptitudes and abilities of students within any one college than there is across the colleges at Cornell, and that's why it is sophomoric to call anybody out on the particular college of their choice.</p>
<p>I have two friends from Cornell currently getting their PhD at Harvard in the Economics department. One was in Arts and the other was in Ag. But I suppose the one in Arts was the only one who was "really" qualified for his PhD work, in the same way that Coulter is the only one who is free to claim that she attended Cornell.</p>
<p>I think what we're foirgetting is that Cornell, along with Penn, constitutes the crappier Ivies. Cornell has the highest acceptance rate in the Ivy League (funny how Coulter didn't mention that) and Penn is always confused with Penn State (and it has the 2nd highest acceptance rate) . Her calling Olberman not Ivy enough is like the pot calling the kettle black.</p>
<p>So Separatist, did you manage to get into that pass/fail haven of Brown yet? Cornell's academic rigor a bit to tough for you? Did you know that your dream school Brown is yet another college that many snooty elitists like to denigrate, and that it has had its phases of being broadly considered the lowest ivy? Some of those snobby elitists would say that now is one of those phases.</p>
<p>^you guys are being miniature versions of Ann. Honestly, the school doesn't mean jack$*#t if the individual cannot deliver in their respective field. I have more respect for a person who graduated from a non-ivy and climbed their way up the corporate ladder opposed to those of us who will be privileged enough to attend one of these great schools. I know I am incredibly grateful for being given the chance to study at CALS, even if it isnt the "real Cornell". I'll take my Old MacDonald education and make wonders with it. </p>
<p>The ivies (and schools the same caliber) are all great, every single one... get over it. 1% of the world's population goes to college; you really have to split hairs of the top 1% of schools those people go to?</p>
<p>First of all, "crappier" and "highest acceptance rate" need not go hand in hand. The programs with the least-exceptional entrance stats at Cornell, as typically portrayed, are among the best of their types in the whole country. Nobody has anything to apologize for, in that regard. Some schools may be "better" for a particular individual, but whether that is the case is not necessarily completely dictated by a school's entrance stats.</p>
<p>Moreover, when I applied the entrance stats at Cornell CAS were not much different than Columbia's, and were quite noticably more selective than Penn's. And all entrance stats were published broken out by college, not aggregated. I would imagine the framework these people are operating under is similar to mine, whatever may be the case currently. Therefore I would not expect her to have any great chip in her shoulder on the specific point of CAS, at least, "belonging" with the others. Because back then some other colleges at a couple of the other universities had weaker or very comparable stats. Yeah the other school bands played "old McDonald" at football games, but we had our tunes too; I don't think many people back then felt we didn't belong. I certainly didn't; I was darned proud, and honored, to be there.</p>
<p>BTW CALS now accepts smaller % now than 5 of the Ivy League colleges did when I applied. And the %s for the other three were not that much smaller.</p>
<p>Two of the smartest people I knew at Cornell were students in the Ag school. Last I heard they were both professors at the same top "ivy" university. They were so smart that they paid a fraction of the cost for their education, yet more expense could not possibly have propelled them to any better result.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I know I am incredibly grateful for being given the chance to study at CALS, even if it isnt the "real Cornell".
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Don't get into this mindset. CALS is the real Cornell.</p>
<p>Well, by crappier I meant to say 'lesser', which still goes against what you said monydad, but I think today that Cornell (and once again, Penn) do not have as high a profile as the other Ivies. They're still some of the best schools in the country and the world, I won't doubt that, and Cornell has good name recognition overseas, but I think domestically it gets crowded out by the high-profile Ivies (Brown, Columbia, HYP).</p>
<p>Cayuga- Don't worry, I'm not in that mindset. I was trying to be sarcastic (fail, lol)</p>
<p>separatist- If we're talking profiling and recognition, I definitely wouldn't say Brown's a leader. I've been to Europe several times, and Everyone's heard of Harvard and Yale, most Cornell and Princeton, and once in awhile Columbia, but that's mostly it. And many Asian states consider Cornell as high as Harvard. It's all about perception and culture, not solely quality. There is no way to quantify school rankings. Sure, it's fun to watch the changes and see their methodologies, but I would never actually form or make a decision based on them.</p>
<p>Brown? lol</p>
<p>I do not think Brown or Dartmouth has any more name-recognition domestically than Cornell or Penn.</p>
<p>Internationally, it's not even a contest.</p>
<p>I would be curious to hear what makes Brown a 'high profile' school.</p>
<p>
[quote]
but I think today that Cornell (and once again, Penn) do not have as high a profile as the other Ivies...Cornell has good name recognition overseas, but I think domestically it gets crowded out by the high-profile Ivies (Brown, Columbia, HYP).
[/quote]
Hahah it's so funny how you keep trying to lump in Brown with HYP and act like Cornell is inferior - hate to break it to ya, but Brown is ranked the lowest of the Ivies, nowhere near HYP, closer to WUSTL and JHU. outside of rankings, in popular culture watched by everyday Americans, Brown is always seen as the easier Ivy as well - it's been poked fun at on shows like Gilmore Girls, Greek, Gossip Girl...(haha now you know what trashy TV shows I watch). I'm just giving examples of how it's viewed in popular culture as well as academic rankings.</p>
<p>I personally think rankings don't make a big difference in education once you get to the top 20, and all top colleges will provide you with an amazing education, but it's kind of funny you keep trying to insult Cornell and Penn and holding up Brown as if it's the next MIT. Brown is a good college in it's own right, congrats if you were recently accepted, but don't try to act superior for going to Brown.</p>