<p>Hi if any UC Berkeley students are double majoring in Economics and Business could you tell me your experience in terms of classes overlapping, difficulty or if you thought it was worthwhile to pursue both disciplines? Thanks!</p>
<p>I'm at a CC finishing my prerequisites to apply and I'm considering doing concurrent enrollment for statistics 21 because at my CC there are no equivalent classes for the Econ stat prerequisite.</p>
<p>Hi, I’m currently doubling in Economics and Business - just created this account to hopefully help you out! </p>
<p>First, I’m not too sure about this, but I believe you have to apply to Haas directly when you submit your transfer application (i.e. can’t submit your application to L&S for Econ and hope to also transfer to Haas later). I’m not sure if the converse is true (i.e. if you applied to Haas, got in, and want to also double in Econ, which is in L&S).</p>
<p>On classes overlapping: As you might know, Microeconomics and Macroeconomics overlap. The Economics department requires you to take Micro and Macro with the Econ department (Econ 100A/Econ101A and Econ100B/Econ101B, respectively). Haas approves Econ 100A/101A and Econ 100B/101B as substitutes for the “business” Micro and Macro classes, but you need 38 upper division UGBA units, so you need to make up those units by taking “more” electives at Haas to make the 38 units. (See: <a href=“http://www.haas.berkeley.edu/Undergrad/pdf/requirements_for_degree_F12.pdf[/url]”>www.haas.berkeley.edu/Undergrad/pdf/requirements_for_degree_F12.pdf</a>)</p>
<p>From the Econ website: “Students completing double majors or simultaneous degrees are only allowed to overlap a maximum of two courses. This includes micro and/or macro economics.” This means that you are ONLY allowed to overlap Microeconomics and Macroeconomics if you’re doubling in Econ and Business. See the following link for the list of approved Econ classes: <a href=“https://www.econ.berkeley.edu/undergrad/current/major-requirements[/url]”>Major Requirements | Department of Economics;
<p>Difficulty: Both Econ and Business classes tend to be bell-curved, so your grade in both is your performance relative to your peers. A lot of people say that business classes tend harder because of the “Haas curve”, but from my experience, I don’t think this is necessarily true. Imo, if you know how to study (spending time learning concepts and actually doing problem sets instead of cramming everything at the last minute) and participate in discussions (mostly for business classes), you should probably be fine.</p>
<p>Finally, if it’s worth it: I’m pretty sure this varies on a case-by-case basis, ha. There are people who double because it’s not that hard to squeeze in both classes if you started taking upper-divs in your sophomore year. I’ve also heard some people say it’s not worth it, because econ and business are so “similar”. Some of my business friends really hate econ. Personally, I think it’s worth it, because I really like econ and what I want to get out of econ and business is pretty different. So I guess this might come down to (1) whether you can reasonably fit all the classes for both and (2) why you want to double. If you’re doubling for a job, I don’t know if it would really be worth it. Also, I’d imagine trying to fit your econ + business classes as a transfer might be kind of hard to do in two years. Don’t really know, though.</p>
<p>Just my two cents - let me know if anything’s unclear or if you have any other questions!</p>
<p>Side note on Stat 21: Yeah, most of the Econ transfers I knew had to do Stats 21 in their first fall semester. I think they said that it was because the stats they took at CC wasn’t calculus-based, but Stat 21 wasn’t really either, if I remember… kind of sucks.</p>
<p>Sorry, just reread my post. A quick clarification on overlapping classes in case that part was unclear: </p>
<p>You can only overlap a maximum of two classes. Since you have to take Micro and Macro with the Economics dept (and UGBA accepts the Econ equivalents), those are the two classes you will overlap if you pursue a double degree in Econ and Business.</p>
<p>So, if you doubled, you would take:
Econ 100A/101A, Econ100B/101B, Econ 140/141, and (5 econ electives) AND
UGBA 100, 102A-B, 103-107, and ((38 - 24 = 14) units of UGBA electives).</p>
<p>I.e. the upper division courses would be about 32 units of economics courses (including 100/101 A/B) and 38 units of business courses, for a total of 70 units of upper division courses. Also, economics requires at least one math or statistics course taken at Berkeley (usually a statistics course for transfers, since most CCs do not have one that economics accepts) for another 4 units, making a total of 74 units. Since most CCs do not offer a course that articulates to the American Cultures requirement, you would need to take such a course; one upper division business course (159AC) and no upper division economics courses fulfill it, so if you do not take UGBA 159AC as a business elective, you would need to add another course.</p>
<p>So a transfer student wanting to complete both degrees in the four semesters allowed for the business major would need to average 18.5 (19.5 if not including UGBA 159AC) units per semester, assuming that s/he has all possible major and breadth requirements complete at CC (this includes the L&S / business 7-course breadth requirement, since business does not accept IGETC for breadth requirements).</p>
<p>Thanks for your info @bluestuff and @ucbalumnus!
I’ll be applying for Fall 2014 for admissions in 2015.
Hopefully I’ll make it to Haas. @Bluestuff and yes, transfer apply directly to Haas.</p>
<p>By Fall 2014 I’ll have all prerequisites done except stats, which I’ll be taking in the fall and all breadth requirements done except the international studies breadth which I’ll also take in the fall.<br>
So by Spring 2015 I’ll have all prerequisites done and all breadth done, including the American Cultures requirement since they offer classes at my CC that satisfy the graduation requirement. (Not sure yet but I might take Stat 21 in the summer because the UCB Tap program I’m in offers concurrent enrollment opportunities).</p>
<p>Do you think If I already have the Breadths and American Cultures requirements done by the time I enter it will be a bit easier to fit in classes for both majors? Thanks for your input guys I really appreciate it.</p>
<p>I still have some time to think about this but the more insight I can get on this matter the better.</p>
<p>Assuming that you have all major pre-reqs, breadth, and the AC requirements finished before Fall 2015, then to double, you will need to complete approximately 32 units of econ upper-divs and at least 38 units of business upper-divs = 70 total units over 4 semesters = average of 17.5 units per semester. </p>
<p>As a general reference point: 13-14 units is light-ish, 15-16 is average, and 17-20.5 tends to be on the heavier side. How many units you can handle does depend on (1) you/r time management skills and, possibly related, (2) the extent of your extracurricular commitments. This is just anecdotal, but I know some students who will try to stick to the 13 minimum because they’re involved in a lot of things and others who take on 17-18 per semester and do fine academically but sacrifice on the social/extracurricular/networking side. Keep in mind that all your classes after you transfer in will be major classes and most are bell-curved so that you’re graded against your peers, most of whom aren’t taking 17.5 units per semester. Also, I’d imagine midterm season (and your finals schedule) to be pretty ugly.</p>
<p>That said, if you really don’t care about the econ/business electives you take (just want the degree), then note that some electives are definitely known for being easier and less time-consuming than others (i.e. your schedule will be a bit easier to handle).</p>
<p>So maybe some things to think about are: how are you managing your time now? How many units are you taking per semester at your CC, and how does that stack against your extracurriculars and free time? Are you used to bell-curved classes and studying for 4-5 different curved classes at the same time? And, possibly, how much do you care about your GPA? I ask, because the small and biased sample of econ/business transfers that I know generally think that they study more at Cal than they did at their CC and manage to keep up on the upside of the curve here. I don’t know any transfers who doubled, though. Most people I know in general really do take 14-16 units; seniors take even less. Tbh, you’re probably the only person who will really know if you can handle 17.5+ units every semester. It’ll probably be intense and overwhelming if you’re not used to it now. </p>
<p>tl;dr:
Getting into classes is pretty easy once you’re declared for both econ and business. Actually managing 17+ units every single semester is tough for most people, but it’s physically doable in the sense that I know people who’ve done it. Really depends on you, your work ethic, and your ability to pick up things (how effectively you can study).</p>
<p>All of this is just from my observations and experiences, though, so take that with a grain of salt!</p>
<p>Also, a quick comment about Stat 21 over the summer - it’s an online class over the summer, and it’s supposed to be notoriously easy, if you do decide to go that route.</p>
<p>Ok thanks. Hmm a lot to take into consideration. My first two semesters I averaged 5 classes each. I plan to take four classes each semester until I transfer. Yea I rarely hear of transfer who double major. If I did double major I would plan to stay a fifth semester if they would allow that and if I’m not at unit cap. Haas is a two year program so is have to finish that first.
I still have time to think about it. Only time will tell. Btw in your experience does the Haas name make you stand out when your applying to job or etc?
Just curious.</p>
<p>If I can’t do both it’s ok. I find both disciplines interesting though. Business is applied but Econ is more theoretical. Economics has always been of interest to me but not so much that I would like to pursue graduate work in it.</p>
<p>I didn’t mean to scare you off or make anything sound too hard/intense to do (taking 17 units and curved classes are actually not that bad at all), but I’ve heard some unfortunate stories before, so yeah. Better safe than sorry and all. Sorry about that monster wall of text before. </p>
<p>If you’re a L&S student (i.e. declared econ), then, yes, you can finish the rest of your econ classes in the fifth semester while you’re still under the unit cap. </p>
<p>Imo, the Haas name helps, but I wouldn’t say it necessarily makes you “stand out”, as there may be many Haas students applying for the same job you are. There are also always standouts in other majors (including non-econ ones). So all the usual things like work experience, GPA, networking/connections, extracurricular activities, etc, are important.</p>
<p>Ok thanks 
it’s cool how you created an account to answer my question. Really appreciate it man.</p>
<p>No problem! Always happy to help. Also, I haven’t posted enough to respond to your PM, so I’ll respond to most of it here.</p>
<p>If you double, your schedule will look something like this: <a href=“http://oi41.■■■■■■■.com/ayleu9.jpg[/url]”>http://oi41.■■■■■■■.com/ayleu9.jpg</a></p>
<p>Units are in parenthesis. Core classes are in black, and you should take those in an order somewhat similar to that. Possibly switch up the order of some of the UGBA classes depending on your interest, i.e. if you want to go into marketing, take it earlier instead so you can take more marketing electives.</p>
<p>I personally took micro, macro, econometrics, and two econ electives before the end of my sophomore year and am on track for graduating in 4 years. Unit count per semester starting from freshman year to senior year: 17, 17; 15, 17; 15, 15; 13, 10.</p>
<p>Thanks. Hmm I definitely wouldn’t mind staying a 5th semester to spread out the workload. </p>
<p>More questions:
From the looks of it you didn’t take any summer courses right?
Which math series did you take the 1a-b or 16a-b?
For econometrics did you find it very difficult? I hear that Econ 140/141 is very difficult.
Lastly, In your experience which classes have been a little harder for you? The Econ ones or the Haas ones? Sometimes I hear that getting into Haas is the hard part and once your in it is considerably easier. I hear sometimes that Haas offers the “dumbed” down version of Econ classes lol. But who am I to say since I haven’t experienced UC level workload besides a few honors classes I have taken at CC.</p>
<p>Financial and Managerial Accounting are required upper division for Haas correct?</p>
<p>Oh wait I see that it is in the little chart you made. Disregard my previous comment.</p>
<p>I took 2 breadth classes in the summer before my freshman year, but other than that, no summer classes. Took Math 1AB. Took Econ 140; didn’t think it was too difficult. If you’re comfortable with statistics concepts and (light) linear algebra, I think you should be okay with 'metrics if you spend some time to actually make sense of the subject rather than just memorizing things you learned in class. </p>
<p>This is definitely a generalization, but I think ‘doing well’ for most Haas classes was based on your ability to memorize and present, so for classes like intro to fin accounting, since the material is simple, everyone does well, so you just have to be careful. My experience with econ classes is that they tend to test your ability to apply concepts. On the whole, I think my econ classes have been harder in that sense.</p>
<p>And yes, financial and managerial accounting are core/required classes for Haas (Everything from UGBA 100 - 107 is required).</p>
<p>I definitely have to talk to my UCB Tap counselor about this lol. Especially with the unit ceiling. The Cap is 130 by the 8th semester I think for double majors.</p>
<p>By the way, did you take any linear algebra course prior to taking Econometrics? I don’t plan to take one myself but I’ll definitely look over some material before hand if needed.</p>
<p>Haha sorry for so many questions
Feel like a bit of a nuisance. -_-</p>
<p>You should get the unit cap understanding clarified. When I first submitted my double degree forms, I was curious about that too, but the econ advisor told me that it didn’t matter, because all the Haas classes won’t count towards your L&S unit cap, since Haas isn’t in L&S. That is, doubling in econ and business means that you’re getting double degrees, not a double major (double major implies two majors in L&S, so if that were the case, you might hit the unit ceiling). Not too sure, though. </p>
<p>I didn’t take linear algebra before econometrics. The amount of lin alg used in the Econ 140 class I took was pretty light and easy to pick up. The Econ 140 instructor will go quickly review the lin alg you’ll need when the class starts. </p>
<p>No worries about all the questions; good luck with everything!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Haas’ policy is that “At the time of admission to the Haas Undergraduate Program, all students sign a Statement of Acceptance that includes an agreement to enroll in at least 13 units each semester and to graduate no more than two Academic Years after admission to the major. All Haas students are required to do so.”</p>
<p>[Academic</a> Guidelines, Undergraduate Programs, Berkeley-Haas](<a href=“http://www.haas.berkeley.edu/Undergrad/academic_guidelines.html]Academic”>http://www.haas.berkeley.edu/Undergrad/academic_guidelines.html)</p>
<p>L&S is slightly more lenient, in that staying longer than 4 semesters after transfer is permitted, if your total number of units is within the unit ceiling.</p>
<p>[Office</a> of Undergraduate Advising: Unit Ceiling](<a href=“http://ls-advise.berkeley.edu/registration/unitceiling.html]Office”>http://ls-advise.berkeley.edu/registration/unitceiling.html)</p>
<p>However, with two majors, you would have to conform to the stricter of the two limits.</p>
<p>Note that it appears that a lot of economics courses (including 100A/B but not 101A/B) are offered in the summer:
[UCB</a> Online Schedule of Classes: Search Results](<a href=“http://osoc.berkeley.edu/OSOC/osoc?x=0&p_term=SU&p_classif=--+Choose+a+Course+Classification+--&p_session=--+Choose+a+Session+--&p_deptname=--+Choose+a+Department+Name+--&p_presuf=--+Choose+a+Course+Prefix%2FSuffix+--&y=0&p_dept=econ]UCB”>http://osoc.berkeley.edu/OSOC/osoc?x=0&p_term=SU&p_classif=--+Choose+a+Course+Classification+--&p_session=--+Choose+a+Session+--&p_deptname=--+Choose+a+Department+Name+--&p_presuf=--+Choose+a+Course+Prefix%2FSuffix+--&y=0&p_dept=econ)</p>
<p>So are several UGBA courses:
[UCB</a> Online Schedule of Classes: Search Results](<a href=“http://osoc.berkeley.edu/OSOC/osoc?x=0&p_term=SU&p_classif=--+Choose+a+Course+Classification+--&p_session=--+Choose+a+Session+--&p_deptname=--+Choose+a+Department+Name+--&p_presuf=--+Choose+a+Course+Prefix%2FSuffix+--&y=0&p_dept=UGBA]UCB”>http://osoc.berkeley.edu/OSOC/osoc?x=0&p_term=SU&p_classif=--+Choose+a+Course+Classification+--&p_session=--+Choose+a+Session+--&p_deptname=--+Choose+a+Department+Name+--&p_presuf=--+Choose+a+Course+Prefix%2FSuffix+--&y=0&p_dept=UGBA)</p>
<p>(Of course, the offerings may differ next summer.)</p>
<p>So if you attend Berkeley in the summer to take a statistics course, you may want to add another business or economics course, so that you would then need one fewer course to squeeze into the rest of your schedule.</p>
<p>Thanks @ucbalumnus. Hmm by the time I apply I’ll see if double majoring is a possibility. If it seems like to much of a stretch I won’t do it as it could potentially effect my GPA with so many upper division classes. Blue was able to take some upper division Econ classes his sophomore year and finish many requirements early on so he spread out his classes fairly well. This is a disadvantage for me lol as I can’t do that at a community college. All hope isn’t lost yet though! </p>
<p>And my very last question: is it true that stat 21 is easier in the summer? Many people say that it is easier than taking it in the fall.</p>
![http://oi41.■■■■■■■.com/ayleu9.jpg[/url]](http://oi41.tinypic.com/ayleu9.jpg%5B/url%5D){kind=link}
