Apply ED to elites or shoot lower?

International Students
1

<p>Hi everyone.</p>

<p>I would like to go to an elite university but I'm afraid that if I don't apply ED to lesser known schools I won't get in anywhere at all.</p>

<p>I need a substantial amount of financial aid; I can only contribute about $8000 every year.</p>

<p>SAT1: 2210
SAT1 Math: 770 (1 wrong)
SAT1 Writing: 760 (10 essay, 2 wrong)
SAT1 Reading: 680 (7 wrong)
(Do colleges see how many you got wrong?)</p>

<p>SAT2 Math 2: 780
SAT2 Math 1: 800
SAT2 Chemistry: 800
SAT2 Physics: 800</p>

<p>NAT (Pakistan's National Aptitude Test): 99th percentile</p>

<p>UK GCSEs: 11A, 2B (for English Language and English Literature)
CIE AS: 5A
FSMQ Additional Mathematics: A</p>

<p>I lived abroad for around 10 years. Now I live in Pakistan, and don't want to study here. My fear is that if I do not apply early to lesser known schools I won't get in anywhere. But I definitely dream of attending top schools.</p>

<p>I try to believe that I will be happy even if im not at a top school, but I hope you understand that it may be hard to do so.</p>

<p>What do you guys think I should do? Stay safe? Or aim high?</p>

<p>I greatly appreciate your help. Thank you.</p>

2

<p>“I need a substantial amount of financial aid; I can only contribute about $8000 every year.”</p>

<p>You need to apply broadly, so that you have a better chance of finding someplace that will meet that need. ED is absolutely out for you.</p>

<p>Go to the Financial Aid Forum and read through everything that you can find there that relates to aid for International students. If you were a US candidate, with your scores you would have lots of good options <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/848226-important-links-automatic-guaranteed-merit-scholarships.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/848226-important-links-automatic-guaranteed-merit-scholarships.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>The problem is few lesser known schools have much aid to give.</p>

4

<p>Reading this,its obvious that adcoms treat applications from different countries VERY differently.You seem nervous about your qualifications,but if someone from my (african) country had your test scores they would be in a very good position to get admitted to the top schools.people here get into MIT with 1900SAT and surprisingly Harvard with a 1750SAT.I wouldnt be too anxious if I were you,you have great stats-just apply to a range of schools and at least one of them should take you with enough aid. Only apply ED if youre really crazy about a school–my educationUSA advisor says theres nothing wrong with applying ED even if you have high need.I applied ED to a LAC-go with it if you strongly feel it is a good fit.goodluck!</p>

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<p>macmill where are u from?</p>

<p>@OP </p>

<p>You are fine. What do u mean by lesser known schools? I had the same fears you had and applied early decision to Bowdoin College because i thought I was going to get rejected everywhere. I did not turn in SAT scores and so they pushed my application to RD. I got in with a massive scholarship. However, I found out they accept like only 8 international students out of like 300 lol so I felt special :)</p>

<p>Apply ED, its a great tool. I dont know what happens now, but in my time people applied ED on CC. Lots got in especially to Vassar, Williams and Co, but they had stats that could get them into Ivy league schools if they were Americans.</p>

<p>Yes schools do treat applications very differently from a country. They get very few qualified applicants from certain regions so they grad what they can get. I never knew about that though when I applied. From what I have seen-</p>

<p>Africa (Lucky you, well from an application perspective)- 2200 and locked on a top 20-30 school, depends on how well you did in high school. If you won a scholarship to UWC. A 1950 should be enough for an Ivy if you are from Zambia. If you are from certain anglophone countries you would likely need over a 2200 depending on the competition that year.</p>

<p>European (Money talks, crap walks- the large majority of Europeans considering the US can pay their fees. Oddly though, I have seen a lot on CC who ask for aid but most are not from Western Europe)- Scores vary depending on where they are from. A decent amount get into Ivies with 1950. Usually the Jet-set crowd and can speak tons of language and have their own private brokers at UBS. They could be the bunch from Le Rosey whose families have been members of the Swiss guard even before America became a country or the prince of some small European country. The large majority would be in the 2100-2300. Large number of them at Ivy, very rare at the academically rigorous schools such as UChicago or Swarthmore. America is a holiday, why go there? </p>

<p>Asia-East/South,South East ( FYL everyone want to go to study in the US. Everyone wants financial aid. If you believe in God this is the time to pray)- At least a 2300 to get into a top school. Would usually be studying mathematics, economics, finance, Hard science, Molecular Biophysics, Engineering with the aim of working in an Investment bank or management consultancy after graduation. If things dont go well maybe go to law school. Liberal Arts- Not for me. Likely to consider Ivies but would prefer MIT, Stanford, Berkeley, CMU, Michigan, Caltech. Might look at Cornell, Harvard or Princeton. Brown and Dartmouth are usually assumed to be safeties since they are not famous anyways </p>

<p>Middle East: Please refer to European description.</p>

<p>Of course there would be exceptions.</p>

<p>Well, I think you should go the praying route. Its more reliable. Also apply broadly. This is the best advise. And I mean broadly.</p>

6

<p>happymomof1 thank you for the great link. I will definitely look through the fin aid forum. I don’t understand why you say “ED is absolutely out for you.” The particular college that I was thinking to apply early to isn’t that well known, but does say that it will meet the full need of all admitted regardless of origin. Should I still not apply ED?</p>

<p>I feel privileged that I am getting an opportunity to study at all. Maybe I should shoot higher for grad school. Sefago I am also fluent in three languages excluding English. =)</p>

<p>Like macmill says, why shouldn’t I apply ED? The worst thing that could happen is that I would deferred to ED isn’t it?</p>

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<p>^ Schools take international students for ED, and I think its a great strategy. Work on it fast. Your application gets looked at first trust me, and it shows commitment to a school. All my friends who applied ED got it way easier as internationals. By the time you get to RD, theer are few spots left and the competition is hell.</p>

<p>What school do you want to apply to? PM me, I could give you some advise</p>

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<p>@sefago Im from Zimbabwe.Usually the top schools and LACs take about 2 or 3 kids from my country,so applying early will give an edge.It simply means that the people who apply RD literally scramble for that one remaining spot,and it usually goes to the person with the most EFC,the rest are waitlisted or denied.I wouldnt agree with you though that applicants from Africa are weaker than say,applicants from Asia.I admit that we tend to have lower test scores-this is due to the fact that many here cannot afford test prep materials such.Our grades usually are very high(typically 8+As at IGCSE/O level,4 or 5As at A level etc.)this tends to override the comparatively lower test scores.</p>

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<p>^ I did not say weaker academically. Everyone who gets into a top school in the US is very strong academically- being ranked in the top % of their country and class. I just pointed out some people get insane scores but for their countries they are just average. I agree, interestingly some people in some countries are heavily focussed on the SAT and they study for it for months lol.</p>

10

<p>being from Africa could be an edge - there are simply fewer African applicants than, say, Indian or Chinese. And it will certainly help if you aren’t white - since many schools do look for ways to diversify their student body. Good luck OP, and congratulations on your nice scores.</p>

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<p>What if you are an Asian (Korean) African? Or white African?</p>

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<p>Depends on the school and its student body.</p>

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<p>@sefago you are very right.I have noticed that other applicants take the SAT several times,whereas here we usually only take it just once,get whatever score and work with that. It seems as though way less emphasis is placed on scores in our case-I wonder why?ΛΛ–well for asian applicants its just tougher in general,mainly due to the volume of applications from India ,China,Korea and Hong Kong.But its still very possible…</p>

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<p>What is it that you don’t understand? You need a significant amount of financial aid. When a school says that it meets full demonstrated need that is need as they determine it, not you. Many families find out that what the school considers their need and what they consider their need are two different things.</p>

<p>You say you can only contribute $8,000 per year to your cost of attendance. The key question is does the school you want to go to also consider that what you can contribute? Do they have an on-line financial aid calculator? Many schools do.</p>

<p>Not applying early decision is very common advice for an applicant who needs financial aid. But I suppose if you have reason to believe that the school you want to go to will give you enough aid so you could attend if admitted then you could do it.</p>

15

<p>“Many families find out that what the school considers their need and what they consider their need are two different things.”</p>

<p>And when that happens at ED time, you say thanks for the FA offer, but no thanks, and apply RD elsewhere.</p>

<p>However, in this case, I agree that ED is inappropriate, but because the OP doesn’t have an ED dream school, and so needs to be able to compare as many FA offers as possible.</p>

<p>“Not applying early decision is very common advice for an applicant who needs financial aid.”</p>

<p>Yes, and it drives some schools crazy that this advice is given; they miss out on some top talent that they would be happy to support. Top students needing financial aid should not hesitate to apply ED to their dream schools, if available information suggests that they could get the financial support they need.</p>