<p>Rosieoney – It won’t be easy turning the tide. Look at the problems Bill Cosby faced when he criticized the community for placing such high emphasis on sports, hip hop, fashion, etc., while ignoring education, self-improvement, and morality. His message is just what we needed to hear, but it’s not something we want to hear. There’s a lot of comfort to be found in the message that others are keeping us down. It allows us to fail without guilt. To look in the mirror and say that we’re largely to blame will be painful. </p>
<p>I wrote a paper last year in an African Studies class about what Martin would think if he could rise from the dead and see President Obama in office. Martin came back to earth at the Lincoln Memorial and then began walking to the White House. When he arrived, he saw this good looking, proud African man in office and assumed that most of his dreams had been met. His conclusion was then reinforced as he walked the Mall and saw AAs serving as law clerks for the Supreme Court, as staff members on the Hill, as college professors, and as business leaders. I then had Martin leave the Mall and walk the streets of D.C. There, he realized that almost none of his dreams had been met. His was heart-broken to see so many AA living in poverty, serving time in prison, being raised raised without fathers, etc. Martin returned to Heaven disappointed that so many AA had forgotten the sacrifices he and others made to give them a chance of being equal. They had the chance to be free at last, just as he had dreamed, but many instead chose to remain enslaved by drugs, teenage pregnancy, hip hop, the BET message, anti-achievement, crime, etc. Although fictious, I truly believe Martin would be disappointed by how so many have failed to take full advantage of the freedoms he helped win for us.</p>
<p>In the end what I feel the greatest problem facing AAs is the current state of black popular culture. The African immigrants have not been exposed to this issue as much and therefore their lack of exposure to these issues combined with the first generation effect has enabled them to radically outperform AAs like myself.</p>
<p>Its 2:30, Im bored, tired, and my friends are out of town, so apologies for the following rant.</p>
<p>Current popular black culture is one that devalues education, achievement, and degrades women. When I say “popular black culture” I mean the one promoted on BET, MTV, and in rap/hip hop music. In my opinion, this new “culture” has been devastating for blacks and for white America’s perception of blacks. I am someone who cares about success in life and would sell my soul to get into an upper tier school, if I were white or asian, I would be labeled smart and ambitious for my goals, however, since I am black, whites and blacks alike refer to me as an “oreo”. Many whites I know simply cannot comprehend/compute that I am an AA who is intelligent and eloquent. When I moved to my upper class, completly white/asian community, many students believed that I was either British, or a native African because of the fact that I do not speak in ebonics, the only black people they see mostly are on MTV/BET and they naturally expect ebonics.</p>
<p>All four of the AAs at my school are adopted by white families, and luckily excluding myself, the other three have fallen into the stereotype of popular black culture. These kids are ones that grew up with privileged lives and all the things the American dream can offer, yet they sag their pants, get terrible grades and treat it like a badge of honor, and destroy their futures simply so they can not be “oreos”. One of them even remarked he hated me because I acted “smart”.</p>
<p>I have no idea how to change culture, especially one as entrenched in society as the current popular black culture, but if we wish to succeed as a race, we must.</p>
<p>There’s a saying in my country that goes like this: Not to know is bad; not to wish to know is worse. Each of us must do our part to open the eyes of our brothers and sisters who wish not to know the truth why we struggle. We must stop blaming others for our problems. We must go forward knowing that if we work hard enough we can achieve. Although none of us has the power to change our culture overnight, we can change it one person at a time. If each of us vows to raise our children in a loving home with both parents involved, we’ll have done our part to change the culture.</p>
<p>Jamma, I completely agree with you. Your replies remind me of a book i read a month or two back. The author discussed how many blacks when with other black people, bring up the point we need to do better as a people, and that we can do better as people. But when around white people, we must play the victim role. </p>
<p>I also know very well when you try to address these issues within the black community you are ridiculed. I remember countless occasions where AAs were talking about this problem, then they are labeled “uncle toms” or “house negros”. it’s such a shame what has occurred to our race.</p>
<p>fendey516: We’ll get there. I think our generation will take the lead. The old guard embraces a model of leadership that I am confident we will reject. It probably made sense to push the victim agenda in the 1970s, but today we need to push the opportunity/responsibility agenda.</p>
<p>Exactly jamma, i’m literally amazed how some black people complain about being kept down, when there are SO many programs designed specifically for low income blacks its amazing. colleges will do anything for intelligent blacks, to the point where they are willing to pay for most of their financial aid. we are reaching an era where the slavery excuse will no longer hold any weight. clowns such as rev. al shaprton and jesse jackson are realizing that, and i think many blacks are realizing that also.</p>
<p>Don’t be too offended, decanela. My guess is that vosamim was raised much like many those of us from Africa and the Caribbean were raised. Although we look the same, there’s a big difference between African culture and African-American culture. Africans tend to be more morally conservative and religiously orthodox than African-Americans. Most also view America as a land of great opportunity and they don’t want their children to give up their only chance of succeeding in America by adopting AA culture. </p>
<p>When I was in elementary school, I wasn’t allowed to play with AA. My mother befriended a Mormon family and she would take us to their house to play. She would also let us play with certain Muslims. We also had a Hindu friend. I was raised to believe that AA were immoral and dangerous. It was an us v. them view of the world. </p>
<p>When I got to high school, I realized that my parents were acting out of fear. They worried so much that my sister and I would embrace aspects of the AA culture that they deemed immoral. Once they saw that my sister and I could maintain our family’s ideals and still embrace AA as friends, my parents no longer tried to stop us from having AA friends. In fact, by the time I was a senior, all of my friends were AA, and my parents loved them.</p>
<p>Having grown up in that culture, when I read Vosamin’s message, I wasn’t offended at all. It sounded very familiar, actually. He meant no offense, I’m sure.</p>
<p>I do think that the media reinforces negative stereotypes about blacks. However, that doesn’t mean that we can’t overcome those stereotypes and still succeed. If there’s one thing that Barack Obama’s election should teach us is that nothing is impossible. In this age and time, it’s silly that we can’t reconcile our differences and move on as a people.</p>
<p>This is interesting. As a Black American in college, I was told to stay away from the Africans. And my niece who is a senior in college advised my daughter to stay away. It appears to be a 2-way street.</p>
<p>Flash forward 25 years for me and its a non-issue. My daughter has friends of many nationalities and it is a non-issue for her also. But be assured, the mind-set does exist.</p>
<p>Silvermoonlock: You’re correct, but I think it’s a 10-way street, not a 2-way street. One of the reasons I get angry when I hear one of my brothers or sisters claim that racism is holding them back is because racism exists at all levels. It’s not confined to whites against blacks. Hell, we blacks are terribly racist. Go to any AA community and ask what they think about Asians, Jews, or Hispanics. Asians are racists. I went to Hong Kong last summer and experienced terrible discrimination. It was very common for people to take one look at me and then start walking the opposite direction. Indeed, the most common phrase used in Chinese to describe Africans is translated to mean “black devils.” A popular toothpaste is called Darkie and has a man in black face smiling big on the tube. This hate is found in every community and culture. And its not limited to race. Skinny people mock fat people. Beautiful people mock ugly people. Straight people mock gay people. Liberals hate conservatives. Conservatives hate liberals. Muslims hate Jews. Hindus hate Muslims. The list is endless. It seems that it’s a human tendency to discriminate and hate. </p>
<p>Because hate will never go away, and because such hate is universal, we cannot limit ourselves because of racism. No other race does this to the extent that we do. We need to stop seeing racism as a barrier. We’ll succeed notwithstanding this natural human tendency to hate.</p>
<p>Well, I’ve said too much. In an hour I will be heading to the airport for a flight to Egypt where I will spend the rest of the summer. God’s blessings on each of you!</p>
<p>The issue I see in this discussion is that AA “culture” cannot be limited to a specific stereotype and yet be universally accurate. I’m AA through and through and have a lot of African friends, including former classmates, people I used to date, neighbors, and the families of my children’s friends. They are no more moral, conservative, or intelligent than my family or the people I grew up around. They are just people like anyone else. And just like AAs, their values, tastes, philosphies, natural and learned proclivities, ideals, choice of religion, etc. seem to run the full gamut of humanity, varying from one to another. Some good, some not so good. Some smart, some not so bright at all. </p>
<p>As far as I know, they have never looked at me or my family as being distinctive among AAs just as I have not seen them in such ways as Africans. I don’t suppose I would ever appreciate anyone lumping me together with the worst attributes of those who share my race. I also don’t think people from other cultures would appreciate it if I made similar assumptions about them. There are bad apples among every group. Africans have been terribly stereotyped and portrayed here in the U.S. And yet, although aware of such things, it never occurred to me once to address them individually or as a group on the basis of being anything other than equal. I’ve made some very good friends this way over the years. </p>
<p>Interestingly, my D is taking classes and traveling around various parts of China this Summer. She reports back that everywhere she’s gone so far she’s been treated like a rock star. Meeting an AA who is very fluent in Chinese seems to be a source of amazement for many. She says everyone wants to take pictures with her, she gets voluntary discounts when shopping even before she begins to haggle, people fawn over her hair, give her gifts, and a lot of the students are eager to try out their command of the english language in conversations. She told me about one student at a middle school she visited who literally threw herself in front of the van they were in to make sure she didn’t leave without getting her email address, lol. I pray that his is more of what the future holds for the world rather than where we’ve been. </p>
<p>So, if anything, I’d just admonish everyone to resist the tempation to generalize. You don’t know a person until you know them. There’s really no need to put them on the defensive right from the start with unproven assumptions of what they’re really about, especially if it’s something negative.</p>
<p>FLVADAD: I am from China. I came to the US when I was 3 years old, but I spend every other summer in Beijing. I hate to throw water on your conclusion, but don’t misinterpret what you daughter experienced with racial acceptance. An AA who speaks Chinese is extremely novel. Couple that fact with the fact that very few AA travel to China, and you’ll see why so many Chinese were eager to take pictures with your daughter, etc. It would be like you coming across a friendly alien. </p>
<p>I tell you this because one of the struggles I have is how my culture views AA and others who are not Chinese. It’s not pretty. Although younger people are making strides in China, racism in the Chinese culture is, in my opinion, much more prevelant than in the American culture. It isn’t limited to blacks. Chinese struggle with all non-Hans to a degree. The name “China” means the central kingdom. There is a very strong sense in China that Han Chinese are the epitomy of races, and that all other races look to them. Keep in mind that China is not like America. In America, we have many races. In China, there is one main race. This results in a lot of critical judgments. </p>
<p>Many Chinese males are impressed by black NBA players and their skills. A few also like the hip hop culture. But as for viewing AA as their equal, most Chinese have a very long way to go.</p>
<p>Lol, Happynow, you really got a chuckle out of me with that line :). Too funny!</p>
<p>Yes, I understand your point and it is well taken. I appreciate your comments. And I must say, she’s somewhat of a novelty here at home as well :). I really don’t mean to sound naive about it - just glad she’s having a positive experience during her time there. We know it could easily be very different. </p>
<p>But my point is that she is challenging certain perceptions people may have, even if only to a small degree, and I think that’s important. Just as I also think it’s important the theories offered by the OP be challenged in this thread (although I do believe much of the negative connotation springing from it was unintentional). </p>
<p>For example, while I do not doubt that many Chinese people may be racist, that is very different from making such assumptions about every Chinese person I meet, or addressing a group of them as such before I even know them. Thus, my awareness of certain potential conditions does not cloud my judgement, cause me to unintentionally offend. or prevent me from being open to other possibilities. </p>
<p>I believe AAs and Africans must also be aware of such sensitivities since there is plenty of muck to be thrown by and about both groups if that’s going to be the measure of how we choose to define one another. I think that is something we ought to avoid at all costs.</p>
<p>Thank you for the message, Flvdad. I am very interested in racial perceptions, and I hope to study race relations in college. I feel so lucky to be experienced with both Chinese and American cultures. China is very homogeneous. America is very diverse. In China, it is very easy to determine if someone is a visitor to our country. Confucian principles require that Chinese be gracious hosts, and we are. It’s easy to be gracious when tourists are so easy to identify. That doesn’t happen in America. Walking down the streets of a big city, it is almost impossible for me to determine who was a visitor and who was a native. </p>
<p>Although I am very proud to be Chinese, I think American culture gets an undeserved negative reputation. In America, there are so many ways for people to be adverse. You have different political parties, many different religions, many different races and cultures, etc. In China, we have one people, one political party, and religion isn’t important. Although this is a simplification, most Chinese believe and act in the same way. (I am not counting outlying areas like Tibet which is seeking to be self-governed). Having a gracious society to visitors is easy because people are basically the same. Chinese are pretty good at not seeking attention and obeying leaders. This is why the Olympics were so successful. However, in America, everyone is different. Yet, people get along for the most part and there are opportunities for everyone. A poor person can get rich, and rich person can lose all of their money. It’s fascinating to me how well this multicultural, multiracial country functions. It’s so much harder to have harmony here than in China. I am actually very proud to live in America.</p>
<p>I wish every American could live outside of America for a few years. They would appreciate this country more if they did. </p>
<p>Happynow, I think you have some great insights from your experiences. Very powerful observations, indeed. </p>
<p>I must say that, through my D’s experiences, I have learned a lot as well - things I never expected. D is founder and President of a Mandarin club at her school. It took her two years to find a sponsor because the administration was afraid that her being AA might look offensive to some of the Asian students. Her school does not offer Chinese classes so the concept was also very new to them - D has been studying the language since middle school is mostly self-taught (that’s another story, I guess). Anyway, I completely disagreed with the administrators, but I did wonder how she would be perceived. Well, she has 0ver 40 members now. But one of the most interesting things she encountered was the number of calls from Chinese parents who have been struggling to keep their kids interested in Chinese language and culture. Apparently, their kids are showing a strong preference towards assimilation into American culture and do not share their parent’s wishes to retain as much of their Chinese heritage. Because D is AA, and clearly fascinated with China, many of these parents believed D might have some influence on their kids. I don’t believe she’s actually had such an influence on them but it completely opened a new cultural dynamic to us I never imagined, or even considered. </p>
<p>I’ve actually been very surprised at how supportive and encouraging our local Chinese community, which is very sizable, has been regarding my D’s interests. Not that this is always the case, of course, but I’ve really learned many things from our interactions. </p>
<p>I’m sure D would really like to hear about your experiences as well. If you don’t mind, I’m going to encourage her to PM you when she returns home from her trip.</p>
<p>My mother’s biggest fear is that I stop being Chinese. That sounds funny but my mother will cry if you talk to her about it. Most Chinese who move to America stay here because there are many opportunities to succeed. Even though China has improved a lot in the last 10 or so years, most people in China will never be rich no matter how hard they work because they do not have the right connections. In America that is less true. Mnay Chinese work very hard and make good livings. That’s all they want and they are very happy to live here. However, one of the downsides of living here is that your kids become less Chinese. Many of my friends can understand Chinese but they can’t speak it. It’s funny to watch them talk with their parents. Their parents will speak to them in Chinese and the kids will respond in English. Anyway, after two or three generations in America, Chinese will still look Chinese but they are no more Chinese than you are. They are yellow Americans. To many tradiitional Chinese, this is not good because we have so much pride in our traditional ways. I will say one more thing. I think Chinese girls are more likely to adopt American culture than Chinese boys. In China, boys are still dominant, so why would they want to change? Each time I go back to China on vacation I realize how much I have changed. American women are so strong and vocal. Chinese women are still more quiet and reserved. I think this is why you see many Chinese girls dating and marrying non-Chinese boys, while Chinese boys tend to date and marry Chinese girls. It’s not scientific, just my hunch. </p>
<p>The same is true in China. The American culture (hip hop, NBA, iPods, internet, Hollywood, etc.) is so, so powerful, especially for young people. In China, the most important thing is for kids to respect their elders. I may be wrong, but that seems less true in American culture. In America, young people are louder and want to be strong individuals. Chinese children are supposed to be humble, soft-spoken, and not seek individual attention. So there are big differences. People in China worry that their children will accept American ways and forget their native traditions. Because America has so many cultures bleeding into one, that isn’t a big fear for American parents, but in China there is only one culture, so it is a big fear. Most Chinese kids wear two hats. They act American with their friends and then revert to traditional ways when they are at home. </p>
<p>I am very impressed that your daughter is interested in Chinese. Most Chinese children begin learning English at a very young age. The idea that an English-speaking student would be interested in learning our language is very flattering.</p>