<p>I agree with this poster. I feel as though blacks who have been living in the USA for generations have become stationary whereas first generation Africans (like all immigrants) come to this country DESPERATE for oppurtunity and they strive to succeed. For instance, my parents were Ugandan refugees. They saw nothing but poverty, death, and abuse for their entire lives until they fled to America. Once they got here, they seized oppurtunities and implented values into my siblings and I such as the need for a good education. I feel as though other blacks, particularly inner-city blacks, are too complacent in their culture and sometimes perpertualize stereotypes of themselves in doing so. They’ve never experienced hardship like immigrant African Americans (or Haitians in the poster’s case) so they do not realize what they have entirely.</p>
<p>I know what TC is talking about… I see it happen all the time.</p>
<p>That said, I’m nowhere on the intelligence or academic level of most people who even browse CC, but I’m pretty much “the smart black guy” at my school, and the only one who made it to NASF. So… what TC said is definitely a generalization that may only apply in certain areas.</p>
<p>I totally agree with Dnerd. I’m AA, and my parents both graduated form college and showed me at various points iin my life how valuable an education is. At my high school I’m the “smart black guy” too- the one who does well in school, takes tough classes, and has more than one white friend. However, I do have to say there is one girl who I would say is smarter than me- and ironically enough her dad is African. (she is mixed, and one of the prettiest mixed girls I know) It definitely has its exceptions and proven points I just think the claim is extremely generalized</p>
<p>"I feel as though other blacks, particularly inner-city blacks, are too complacent in their culture "</p>
<p>It is also possible that they are hopeless; that generations ago, they gave upon the idea that hard work will pay off.</p>
<p>I agree with that notion shrinkrap.</p>
<p>im in the same situation. i am nigerian, well american born, but both parents are nigerian. i am pretty much known as the “smart” girl because of where i am from. sometimes it gets annoying. but i got to a dominantly black school, and we have NEVER had a black valedictorian. it makes me upset because the little white people that do go to my school brag about their little 4.2 gpa ( i never tell them my gpa because i dont want to hurt their feelings --yea i have a better gpa then them) and brag about their class rank. to be honest i do not know any african american that is in the top ten. there is me, and the rest are white asian and 1 indian</p>
<p>I’m the only person of African descent in the top 10 students out of a class of 245, and the only immigrant Haitian in the AP group. While some people will say that immigrants do have a higher level of achievement, I’ve got to disagree. I know far too many Haitians (and will use them as an example throughout) who have fallen by the wayside and settled for far less than their African-American peers. Earlier in this thread, someone mentioned that a lot of immigrants have parents who were professionals. That may be true for some, but it is certainly not true for most Haitians. I was lucky that my parents were among the educated elite (my father owned a school and my mother was a teacher/radio host), but there weren’t too many people like them to begin with, and not all of them came here. A good deal of Haitians, once here, take on menial jobs to eke out a living but do not pursue self-betterment in the form of professional degrees. My father himself worked three jobs for 10 years and earned 2 bachelors degrees. His first degree was in computer science, and when the dot-com bubble burst, all of his work was reduced to nothing since no jobs were available. As a result, he went back to school to pursue a nursing degree. My mother did something similar to that, first becoming a certified translator, then a paralegal, and finally a registered nurse despite a life-threatening health condition. Not many parents would be willing–or able–to do something like that, and that lack of extraordinary willpower means many, if not most, immigrants do not rise above a certain glass ceiling they’ve set for themselves that can only be shattered with nearly inhuman perseverance. Many second-generation Haitians I’ve observed display the same level of achievement or less than their African-American peers. </p>
<p>And one more thing.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>A lack of hope is never any excuse for giving up. Many blacks I know are too complacent in their culture, and have given up on believing that straining every muscle in their body will lead to some form of success. I believe that rather than giving up on the idea that hard work will pay off, they have fallen prey to the notion that the only form of success is that which can be measured by material goods and not personal fulfillment. Thus, when earning good grades in school earns them nothing but derision from their peers, African American students are discouraged since they cannot grasp a tangible reward.</p>
<p>And I know my post is rife with all sorts of logical fallacies, especially hasty generalizations. Please be forbearing in your thoughts of and references to this post. ^_^</p>
<p>“Thus, when earning good grades in school earns them nothing but derision from their peers, African American students are discouraged since they cannot grasp a tangible reward.”</p>
<p>As an african-american male going through public school all my life you can definitely say that again.</p>
<p>com⋅pla⋅cent
/kəmˈpleɪsənt/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [kuhm-pley-suhnt]
–adjective
- pleased, esp. with oneself or one’s merits, advantages, situation, etc., often without awareness of some potential danger or defect; self-satisfied: </p>
<p>“Excuses” notwithstanding, I just don’t think “complacent” is the right word for most of us.</p>
<p>It is the fortunate African American students who earn good grades, and here, on college confidential, the rewards seem obvious. And a little humility goes a long way around here, lest you be set upon by the Afirmative Action police!</p>
<p>It seems to me that it’s when you DON’T earn good grades that you give up hope. </p>
<p>In my experience, it is more helpful to find ways to give or renew hope, than it is to chastise and find fault. But maybe that’s just me.</p>
<p>The very definition of complacent you provided included self-satisfaction. And that’s exactly the problem I was pointing to: that many students, African American or otherwise, have become self-satisfied and surrendered themselves to inertia. You do make a valid point about “complacency” not being a perfect description of these sorts of individuals; perhaps “swollen-headed popinjays” would do better. 
And this is not to say that minorities are the only ones to suffer from this malaise–it is just that when a minority does not passionately pursue its studies, it will suffer an even more disparate impact.*</p>
<p>With regards to the rewards of getting good grades being obvious, I think that may apply more so to those who receive recognition for their grades than for others. Isn’t it the recognition of one’s achievements that helps, although not ultimately, to give the good grades their value? </p>
<p>In terms of finding ways to give/renew hope, I’m afraid I won’t be able to offer anything in the way of suggestion besides the bitter pill of hard work, persistent prayer, and meaningful societal investment in the improvement of struggling students. Dumbing down state assessment exams is not the way to go in terms of societal investment, and neither is the social promotion of failing students through grades. Parental involvement must be enlisted, and if it is not readily available, then mentorships are the next best thing. Holding high expectations is key, as is an understanding of the student’s home environment and economic situation. But at a certain point, corrupting influences that have managed to disintegrate community structures must be dealt with. Drugs present an especially terrible problem, since current policies are rather stringent (and do not look like they are on the path to becoming more sensible like Portugal’s decriminalization policy >.<). Schools are microcosms of their communities, and that’s why change has to start in either place before anything can happen. This is rather idealistic and bland, but it’s true.</p>
<p>This is not to say that I advocate the whole ‘pull yourself up by your bootstraps’ idea; this would be nearly impossible for most, given the external cultural and economic conditions that they face and are powerless (for the most part) to change. And if I had been forced to pull myself up by my bootstraps, I wouldn’t be here today. But hard work + a heckuva lotta luck and God-given opportunity = incremental movement up the socioeconomic ladder. </p>
<hr>
<p>*And I recognize the limitations of this statement past a certain level of educational achievement, given [url=<a href=“http://www.economics.harvard.edu/faculty/mullainathan/files/emilygreg.pdf]this[/url”>http://www.economics.harvard.edu/faculty/mullainathan/files/emilygreg.pdf]this[/url</a>] study.</p>
<p>"In terms of finding ways to give/renew hope, I’m afraid I won’t be able to offer anything "</p>
<p>I think you students who post on this African American student forum give hope, to both students and parents.</p>
<p>And maybe we just meet, associate with, or work with different people ( I believe you have lived in LI: I grew up in Brooklyn and Queens!), but it is rare for me to meet African Americans who are “pleased, esp. with oneself or one’s merits, advantages, situation, etc.”. Better for me, because I end op feeling fortunate, rather the superior.</p>
<p>I’ll have to look up “popingjay”.</p>
<p>I’m realizing that this forum is intended for students so I’ll go back to lurking.</p>
<p>
I completely agree with this statement. I have seen it over and over again throughout high school.</p>
<p>“Is it because we speak a second language and have better morals than they do?”</p>
<p>After that statement I cant even take this thread seriously.</p>
<p>My dad was born in st.croix (family from antigua) and although i do do better in school than most, no its not be/c i speak a second language and have better morals than anyone else -_-</p>
<p>I hate to sound bitter. But let’s not try to claim superiority on things that don’t show cause and effect. I mean “Is it because we speak a second language and have better morals than they do?” isn’t necessarily true. I speak French (not fluently, but still) and you can’t claim to have moral superiority because that doesn’t show modesty and humility and all. I do better in school because i want to have opporutnities. Can’t say the same for anyone else. And Africans probably may not understand this as much, but the system wasn’t set up to work against you. Your ancestors weren’t not allowed to read. As a whole, there’s a stigma about what we think we can achieve. It’s hard to explain, but there are more and better reasons than speaking a second language or having a so-called “moral superiority”.</p>
<p>^Let’s let this one die. The OP’s question didn’t merit a response; it was pretty darn dumb for a whole raft of reasons I don’t care to explain. Continuing to post here actually assumes the original question was germane with regards to student success. </p>
<p>Pretty please?</p>
<p>That sounds fair. Deal.</p>
<p>you may not have said it all that eloquently but I have seen a similar pattern at my school. people with immigrant parents really do seem to do a lot better in school. My friend is doing a science project on the relationship between the parents country of origin and the kid academic success…</p>
<p>Though the OP did not word what he (or she) was trying to say correctly, I understand what he is saying. I go to a predominantly African-American high school and noticed that the kids with the highest grades tend to be immigrants or have parents that are immigrants. Being close to my mother side, who is from Tobago, and my father side, that has always lived in the U.S., I would see that the reason why the children of immigrants tend to do better is because they appreciate the opportunities in America more. My mom is always talking about how we are so lucky to live in America, how she wishes she was born here so she could have had funding to go to college, so always pushed for me and my brother to do well in school so that we can take advantage of the opportunities that she never has. My mom’s cousin, constantly complains about how she does not think her son is taking full advantage of what America has to offer and how she wishes he was more focused on college. However, my father’s side of the family is more laid-back in terms of going to college. The biggest push is to get out of high school, however there is not such a big push to attend college. If the child attends college it is great, but if he or she doesn’t it is no big deal versus my mother who stated that if we did not attend college we have to get a job and pay half of the bills or move out of the house. </p>
<p>I think the main reason why immigrants and children of immigrants tend to do better is because they have more of an appreciation for the opportunities to succeed in America versus the lack of help “back home” and are shocked when people take this opportunities for granted when they would have given up anything to be in our shoes when they were younger.</p>