Or according to the Census Bureau…
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Thanks to you and @nyc10023 for the further clarification.
For Middle Eastern “white” applicants, that means someone descended from Syria is in the same group as the UAE?
And, while this is a fast-moving thread, I do want to clarify that in all instances, I am referring to a candidate who is not “international”, but one that is a US Citizen or US permanent resident.
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From a Common Application standpoint, these are the questions asked:
Are you Hispanic or Latino/a/x?
Yes
No
Which best describes your Hispanic or Latino/a/x background? (You may select one or more)
Central America
Cuba
Mexico
Puerto Rico
South America
Spain
Other
Regardless of your answer to the prior question, please indicate how you identify yourself. (You may select one or more)
American Indian or Alaska Native
Asian
Black or African American
Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander
White
Please tell us about your tribal identity or affiliation
Are you enrolled in a federally recognized tribe?
Yes
No
Which best describes your Asian background? (You may select one or more)
Cambodia
China
India
Japan
Korea
Malaysia
Pakistan
Philippines
Vietnam
Other East Asia
Other South Asia
Other Southeast Asia
Which best describes your Black or African American background? (You may select one or more)
U.S. / African American
Africa
Caribbean
Other
Which best describes your Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander background? (You may select one or more)
Guam
Hawaii
Samoa
Other Pacific Islands (excluding Philippines)
Which best describes your White background? (You may select one or more)
Europe
Middle East
Other
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Thanks, ski. Very, very helpful. This year is my first time ever going through the Common App, so this completely answers my queries as to how applicants are categorized.within ethnic “buckets.”
Again, I am absolutely no expert, but it does seem from the great specificity of this Common App question that the college AOs can make distinctions between the broader categorization of “Asians” to the extent that an applicant actually answers this question. Stated another way, in answering Chance Me-type questions, posters need to go through the same sub-categorizations as listed above.
Middle East is considered White for US Census purposes.
And specifically for Common App purposes, which is what we are really focusing on. Do you know if the Common App categorizations directly coincide with US Census categories?
Looks like The Common Application classification was given in "Asian" in Chance Me and similar threads - #285 . This has “Middle East” under “White”.
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I was asking about all the Common App categories vis-a-vis US Census categories, not just Middle East. The purpose of my question is to see whether there is national data that comports with a school’s own numbers.
No worries, I can look it up.
Can you expand on this?
Again, I am no expert, but what I meant to say is that if colleges are asking for this level of specificity in terms of ethnicity, any of us responding to posts about an “Asian” need to dive deeper. Sorry I was not more clear.
Would advice differ based on sub-category of Asian?
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That, @DramaMama2021, is exactly what I am getting at. I would THINK so, given how specific the Common App question(s) are, but I don’t know.
I truly would like to believe that each kid is judged on their own merits, with ethnicity being one of many factors. But I truly hope it is not the dispositive one. I just don’t know, though.
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I know you are trying to help fine-tune the advice for the student. It just makes me cringe if we start seeing questions like “where in Asia are your ancestors from?” Or worse, “what kind of Asian are you?”
Will posters ask the same for Black students? “Are your ancestors from Africa or the Caribbean?” Or Hispanic - “Europe, or Central America, or Mexico?”
This direct probe sends the message that the student’s college chances revolve around their race/ethnicity more so than the multitude of other factors.
I don’t know, maybe that’s just my (over)reaction.
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Along the same lines as what @CCC4 is saying, my concern would be that such information would just give posters more fodder to further speculate about a topic without any sound factual basis. ‘Oh, you are X? You are lucky you aren’t Y, they have it really tough. The X’s at my son’s school always do much better than the Y’s.’
(In other words, the same stuff that happens now, only on a more micro level.)
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^^ this
Plus the sensitivity about this for Asian Americans (the “perpetual foreigner syndrome” I mentioned upthread).
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I am not sure what I have said that would give any idea that I disagree with this. I would prefer that we, as a community, go neutral on this. Perhaps changing the template on CC is a start, where we can always add that there are ethnic considerations so the Chance Me responses given truly vary.
My point in raising these issues is that I have seen posts make the ethnicity a critical factor. Not all, to be sure, but enough over the years that it is very concerning to me. That’s the whole purpose of why I posted the OP.
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My post was not at all intended as critical of what you were saying. I asked for clarification because I was concerned that others might take your words in the wrong direction and make the race/ethnicity target worse.
I very much appreciate your OP and how you keep refocusing us on your 2 original points. How to be helpful and more neutral is a wonderful goal.
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While I agree with your and other posters’ point that ethnicity isn’t the overriding factor for any applicant, I don’t think we can completely disregard ethnicity and go neutral - as long as colleges consider it in their admission process we must as well. It is one factor, but just as we cannot ignore other factors like rigor, GPA, LoRs, etc we cannot simply choose to disregard the ethnicity factor.
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There was some controversy recently at some highly selective universities when it was noticed that a much larger than expected portion of Black students were kids of highly educated African immigrants, versus being more generally representative of the African American population.
Of course, if you control for specific ethnicity, sub-ethnicity, and generational distance from immigration, it is likely that kids of highly educated parents are greatly overrepresented at highly selective colleges, relative to the group of their own ethnicity, sub-ethnicity, and generational distance from immigration. But race and ethnicity are more visible than parent education, so people tend to fixate on race and ethnicity more.
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What advice would give an Asian American who is from an over-represented subtype that wouldn’t sound like stereotyping and as @CFP says, too late anyway that would differ from a white applicant?
I really don’t think there is.
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