<p>The College Board would probably love being able to offer summer testing. </p>
<p>However, there would be a HUGE problem in convincing anyone who gets a paycheck at a US school to forget that the three main reason they went in education is spelled JUNE, JULY, and AUGUST. </p>
<p>It be hard to find a summer work date for a group people that works fewer than 180 days a year. And without an open HS there is no SAT.</p>
<p>I know of no teacher that works fewer than 180 days per year. The districts here in western Washington not only expect 180 days, they have 12 to 15 additional days that are "not required"... but if you don't show up, you're, well, "not a team player" and it's reflected in your annual review.</p>
<p>You can argue that ten days of sick leave brings it below 180 days/year... but in what other profession are you exposed to at least 150 different people, many of them either getting sick, sick, or recovering, every single day?</p>
<p>The school year around here begins in mid-August with 5 days of preparation (and lectures on learning theory) and ends in late June with a rush to get grades in. Every five years you have to take 150 hours (the equivalent of three college classes) of courses to maintain your teaching credential--summers are usually spent keeping the credential up to date.</p>
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To start, I love how you compare an injury to a test. They aren't the same. An injury is an unforeseen problem that teams have to deal with. Yes, they are dealt with on a daily basis; fact of life. Missing a competition to take a test where other options are present is being selfish. Remember.. there is NO I in TEAM.
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<p>Yes, there is no I in TEAM, but for some reason I doubt YOU fully understand what that seems to mean. Anyone who has been a part of team (at least at a competitive level) knows that nobody is indispensable. Players seem to understand that a lot better than sideline bodies! </p>
<p>While being part of a team requires commitment, dedication, and unselfishness, it does not mean that real life issues cannot be more important. For some, academic commitments are more important; for others there are religious commitments. Are teammates following the Jewish faith selfish when they have to skip games on religious holidays?</p>
<p>Obviously you regard academic commitment (including important tests) with scorn and disdain. Perhaps a quick look a the statistics of how many high school "superstars" land an athletic scholarship (let alone ever stepping on a NCAA field) might provide a healthier dose of realism. For every success, there are tens of thousand of broken illusions fueled by clueless parents and coaches.</p>
<p>No coach gets any input in setting our family's priorities about the balance between academics and athletics. The only real world question would arise for me in the rare case when a student has exhausted reasonable alternatives, decides that his/her priority is to sit for the college entrance exam on a particular date and, after discussing things reasonably with the coach, the coach nonetheless imposes a sanction that seems out of proportion. I'm with those who would be discussing such a situation at the level of the superintendent and/or school board, but I wonder if this actually happens often in the real world. I'm happy to say that it would be inconceivable at my D's school.</p>
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Yes, there is no I in TEAM, but for some reason I doubt YOU fully understand what that seems to mean. Anyone who has been a part of team (at least at a competitive level) knows that nobody is indispensable. Players seem to understand that a lot better than sideline bodies!
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<p>I know exactly what it means to be a team-player. Trust me.. I've done plenty of 'crap-work' for the team. I was a 3-sport varsity athlete. Very seldom did my name make it in the paper, but when the team was successful, I was happy.</p>
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While being part of a team requires commitment, dedication, and unselfishness, it does not mean that real life issues cannot be more important. For some, academic commitments are more important; for others there are religious commitments. Are teammates following the Jewish faith selfish when they have to skip games on religious holidays?
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<p>If taking the test is more important on a date that the team has a competition, then maybe being a member of the team is not what you should do. </p>
<p>Don't include religion. This isn't about being Jewish. It's about choices. And if your religion is going to interfere with team competition then you have to reconsider whether you truly want to be a part of the team. The OP talked about cross country; most cross country meets around here are held on Saturday so if you are Jewish and can't compete on Saturday, then you aren't much use to the TEAM.</p>
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Obviously you regard academic commitment (including important tests) with scorn and disdain.
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<p>Just the tests. Why is it that some outside organization plays such a huge role in deciding what school you get into?!?! Academics are extremely important to me. </p>
<p>I understand the statistics of high school athletes moving onto the NCAA and of those, who actually go pro in their respective sports. Remember, "most of them will be going pro in something other than athletics."</p>
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<blockquote> <p>Just the tests. Why is it that some outside organization plays such a huge role in deciding what school you get into?!?! <<</p> </blockquote>
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<p>Apparently because the colleges want it that way. Within the limits set by civil rights law, the colleges are the ones that set the criteria by which they choose their students. The SAT is not required by law. If the colleges didn't care about the SAT and ACT, the tests would immediately dry up and blow away. </p>
<p>It's certainly not the students' fault. They just have to play the hand they are dealt by the system. And if that means doing well on standardized tests is a key part of getting into their desired colleges, then the coaches are just going to have to learn to live with that priority, no matter how much it pains them to do so.</p>
<p>Ugh. I had these problems with chamber music coach. I play the French horn at an elite conservatory's prep school. Last year, every few Saturdays, without fail, one of the five members of my quintet would be missing due to ACT or SATs. The coach was so angry she tried to get us kicked out of the chamber program and fail us. What were we going to do? As she eagerly and regularly reminded us, there is no guarantee of conservatory acceptance (I was the only one lacking that aspiration in the group); standardized testing isn't an optional enrichment activity: it is as necessary to college admission as that EC we all have to miss one Saturday...</p>
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Another peeve is that the National Mock Trial championship is always during AP testing time.
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Going back to deja's post (#19) - I don't get what the problem is.
My school's team made it to Nationals this past year (I'm not on the team myself, but the school is close and making it this far was a big deal).
Everyone on the team that had AP tests just took them on the late testing dates, two weeks later.
There is no reason why your son would have to miss out on ap testing.</p>
<p>yup^^ my coach was a d!c* about this kind of stuff too...there was not much us players could do</p>
<p>Div. 1, Div. 2, elite athlete, three sport varsity athlete. Please, give me a break! Every year some kids from our area get whole articles in our local paper about someplace they signed with (often a community college) plus a whole lot of hoopla during the school year. Most do not make it through college (even the D1 recruits) and who knows where they ended up. (Meanwhile one has to fight tooth and nail to get some feature about academically successful kids, but that is another story). SAT/ACT conflicts were only taken into consideration if some of the star athletes said they were going to take the test instead of playing the game (then, miraculously, the GAMES were able to be moved to a better time). Let's get real. Athletics are so blown up during the high school/college years. Honestly, how many kids are going to make PLAYING sports part of their careers? According to reports <a href="http://www.ncaa.org/edout/basketball_mentoring/newsletters/volume2.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.ncaa.org/edout/basketball_mentoring/newsletters/volume2.pdf</a>
College</a> Parents of America - A national membership association serving current and future college parents women's basketball player has a 3.1% chance of getting a college scholarship and a .02% of playing in the pros. Mens basketball is 2.9% and .03%, football 5.8% and .09%, mens soccer 5.8% and .09% and baseball 5.6% and .5%
"I understand the statistics of high school athletes moving onto the NCAA and of those, who actually go pro in their respective sports." I wonder how many coaches really think about this?</p>
<p>^^^ very true. I think many lose site of why they participate in h.s. sports. The dates for ACT/SAT are published well in advance, so in most cases it is a matter of planning ahead and setting priorities. It is not like these things are only offered one week a year !!!!</p>
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I think many lose site of why they participate in h.s. sports
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<p>Maybe, but no doubt there are many others who lose sight of what constitutes a well-rounded, fulfilling life. It seems likely that the lessons learned and memories made from participating in a high school sporting event will far outshine those gleaned from enduring another standardized test taken for self-centered reasons.</p>
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The dates for ACT/SAT are published well in advance
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<p>Today is June 26, 2008. The furthest test date I could find on College Board's web site was June 9, 2008. June 13, 2008 was the furthest date I could find for the ACT.</p>
<p>My high school already has varsity football games scheduled for 5 of 9 for the 2012-2013 school year. It also has the volleyball schedule online for the 2009-2010 season, most of the basketball schedules through 2009-2010, and part of the baseball schedule through 2009-2010 school year.</p>
<p>My point is athletics are scheduled "well in advance" if not even more in advance so your argument that schools should plan around the SAT and ACT is hard to agree with. Those organizations haven't released those dates yet and schools have their sports schedules published a couple years in advance!</p>
<p>Here are the SAT test dates through June 2009:
SAT</a> Dates - SAT Test Dates and Registration Deadlines
I'm posting these not because I disagree with your point (I don't), but to put the information out there. I had looked for these dates a few days ago and they weren't up, so I assume they were just posted.</p>
<p>SAT</a> Dates - SAT Test Dates and Registration Deadlines</p>
<p>2008-09 Test Dates and Registration Deadlines</p>
<p>I'm sorry.. you both are right. I put 2008 instead of 2009.. meant 2009 but mind was thinking something else :o</p>
<p>Point is still valid though. They have a year scheduled.. some athletic schedules are 3-4 years out.</p>
<p>I had track meets the nights before 3 of my AP exams, the night before my SAT, and my ACT. Our team didn't make it back from some of those meets until 12 or 1 in the morning a few times. I understand your daughter's pain when it comes to balancing academics and athletics. Sometimes it's just a juggling game.</p>