<p>Nice try, reddinosaur. Chua was very explicit that her expectation was that they be #1. Not just A students.</p>
<p>^^^ It is my own personal opinion since that’s what QuantMech had asked originally. That’s just how I interpreted the situation that he asked about. </p>
<p>As far as Ms. Chua’s expectations, it’s her own business and I have nothing to gain/lose whether I agree or disagree.</p>
<p>In QMP’s school, there would have been at most two “top” students in each class. One would be the student with the highest point total. There were some subjective elements in determining the point totals in subjects with essays and projects; but in math, for example, the point totals were almost entirely objective. </p>
<p>The requirement for an A was an average of 93.0%. However, with extra credit, some students had more than 100% in some classes (also a debatable practice, but not the issue here). All of the children are “top,” only in Lake Wobegon.</p>
<p>The student identified by the teacher as the top student might have been the student with the highest point total, or might have been the one the teacher regarded most highly, if the two were different. There could be legitimate reasons for this (interest, curiosity, depth, coupled with a slip-up on some assignment).</p>
<p>Some schools might operate differently, and not have any assignments marked on a point or % basis. I only know how a few schools operate.</p>
<p>At the University of Cambridge each year, there are many students who achieve “First Class Honors” in mathematics, but only one of them is the Senior Wrangler.</p>
<p>QuantMech,</p>
<p>What happened? </p>
<p>Are you not interested in discussing parallels between Imperial Chinese discriminatory practices on the basis of occupation and our “Enlightenment based” society’s problems with racial/ethnic/religious discrimination in many areas of American life…including our educational system? </p>
<p>Especially when many of the most nefarious practices took place as little as 4 decades ago?</p>
<p>cobrat, I think it would be fair to discuss parallels between parallel issues. For example, I would be glad to discuss parallels in the treatment of racial minorities in both countries, as well as parallels in religious discrimination in both countries–in both cases, continuing now. </p>
<p>I think it would also be fair to look at parallels between people who were or are excluded from even applying for higher education, or taking examinations. In the US, that would include women, who could not attend Princeton, Yale, or Caltech (among others) until 1969. Women at Radcliffe received Harvard diplomas (although they did not attend Harvard commencement), beginning in 1963. Joint commencement exercises started in 1970, and full integration happened sometime later. The excluded group “all women” is certainly broader than “actors, their children, and grandchildren.” On the other hand, I think it would be a cheap shot on my part to write about the situation of girls in China.</p>
<p>US history with regard to the treatment of African-Americans is shameful, and it continues to be so. I am actively involved in several efforts to try to address inequalities. I am also proud to be the descendant of a Scottish immigrant, who within a few years of arriving in the country enlisted in the 5th Illinois cavalry, fought for the express purpose of ending slavery, and died during the Civil War.</p>
<p>I am amazed by the amount of interest about this Tiger Mother thing. In a international economic summit, former Treasury Secretary and Harvard President Lawrence Summers was forced to anser a question about Tiger Mother and so was White House science adviosr, Nobel Laurate Carl Weiman in a science conference. I think that the reasons behind this are: 1) the rise of China; and 2) the academic performance of Asian students in the United States. China is developing so fast over the past 30 years and many people are curious about what’s going on there including how they raise their kids.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl you’re a baby, I’m in my mid-fifties and Woody Allen is certainly not before my time!</p>
<p>People are interested in Snooki and Lindsay Lohan too, though :-)</p>
<p>@#1006,
At another extreme, looking at the composition of our prison system, what is the percentage of those criminals raised under Amy Chua’s method?</p>
<p>May be the question has been asked before on this tread, I apologize if that being the case: Do we have our list of success criteria for being a good parent? Does the end justify the means?</p>
<p>I was told by my kids teachers in grade school that I was a bad parent because my kids were not the norm. They got dressed going to school. They were very well behaved in class (paid attention, no mouthing off to teachers). They did their homework. They asked for extra help when they got bad grades on their essays or tests. From all of that, some teachers thought I was too strict and put too much pressure on my kids. They thought I should let my kids be more free.</p>
<p>In high school, same behavior from my kids, and teachers were asking how we raised such lovely young ladies, and how they always looked so happy and cheerful.</p>
<p>Maybe mouthing off in class (speaking out of turn) was cute in grade school, but not so much in high school? Maybe it is expected (normal) to forget to do home work in grade school, but not the case in high school? Asking for extra help in grade school seem over the top, but is expected in high school?</p>
<p>I don’t know what’s definition of good parent vs bad. I didn’t pay any attention to what those teachers had to say about my kids when they were younger. Maybe they thought they were teaching me the “American way.”</p>
<p>Re: Successful Parenting, I would like to make a list. in order of difficulty:</p>
<ol>
<li>Pass on the gene. (Same level as the birds and bees.)</li>
<li>Pass on the skill of getting along with people and live a normal life, raise their own kids (or adopt kids).</li>
<li>Send kids to Ivies and top-ten schools. Well, watch out for those who raise Unabombers…</li>
<li>S or D working at the Wall Street, fetching $5 Billion/yr., Like John Paulson.</li>
<li>S or D wins Nobel Prize.</li>
<li>S or D becomes the President of United States.</li>
</ol>
<p>A tough job. But somebody has to do it.</p>
<p>
I need to add that Amy Chua’s parent are Chinese-Filipino and she herself grew up in America. I don’t know how much credit she has on child-rearing in China.</p>
<br>
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<p>Statistically, the most difficult of those listed would be becoming President of the US. Only 44 sons (and no Ds) have grown up to be President. Hundreds have won Nobel prizes and and thousands get admitted to Ivy and top ten schools every year.</p>
<p>Sorry if this has been mentioned (i tried reading all the threads on this topic but didn’t get to all of them) but for those who finally read the book, did you feel the way I did when Mrs. Chua decided to “take over” Lulu’s newfound obsession tennis? I just thought to myself, “My goodness, Amy Chua, you’ll never get it, will you?” When she saw how Lulu was becoming a good tennis player (by winning tournaments), she planned to go in for the kill and transform her into a topnotch tennis player the way she transformed her into a violin virtuoso. And that’s one sure way for her to kill Lulu’s love for the game. To me, this proves not only that she’s lying or perhaps blind to the fact that she is doing this not because she loves Lulu and wants what is best for her but because she is hungry for yet another means to attach a medal to her name. She thrives on the compliments she gets for her daughters’ accomplishments. It makes me really doubt her claim that the end goal of her parenting method is to benefit the kids.</p>
<p>And does anyone know how much these professors make in a year? I’m just curious because they seem to lead a rich lifestyle–vacations abroad every year, dinner parties for Yale, Barney’s New York gown for her daughter’s Carnegie debut, paying violin tutor and her BF’s accomodations, etc. Yet she mentioned planning to take out on her pension plan to be able to buy a new violin for Lulu. </p>
<p>And finally, with the number of hours spent on violin and piano lessons each day, I keep wondering how much time they slept. What about homework?</p>
<p>After reading this book, I just could shake my head and feel sorry for Amy Chua and her family. Bless her patient husband (although makes me doubt his intelligence as how could he let Amy keep doing what she is doing to her daughters without firmly intervening). I also wonder where Sophia is going to college. I do think Lulu will turn out fine. When she was allowed to pursue tennis, she did everything by herself–practice, win, etc.</p>
<p>Coureur, (6) was the most difficult. Obviously passing on the gene would have to be the easiest (in spite of the infertility some couples face), so we can assume that he suggests becoming president of the US is the most difficult.</p>
<p>“Yet she mentioned planning to take out on her pension plan to be able to buy a new violin for Lulu.”</p>
<p>Violins are really expensive if you want the best of the best.</p>
<p>And professors don’t make that much money, but vacations abroad don’t cost that much more than vacations in the US, if you know how to work them. Especially not in the years she was writing about, with airfares as low as they were, the low Euro there for awhile, etc. Aside from Northern Europe, you save on accommodation enough to cover the extra airfare, especially from New York. Flights from New York are cheap.</p>
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</p>
<p>I’d guess they do things fast, e.g., 3 hrs of homework for some kids, they do it in 30 min.</p>
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<p>Bill Clinton’s biological father did nothing except (1).</p>
<p>^Same for Obama’s father. Were Clinton’s and Obama’s mothers “Tiger mothers?” I don’t think so.</p>
<p>No but Obama’s grandmother was close and most influential in his life. </p>
<p><a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madelyn_Dunham[/url]”>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madelyn_Dunham</a></p>