Best Premed colleges

College Search & Selection
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I recall reading some time back that ACT and MCAT scores tended to correspond being within 2 points of each other on average. They found no correlation with SAT scores.

That memory has come back to me now that middle son was asked his ACT score (and if he had taken the SAT, that too, but he didn’t). I wonder if some schools are keeping track?

FWIW, middle son took the new MCAT, but if one looks at what are supposed to be comparable scores to the old one, he’s right in there with correlation. His MCAT score (if it were old style) is two points higher than his ACT score.
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Yes, there is a correlation between ACT and MCAT (and maybe SAT, too, I don’t know).

Maybe the asking of those scores on the med school app is to track that claim.

My son was stubborn back then and wouldn’t study for either test…not the ACT nor the MCAT (CRAZY!!!). He took ONE practice test at 9pm the night before his MCAT…that was the extent of his “practice.”

His ACT composite and MCAT (old) score are within the 2 pt range…I guess that makes sense when he didn’t study for either one.

Thankfully, he has since wised up and studied for Step I. He took Step 2 this week.

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There are various academic papers floating around that claim some correlation between SAT/ACT and MCAT scores. This particular one was created as a project for a statistics class, so it is relatively easy to follow. The link opens a PDF.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiA8_qZ3fPNAhVFaD4KHdxdBMEQFggeMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fsites.iri.isu.edu%2FSigmaa%2FHome%2FDownload%3FmediaID%3D52&usg=AFQjCNFYr_nMSMoths2SPwuNaEkbekfAuQ&sig2=SYsyuwKhIheR9_1rwiIeDA

It also lists the more rigorous papers on the topic in the Addenda. Most of them are rather old, and show some correlation.

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There are a multitude of schools that offer a seven or eight year M.D. program where you will complete your undergrad in three or four years and already have a spot in the medical school (without having to take the MCATs). Examples of this include the PLME program at Brown University and the HPME program at Northwestern University. If you are sure you want to go into the medical field look into programs such as these. They are very difficult to get into, especially the two I mentioned, but as is the same for all colleges, some of the programs are easier to get into than others. To go to a T50 school for undergrad, especially an Ivy League, definitely has its advantages. First off, if you go to a major research institution with a medical school affiliated with a highly respected hospital, such as Yale, there are many more opportunities for internships and such. Many professors work at Yale New Haven and are very welcoming for Yale students to help with research and

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^ I completely agree, Jhosk10! A school like University of Alaska Fairbanks would never have the same opportunities as a major research institution like Emory, Yale, and UC Davis.

@mom2collegekids
“In real life, the MCAT is the great equalizer. So if you’re thinking that med schools will pooh pooh the 3.8+ GPA from a lesser school, they won’t if that is accompanied by a strong MCAT score.”


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Absolutely. However, if those students get weak MCAT scores, they will have to take a trip to the beautiful Caribbean islands.

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Any college where you can succeed in the sciences and overall is a great pre-med college imo. My two cents.

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Brown, Dartmouth, and Harvard come to mind:

-great reputations and resources
-grade inflation

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[QUOTE=""]
. My quote In real life, the MCAT is the great equalizer. So if you're thinking that med schools will pooh pooh the 3.8+ GPA from a lesser school, they won't if that is accompanied by a strong MCAT score."

@emory323
Absolutely. However, if those students get weak MCAT scores, they will have to take a trip to the beautiful Caribbean islands.

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I know that you will find it hard to believe, but there are premeds at top schools that end up with weak MCAT scores, too…and they would just as likely have to take a trip to the Caribbean…so what is your point?

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If anyone is unsure about getting into med school from X undergrad institution, ask to see where recent grads have gotten accepted. Most schools will share information. If not, that would raise a red flag.

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Adding to my previous post, Juniata is a small LAC semi near us that many students choose if they are interested in health professions - yet I don’t think they have super national recognition.

Google tells me their average SAT scores are 520 - 620 for math and 520 - 630 for reading. 10% get scores higher than 700. Hardly elite, but a really decent little school IMO. A decent option for merit aid and I think they do ok with need based aid too.

Here’s an acceptance list for their pre-health students:

https://www.juniata.edu/academics/departments/health-professions/faqs.php

For those not wanting to click on the link, one can find such “no name” med schools as Albert Einstein, Baylor, Case Western, Dartmouth, Duke, Harvard, Johns Hopkins, Mayo… (many more)

If curious about School X, google (or ask) School X.

Med schools want to train doctors for our population and they choose the top from many schools to get their classes.

Choose the school to fit the student. My med school destined guy loves his higher level undergrad and has done well. No regrets. But being successful at that level is not the right choice for everyone, nor does it have to be.

I never recommend a student thinking pre-med go to a school where they aren’t in the Top 25% of students stats-wise. (My guy was in that Top 25% too.) One can argue “The ACT/SAT is just a test.” Well yeah, so is the MCAT. And there are other tests along the way to becoming doctors. Future doctors had better bone up on their testing skills.

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They have a high acceptance rate but typically place less than 20 students into med school each year. That is a tiny number compared to more well known programs that place 10 time that amount each year.

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The point of this is to show that it’s not necessary to go to an elite pre-med powerhouse to get into med school. Not all students like or can compete with that caliber of competition. Not all students can afford those schools. Some even just prefer smaller programs. It’s all ok. There are options. Some were seeming to imply there aren’t - that one should aim high or go home because they won’t be considered from “lower level” schools.

There are 1600 students at Juniata. Definitely all aren’t pre-med. They are also well-known for environmental sciences, so will attract many for that. They attract many for other health areas too. But if one is looking for a small rural gem, perhaps with merit aid, and where students have been known to do well, it’s worthy of being considered. I suspect there are many others that are similar out there too. This is just one example.

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20 students admitted to Med school from such a small college and with such original stats indicates a college that punches way above its weight in terms of Med school admissions.

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@MYOS1634, @Zinhead, @Creekland, @mom2collegekids

Are there other schools like Juniata that seem to move the needle on performance in premed? I’m looking for schools that are supportive in that way for premed students. I know that there is no major called premed, but there are educational environments that seem more supportive than cut throat, and that can nurture a talent and skill set in my child who’s interested in medicine.

Thank you.

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never recommend a student thinking pre-med go to a school where they aren’t in the Top 25% of students stats-wise. (My guy was in that Top 25% too.)

One can argue “The ACT/SAT is just a test.” Well yeah, so is the MCAT. And there are other tests along the way to becoming doctors. Future doctors had better bone up on their testing skills.
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Yes about testing!! If you’re not a strong test-taker, it’s going to bite you in the fanny all the way thru. Not only with the MCAT (although that’s the first big hurdle), but also with shelf exams, Step I, 2, 3 and other exams.

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20 students admitted to Med school from such a small college and with such original stats indicates a college that punches way above its weight in terms of Med school admissions.


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Yes, it’s impressive. …and I think the number is 19. However, it does NOT indicate that those 19 were spread amongst the quartiles. For all we know, those could all have been from well-within the upper quartiles of admittance.

I wouldn’t want someone thinking that the school is sprinkling some sort of Learning Dust onto their students with 1200 M+CR SATs and getting them into med school.

About 800 are juniors and seniors (assuming that their 19 are coming from that applying cohort), 80 (10%) are in the 1400+ M+CR SAT,

EDIT…

Before we inadvertently mislead folks about Juniata’s success rate, an important mention must be made. The 19 students admitted to med schools INCLUDE DO schools. The school does not seem to break out the number of MD admitted students. and I would bet that the one admitted into MD schools were the upper quartile.

Also…Juniata has a special relationship with Erie DO school where rather modest stats students can get in without ever taking the MCAT.


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LECOM: Students who wish to be in the pipeline for 4 + 4 Early Acceptance Programs must have a combined Math and Verbal SAT score of at least 1170 OR an ACT of at least 26 AND a high school grade point average of at least 3.5. Juniata overall GPA must be 3.4 or better, science GPA must be 3.2 or better.

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Students will not be required to take the MCAT exam. A letter from a D.O. or M.D. is no longer required. Only one Physics course with a lab is now required. LECOM will evaluate students based on Academic Index Score (AIS). This score will use the SAT/ACT scores in conjunction with College GPA. If AIS does not meet the required standards by start of fourth year at Juniata, the student will have the option of taking the MCAT exam.
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Suddenly their numbers aren’t so impressive.

The devil is always in the details…

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^ I disagree. If I had a 1170-1200 sat score, wanted to become a doctor, and I had a direct entry pathway to a DO school I’d jump on it.
How many of the 1170-1200 kids at Pitt or Penn State have a shot at any sort of health career? Most will be crushed by students in Schreyer or Honors, then the top non honors admits.

I agree the fact they don’t distinguish between do and medical school is misleading on the surface but I’m wondering how many other universities do the same when the give Med school admissions percentages - we All know these are generally twisted as to be meaningless.
19 out of how many applicants? Out of 25 or 30 it’s impressive. Out of 50, it’s average. Out of 100, not impressive at all.

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What you are missing is that some of these students could actually be 1400+ students given the right situation. Perhaps the foundation at their school was lacking. Perhaps they were bored and not motivated. Perhaps they are late bloomers.

Put these kids into a school where they barely get in stats-wise and they’ll sink because their new peers will have had a good foundation and they’ll be lost trying to catch up.

Put them in a school where they are with peers and a smaller environment for more a personalized (and probably better) academic environment and they can, indeed, do better than past performance would have suggested.

Will they all? No. But if I had a student with these stats who wanted to attempt to head to med school, I’d be sending them to a school where they might succeed - like Juniata.

To the PP who asked about others… Allegheny, LaSalle, and Franklin & Marshall come to mind for places where some of our students have been successful. For those with scores that aren’t quite up there, I’ve even heard Shepherd recommended, but I haven’t heard back from students who attended there. LaSalle is somewhat larger I believe.

I might be able to think of others later.

I would think a good guess would be to check out some of the Colleges that Change Lives. If I recall correctly, Juniata is one of them.

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Absolutely. Ignore those numbers. Check to see where recent grads have gone instead and then make sure you’ve done your job so your stats and ECs are up there when it comes time to apply.

Schools where students are making it in to decent places ought to have pre-med counseling decent enough to help others have a chance to succeed too.

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I disagree. If I had a 1170-1200 sat score, wanted to become a doctor, and I had a direct entry pathway to a DO school I’d jump on it.
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I agree that it’s an opportunity to jump on!

What I meant is that knowing that the 19 aren’t all going to MD schools means that the school isn’t somehow doing magic tricks.

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What you are missing is that some of these students could [have been] 1400+ students given the right situation. Perhaps the foundation at their school was lacking. Perhaps they were bored and not motivated. Perhaps they are late bloomers.
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Of course! And that happens at probably every school in the nation. A mom recently PM’d me about a surprise situation from her DD’s grad class. A student who had been a “so so” student got her act together in college and is now headed to Maryland’s med school.

Juniata can be a great opportunity, particularly with that LECOM affiliation. It’s a school to consider if someone is certain that they want to go to med school, but their test scores aren’t that high.

That said…getting into LECOM without taking the MCAT is one thing…getting high enough scores on those later exams is another. Who wants to start accumulating all that med school debt only to not pass the exams.

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The point of this is to show that it’s not necessary to go to an elite pre-med powerhouse to get into med school


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Right.

And, it’s not necessary to go to an “elite” med school in order to get a competitive residency. Getting high STEP scores, great LORs, and being in the top quartile of one’s med school class are more important.

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Earlham is another great supportive school for kids whose stats are relatively modest (solid but not excellent) who wan to go to med school or grad school.