<p>Anything you have to say on the two. </p>
<p>Sent from my Droid using CC App</p>
<p>You didn’t really give us much to go on. They’re both great places. A lot of the decision depends on you, and we know nothing about you right now. What are you looking for in a school?</p>
<p>You are probably well informed on the academic differences between the schools, but there are no real glaring differences in the “feel” of the two schools. Both are located in somewhat suburban areas of their respective cities, have that lovely historical school vibe, and are of similar sizes. With these two it boils down to which school has a stronger program for your intended major.</p>
<p>I realize that you’ve probably made your decision by now, so I’m really just posting this for anyone else now or in the future who is deliberating between Brown and Vassar. I started at Vassar as a freshman in 2009, and have just now completed my first semester at Brown. I therefore feel like I can legitimately offer a well informed opinion on both schools. Brown trumps Vassar on every count except scenic beauty of the campus (Brown’s not ugly, but Vassar simply has one of the most gorgeous campuses in America). </p>
<p>The quality of the faculty at Brown is higher. They’re usually more esteemed in their fields, have much better research experience than their peers, and are at least as good if not better than Vassar’s professors at teaching. I recall two Vassar professors who struck me as being so incompetent that I would have been amazed if they had been hired to teach their subjects at a high school level, much less the collegiate level they were teaching, and heard from other students about more professors who were similarly bad. I have never by contrast run into or heard of anyone at Brown who was truly incompetent. Moreover, even though Brown is a research university that has an undergraduate student body nearly three times the size of Vassar, I have found that the professors I’ve had at Brown were able to give me as much time and attention as the ones at Vassar. I concede that they may be specific to the social sciences and humanities, other students in the sciences, engineering and math have said that professors there are often much more distant, but on the whole I’ve found that I lost nothing in terms of quality of teaching or personal attention at Brown.</p>
<p>Moving on to students, the Brown students are generally much smarter and harder working than their peers at Vassar. I often found at Vassar that on any night of the week most of my peers, rather than doing any work, were instead getting wasted and partying. When people did work, it was often slipshod and at the last minute. People moreover just didnÂ’t seem to take classes that seriously. I got the vibe that for a lot of people, Vassar was just a four party that they got their parents to pay for. By contrast, most people at Brown work fairly hard. There are exceptions, I had some roommates on the crew team for instance who mostly got drunk and played video games, but people at Brown actually take their studies seriously and usually get their work done before partying. Beyond this, I also noticed that in class the comments are much more intelligent than what IÂ’d get at Vassar. At Vassar people would say things that indicated either that they hadnÂ’t done the reading, or that they hadnÂ’t really done any thinking. By contrast people at Brown tend to ask intelligent questions that demonstrate a firm grasp of the reading and mental acuity. Finally, the general level of social discourse is much higher. IÂ’ve had a number of serious talks about philosophy, theology, politics, and other topics with people at Brown. At Vassar I never had those conversations; people tended just to talk about how wasted they were and who theyÂ’d recently had sex with. Overall, I would thus say that Brown students are intelligent, diligent people, whereas the Vassar kids struck me as mostly spoiled suburbanites with very few academic interests. </p>
<p>BrownÂ’s curricular options also beat out VassarÂ’s. There are at least three times as many classes at Brown as there were at Vassar, across a much wider range of programs. Whereas there were a lot of areas that Vassar didnÂ’t cover or was weak at, you can take almost anything you want at Brown, from Egyptology to quantum mechanics. The New curriculum is also a godsend. Being able to pick whatever you want is awesome, and allows you to have a wonderfully rich educational experience. Even better though is the ability to take any course pass/fail. This lets you take a course you find interesting, but that youÂ’re worried might wreck your GPA. This semester for instance I took an awesome course on Confucianism pass/fail that I would otherwise have never taken, and will also be taking calculus pass/fail this summer. The cherry on top of all this is RISD (the Rhode Island School of Design). RISD is one of AmericaÂ’s top art schools and just down the hill from Brown. As a Brown student, you can register for any course you want at RISD. Although I have yet to take advantage of this, I know people who have taken some amazing classes at RISD in topics like book binding, that would have been unavailable elsewhere. None of these opportunities would be open to you at Vassar, which has a more controlled curriculum and smaller choice of classes. </p>
<p>Brown’s resources also trump Vassar’s. The libraries have a better collection than Vassar’s, fights over money are rarer than at Vassar, and the facilities are generally far superior. Brown also has a very strong alumni network and a very good career services. In particular, whereas many people at Vassar were unable to get summer work, almost nobody at Brown, including me, is unable to find a summer job (for the record I received several job offers that I turned down in order to take some summer classes). Moreover, the level of employment people get is vastly superior to what Vassar has. I remember the people at Vassar who got jobs tended to have positions such as summer sales help at the Gap. Elite companies almost never showed up to recruit on campus. Brown on the other hand attracted elite employers such as Bain and Goldman Sachs regularly, and many people I knew were able to snag great internships with these employers. </p>
<p>On a final note, Providence is just a better place to live in than Poughkeepsie. Poughkeepsie is a very run down town that has almost nothing in it besides Vassar. ItÂ’s very depressing and isolated, and you can feel quite stifled on the weekends. DonÂ’t be fooled by the fact that MTA North goes there either. New York is still nearly two hours away, and youÂ’ll probably only be able to go three or four times a semester. Providence by contrast is a fairly large city with lots to do and a rich history. Moreover, Boston is only about an hour away by train. While I concede that Boston is not as interesting as New York, ItÂ’s much better to be an hour from Boston than two hours from New York. Overall whereas I often found myself hating Poughkeepsie, I have come to love Providence and the state of Rhode Island. </p>
<p>I donÂ’t mean at all to put down Vassar. As I said it has a lovely campus. Moreover, while it has some incompetent faculty, it also has some brilliant professors like James Merrell. Vassar does maintain a high commitment to education, and you can take some wonderful classes while youÂ’re there. VassarÂ’s issue isnÂ’t that itÂ’s a bad school (on the contrary it really is quite good) but that it simply is not on the same level as an institution like Brown. ThatÂ’s really the point IÂ’ve been trying to make with these arguments. I would therefore advise anyone whoÂ’s facing this decision to unhesitatingly pick Brown over Vassar.</p>
<p>Wow thanks for that analysis. I have been looking at both brown and vassar and your reply was quite helpful. How did you feel about the providence winters as I have heard that they are really bad? Should that be a deterrent away from brown? And also, I’ve heard really bad things about browns housing, specifically that the dorms are run down and very small. What is your opinion about the housing and also the lack of air-conditioning inside of them?</p>
<p>Thanks,
Saahil</p>
<p>I’m from Phoenix. The winters (at leas the last two) weren’t bad at all. Providence is a coastal city, so whereas New Hampshire and upstate New York might get pretty bad snow, we can get rainstorms in January. Also, one (nice?) thing about Brown is that we have almost all of January off (from Dec 20th-ish to January 25th-ish), so we aren’t actually there for the worst of the winter. That being said, you will need SOME snow gear, and you’ll learn to dress in layers. Also, the rain can be pretty crappy (I don’t like freezing rain, I much prefer snow).</p>
<p>If you’re from somewhere really cold, the weather will be mild. If you’re from somewhere south, the weather will be fairly cold (though I still went to Jo’s in flip flops during December), but pretty much universally unpredictable.</p>
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<p>thanks for the response! would you compare Providence winters to Boston winters which are notoriously cold and snowy? and overall how has your experience been at Brown? I have to decide between early decision at Brown or Columbia and am looking for more information regarding the city of providence and its activities, the housing, and the winters.</p>
<p>thanks for the response,
Saahil</p>
<p>First of all, yes both Providence and Poughkeepsie are chilly from about the end of October through to the end of April. Both also tend to be fairly snowy from December through the end of March (I’m relying on friends who’ve been at Brown longer about the Autumn and December weather situation, but since I partially grew up in New England I’m pretty familiar with the region’s weather patterns). On the whole however, I actually felt that the winters in Poughkeepsie were worse. One reason is the type of snow each place gets. Providence tends to get dry, powdery snow that’s great for sledding, snow fort building and snow ball fights. Poughkeepsie by contrast gets a lot of freezing rain, and the snow is more slushy. This means that whereas in Providence you’re walking across drifts of crunchy, walkable snow, in Poughkeepsie you’re often slogging through sloughs of slush with the same consistency and dampness of mud. You’ll definitely get a lot of snow during the Winter in either place, but in Providence it’s a much more pleasant snowfall than in Poughkeepsie. The weather is if anything therefore a credit, not a detriment, in Brown’s favor. </p>
<p>Brown’s housing situation isn’t great, especially for Freshmen, but Vassar’s is also fairly miserable. Neither Vassar nor Brown have air conditioned dorms. Thus you’ll be equally uncomfortable at either place. Very few schools in the Northeast pay for air conditioning in dorms, and when they do it’s often only in a few dorms (Columbia for instance only has it in some of its residences). The one thing I can say about Brown at least is that you can get a nice breeze off Narragansett Bay sometimes, which provides a moderating influence in spring that inland Poughkeepsie lacks. </p>
<p>Both places are fairly stretched for housing too. The odds that you’ll get a single as a Freshman at either Vassar or Brown, unless you have some physical handicap or medical condition that makes a single a medical requirement, are zero. The first chance you’ll have for a single at either Brown or Vassar will be your second year. Then the odds are about even, though you may have to be part of a multi room suite with four or five other people at Brown if you want your own room. Both Vassar and Brown have small rooms, but I actually found that Brown’s tended to be larger. As a Freshman at Vassar, I got a double that was 8x10 feet. The Freshmen dorms I’ve seen at Brown tended to be a bit bigger than that. Thus, while the housing situation is not great at Brown, I would say it’s probably marginally better than the one at Vassar. </p>
<p>For what it’s worth, as to your decision between Columbia and Brown, you should decide based on what you think is important. Columbia absolutely has the better location, and I would also say it has a stronger alumni network than Brown. On the other hand the New Curriculum at Brown is infinitely more flexible than the Core Curriculum at Columbia, and you get a lot more flexibility in crafting your major and area of study. Brown also tends to put a stronger emphasis on undergraduates and teaching than Columbia, where the professors focus more on their research and the graduate students. That’s reflected in the composition of the universities: undergraduates are a majority at Brown, but a minority at Columbia. </p>
<p>Perhaps the most important distinction though is this: I’ve met a number of Columbia students and alumni who felt unhappy about their time at the school. Sometimes they felt that the administration was too impersonal and bureaucratic, sometimes they were disappointed at the perceived lack of campus spirit or the coldness of other students, and other times they felt hemmed in by the rigidity of the Core Curriculum. However, I’ve never yet met a Brown alumnus or current student who didn’t at least like their time at Brown. For several years Princeton Review has called Brown the happiest school in America. After seeing how much everyone likes their classes, how vibrant and welcoming people are here, and above all how much they love the school, I really believe it. This place bursts with joie de vivre, and there has never been a day since I got here that I did not feel truly blessed to be a Brunonian. I can’t say you wouldn’t also be happy at Columbia, but I am certain that you would find happiness at Brown. I hope this helps, and I’m sure that whatever decision you make will be the right one for you.</p>
<p>^ to add to the housing situation:</p>
<p>In my personal opinion, the housing situation for incoming freshman doesn’t suck. You have no say in where you live (unless you specify for quiet/sub-free housing or single-gender housing). Every dorm has its pros and cons, but for the most part, first-year dorms all have something special about them and provide a good freshman experience for the people living there if they choose to embrace it.</p>
<p>Entering sophomore year is when the housing situation gets sloppy lol, but most of my friends at universities all over the country are in the same predicament. It happens, sophomores get shafted. Luckily at Brown (and other schools as well), if you find a program house that you’re fond of, you can skip the lottery system altogether. And as for room size…I wouldn’t say we have small rooms. I’ve visited friends at other schools (Columbia, NYU, Dartmouth, Cornell; vidchatted with friends from UVA and Trinity), and my double in Keeney (a freshman dorm with average sized rooms) was bigger than their doubles in school.</p>
<p>And most colleges don’t have AC. get a fan and sleep in shorts and a tank top and you’ll be fine.</p>
<p>thanks for that in-depth response! I am also wondering whether Brown’s lack of core curriculum can be a problem for people that are undecided about their major, like myself. Since there are no required classes or class distribution, is it common that students get lost in all of the options and take a myriad of class with no sense of organization or structure. Additionally, during the Brown information session, I was told that professors advise students on which classes to take for their major. As I have heard from relatives at other top universities, faculty advisers often are not very helpful or often aren’t readily available to students. How helpful are these faculty advisers at Brown since I feel that they are extremely indispensable to a school like Brown that lacks a core curriculum?
Thanks,
Saahil</p>
<p>According to National Center for Education Statistics, Vassar has higher SAT numbers than Brown.</p>
<p>Thank god you dug up this over 2.5 year old thread to tell us that.</p>