I like my Outback but I think over time it’s become noisy. More road noise than I would like. That’s my only complaint about the car
1 Like
Yeah, they are nice. Loved my mitsu’s. The funny thing was, i was going to have to buy the highest model of outlander sport to get the other features i wanted, but i didn’t want the bigger engine in that one due to gas mileage. so, i got an escape instead. Then, like a month later after realizing my gas mileage wasn’t very good, i looked through the book and found the original sticker from the original owner - here my car had the bigger escape engine. I discovered like 10 different add ons that were on the car that the place I bought it from didn’t list. No wonder I got such a ridiculously good deal on it. It was 1 year old with 8k miles, 35k original sticker price and i paid 18k. Lol.
1 Like
I don’t think the Traverse is an affordable SUV for most people. It is expensive. Especially new.
OK, noise level and fuel economy aren’t normally associated with the Corvette? 
A bit of advice. If buying a German car, then sell it before the warranty expires.
1 Like
Those are two of over 50 areas rated.
Feeling super grateful that we were able to buy my aunt’s 2010 Civic for my teen son. She no longer drives, so it worked out great. I think that the private-party prices on Kelly and Edmunds don’t reflect the current dealer markups on used. Fortunately, none of us are in the market for a new car now (although if you can trade in a good one, seems like you’ll end up OK).
3 Likes
Wife just saw in an ad that one of the big dealerships here is now offering used cars out on lease. Has to be due to less inventory.
1 Like
My D22 has noticed that her high school’s student parking lot has far fewer cars in it than in previous years. We’re thinking that many parents in our area don’t have a spare car and can’t afford to buy another just to have their teen drive. (We live in a rural/less affluent area).
We bought a new car in August and the salesman complained that we were getting it at MSRP-- they were planning to meet that afternoon to raise the price well above it. I thought that was an odd comment to make to a customer but maybe he wanted us to feel like we got a bargain?
1 Like
There are several Chevrolet dealers in the area. Inquired about the Chevrolet Traverse SUV. Was told by one salesperson that his dealership charges a $5,000 market adjustment premium plus another $2,500 for a special locator device placed in all of their vehicles (this is just double-charging for the factory installed OnStar system, although they don’t tell you this).
Basically, a Chevrolet Traverse from this dealership is full MSRP, plus $7,500, plus tax, title, delivery, registration, etc. The result is that a $42,000 SUV has a walk-out price of about $52,000.
A $7,500 mark-up premium is not just $7,500 as sales tax is assessed on the premium as well. If the state sales tax for automobiles is 5%, then the $7,500 mark-up equals $7,825.
Another Chevrolet dealership charges just a $1,500 premium on all vehicles, but has no available Chevrolet Traverses available.
(They have now got me trained as I would have felt lucky to have scored a new Chevrolet Traverse at full MSRP plus a $1,500 premium plus tax, title, registration, other fees, & delivery. But, none available at that price. Guess that I am just not a lucky person.)
Will there be strong demand for quite a while? I’m putting off a needed car purchase for as long as possible. That’s good for repair shops and auto parts stores.
This isn’t a good time to buy anything, unless, of course, you have to. Strong demand isn’t the issue. The problem is the supply shortage. It will last as long as the pandemic continues, even though there’re other factors.
Many speculate that the supply shortage of new cars will last through the end of 2023.
Many models are pre-order only and purchasers are told that the expected wait time for delivery is 6 months.
Some car dealerships do not have even a single new car in their inventory. Others have limited inventory, but are charging full MSRP plus a premium.
Great chance for car manufacturers and dealers to sell off all remaining 2021 models as the 2022 year models are slowly coming in. Also, gives the automobile industry time to experiment with a limited supply model of manufacturing and sales. And all of this is occurring during the transition from gas powered vehicles to hybrids and electric vehicles (EVs).
We are waiting on delivery of a car. Paid a $1,000 deposit & have agreed to pay (signed sales contract) full MSRP plus a premium upon delivery. We are now searching for a second new vehicle and limiting our search to SUVs.
Deleted
I’m curious what state or region that’s in, if you don’t mind saying. I’ve experienced those markups in California for Toyotas, but many east coast dealers weren’t doing that, at least until recently.
My understanding is that surcharges are nationwide and have been occurring for a couple of months. During the first year of Covid, few dealerships were open & very few consumers were shopping for cars. Therefore, the surcharges are probably a recent development (other than for the Kia Telluride which received an unusually high overall rating (96/99) from Consumer Reports and an equally impressive road test rating (97/99) from CR. Base price for the Kia Telluride range from $33,000 to $47,000 and the surcharges ranged from $12,000 to $18,000). Kia & Hyundai led the surcharge trend by tacking on up to 20% of MSRP surcharges to several models.
Initially, Covid caused a run on RVs (recreational vehicles) due to the need for families to get out of the house during pandemic fears which led to isolation, social distancing, and fear of contact with others. National Parks were overwhelmed by visitors who otherwise might have gone to DisneyWorld / DisneyLand or on cruises or to crowded resort areas such as Florida’s beaches.
Many car dealerships are not assessing surcharges, but refuse to negotiate down from MSRP from the scant inventory that they have. Many car dealerships have no new cars and willingly share how their dealership does not add on any premium or market adjustment. Others raise “delivery fees” or other items already listed in the MSRP.
P.S. We started our search at CarMax several months ago. Prices were high & the most desirable models & years were sold. While there was plenty of inventory, the inventory consisted of high-priced vehicles with por ratings from Consumers Report.
My recollection is that the RV & used car markets showed the first signs of higher prices and limited supplies.
I dropped off my Toyota this morning for service at my local SF Bay Area Toyota dealer. They had zero new cars and very few used cars available and they weren’t even Toyotas. Nearly an empty lot.
1 Like
One factor that favors consumers is that WFH (work from home) options mitigate the urgent need for new vehicles as driving can be limited to essential travel which no longer includes a daily work commute.
Just saw an ad for Lexus on TV while watching college football. The ad highlighted low rate financing & a $500 rebate. The other day, BMW ran a similar ad for low financing rates and $1,000 cash-back. Maybe the high end vehicles are not moving as quickly as the other midstream brands.
In our search, my wife’s favorite was the Subaru Ascent (turbo charged 4 cylinder) 3 row SUV with second row captain’s chairs and AWD (all wheel drive). Total walk-out price including a $2,500 premium = $52,000.
Surprisingly, my favorite was the HondaCR-V with a turbocharged 4 cylinder engine & the most comfortable driver seat that I experienced during this search. Loved the position of the stick gear selector (automatic transmission) which was mounted at an angle partially on the dashboard. Total walk-out price with no premium was just above $34,000. We were the first to test drive this, but had already paid a deposit on another car (with a $2,500 premium that we gladly agreed to pay as delivery would be in less than 3 weeks versus a 6 month wait which could be delayed even further if we custom ordered). Test drove this days before we decided to purchase two new vehicles or this would have been an easy, enthusiastic, automatic yes as a second car for us.
Total walk-out price including premium market adjustment surcharge = $42,500. This is less than what a used model with 14,000 miles from CarMax would have cost ($44,000).
Buying a turbo charged 4 cylinder is a major adjustment for me as I strongly preferred 8 cylinder engines in the past.
At this point,our second car (SUV) focus is on three models = Subaru Ascent, Chevrolet Traverse, and the yet to be distributed 2022 Honda CR-V. Chevrolet Traverse has a 6 cylinder engine in all models. The Subaru Ascent has a turbo charged 4 cylinder on all models. Only considering the gas version of the Honda CR-V with a turbocharged 4 cylinder engine. Not interested in the Hybrid CR-V because the gear selector is push button, plus, I loved the turbo gas model that we test drove. I just did not react quickly enough due to the fact that we already had a contract on another very hard to get vehicle (although the affordable CR-V is also in high demand) and a bit of hesitancy due to the fact that, although a new vehicle, it was a 2021 modelas Honda introduced the 2022 hybrid CR-V first.
P.S. Both my wife & I loved the Jeep Gladiator. (Jeep Gladiator is reasonably priced, but the dealer wanted a $10,000 surcharge for a new model so we test drove a used model with under 10,000 miles, but the non-negotiable asking price was more than MSRP of a new model with a full new car warranty. Plus, we have no need for a pick-up bed.) Great crash protection throughout. (Both of us nearly got wiped out by a huge, speeding pick-up truck that ran a red light and nearly broadsided us just before test driving the Jeep Gladiator. The red light running pick-up solidified our decision to get a second new car–specifically an SUV–in order to have a bit more protection as well as a higher viewpoint. The speeding red light running pick-up did so right in front of an attentive police officer waiting at the red light in his cruiser. My wife was literally shaking for hours after the near collision which would have been fatal for both of us.
Our priorities are: Safety & reliability. Then driver comfort, passenger comfort, & ability to chaperone multiple dogs to their favorite swimming spots. the space between second row captains chairs in an SUV provide a nice resting place for one large dog while the other rests in the down turned space which houses the third row seats. This opening between captain’s chairs is also a convenient space for groceries, luggage, purses, and long items such as oars for a boat.
Towing?
If not, then also consider vans, which are more convenient for access to the interior (particularly third row seating) than SUVs.
Do car companies still manufacture vans ? Regardless of the answer, we have no interest in a van.
I am aware of vans made for commercial purposes such as an electrician’s work van.
With respect to towing: We purchased a top of the line SUV with the special towing package and never towed anything during the 18 years we kept the SUV. (I would rather buy a small RV than tow a trailer.)
Yes. Examples include Chrysler Pacifica and Voyager, Ford Transit Connect, Honda Odyssey, Kia Carnival, Mercedes-Benz Metris, and Toyota Sienna for family-size minivans. Full size commercial type vans are available from Ford, GM (Chevrolet and GMC), Mercedes-Benz, and Ram.
1 Like