Chance an Asian kid who wants Ivy League and other crazy schools? :/

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

<p>What are my chances of getting in to Princeton (among others such as Princeton, Harvard, Yale, MIT, Stanford, etc?!?!?) Like any other Asian, I aim high and dream of top schools.</p>

<p>I am currently a junior and soon to be senior. For the class of 2009 who have already gone through the pains of college acceptance and rejections and for others who have college app experience, I was wondering if you guys can give me some advice? Here is me in a nutshell (includes the important stuff)</p>

<p>Class of 2010
GPA 9th-12th (unweighted): 3.97
GPA 9th- 12th (weighted): 4.71</p>

<p>GPA 10th-12th (unweighted): 4.0
GPA 10th- 12th (weighted): 4.89
Yes our school has two GPA systems</p>

<p>Class Rank:
9 - 12: 5 out of 566
10-12: 3 out of 566</p>

<p>Sophomore Classes:
AP World Hist
AP Biology
Algebra Trig 3/4 Honors
English 10 Honors
French 102 (city college)
Engineering 1/ Computer Science 1 (non weighted ****!)
Math 138 (Pre-calculus at City college)</p>

<p>Junior year:
AP Computer Science A
AP English Language
AP Physics B
AP Calculus BC
AP Environmental Science
AP Macro and Micro Economics</p>

<p>SATII's: Bio/m:780 (I need two more which will be done in June), expecting 800 in Physics and 800 in Math II</p>

<p>SATI: CR: 750 Writing:720 Math: 790
SAT total: 2260 (scores not that great, hoping to score 2300+ in october :'( )</p>

<p>ACT: (unknown, but taking it in June as well) I am aiming for 36, but if I get 35, I am DEFINITELY doing SAT again in oct. Not to sound cocky or anything but I had two friends take ACT without studying at all and for the hell of it and both got 35's.</p>

<p>APs : Biology 5 World History 5 (I took 6 more APs this year, I am expecting all 5's in those too) AP Calcu BC, AP Physics B, AP Environmental sci, AP Macro econ and AP Micro Econ, and AP English Language.</p>

<p>Awards/ EC:
Westmont High School Math Competition:First place team for the Team Written Test in years 2008 and 2009. Overall team winner in 2009. Math Team member ftw!</p>

<p>California State Economics Challenge Championship (of 200 participating schools): First Place team in Adam Smith Division for state of California. It's an academic competition for economics, kinda like Science Bowl. Won some money :)</p>

<p>Economics Challenge West Regional (next level after state): Second Place Team for Adam Smith Division in the west region of the United States(out of 7 States). Highest written team score. If we had won, we would ahve gone to Nationals :'(</p>

<p>Capital Markets Contest (a state wide contest sponsored by the California Council on Economics Education)- ever team gives a presentation after six weeks of economic analysis. We got first place! and won $500 each and a trip to New York, where we will ring the bell at the Stock Exchange floor! :D </p>

<p>Kern County Regional Science Bowl: First place team out of 32 competing teams. First team to ever win out of Kern County. Our school had only participated two times total. It was an epic win. We then qualified for nationals. yes I love science</p>

<p>National Merit Semi-Finalist : got letter for possible eligibility in may (got 219 in california which qualified last year so hopefully next year too! ) Yea yea I know tons of people get it, but I am writing it down anyways.</p>

<p>National AP Scholar: (hopefully if I get mostly 5's which I think I will) yea everyone get that too.</p>

<p>National Science Bowl: Third Place on Team Challenge of Bromery Division. Year 2009 Alumni
We got killed, people at nationals are insaneeeee. But I am a proud alumni :)</p>

<p>Certificate of Merit (2006,2007,2008,2010): Piano thing, yes all Asians play piano, but at least I get a certificate for it :p</p>

<p>School of Modern Language Certificate of Excellence: awarded from Santa Barbara City College for performance in French Course 2008. not that great</p>

<p>Play on HS tennis team: Most Improved Player for years 2007 and 2008.</p>

<p>Student of the Dos Pueblos Engineering Academy: Part of the FIRST Robotics Team (only seniors)</p>

<p>President of a Sustainability Club. Treasurer for Math club. Vice President for Science Bowl Club. Vice President of Ping Pong Club (yes I know very asian). Vice president for Science Bowl Club.</p>

<p>I think I am gonna start a new club with friends next year for Science Olympiad. I am not really doing it for college, more just because I loved the competitions and science in general. </p>

<p>Over 250 hours of community service for Cottage Hospital. not a big deal</p>

2

<p>You must be smoking crack if you think you don’t have a chance. I know someone who got into Yale with a 2240 from the graduating class of 08. You actually have a much bigger chance than you think. Your SAT score, rank, and ECs are through the roof, haha.</p>

3

<p>You have a really good chance. A lot of other people have really good chances as well. Happy?</p>

4

<p>I just want constructive advice please.</p>

5

<p>no chance.
next…
EC’s list way too long
otherwise good</p>

6

<p>You are bound to get into one of these colleges. I am just wondering tho, what about your summers? What do you do during that time? and any job/internship/research experience?</p>

7

<p>All I am saying is that you must know you have a chance… unless you’ve never browsed CC… if you consider 250 hours of community service no big deal, you have a problem. (Just had to point that out). Anyway, you do have a good chance, although I don’t ever believe in “chances.” You either have a 100% “chance” of acceptance or a 0% “chance.” It just depends on the entire applicant pool and if you fit in to a college’s overall picture. If you apply to several top colleges, you are bound to get accepted to at least one , but nothing is guaranteed. Make sure to stress your nice lists of honors and awards as well as your community service. With strong essays and recommendations, top colleges will have an interest in you.</p>

<p>Good Luck!</p>

8

<p>Um, Mythbuster2000, 250+ is sorta a big deal, but the OP is right – it’s not going to dazzle them. I have 250 hrs from church activities and retirement home stuff.</p>

<p>Anyways, the OP… cut stuff from the resume… for example

If you don’t think it’s important, cut it out. </p>

<p>Why? Because you have very impressive ECs. You won a state-wide economics competition. You qualified for nationals in another. Your team seems to be fantastic.</p>

<p>About the SAT… if you were white, I might say to not retake, but you’re Asian. Unfortunately, it’s harder for Asians to get into those schools, and boosting that could almost seal the deal.</p>

<p>Chances?
Princeton: 35-45%
Harvard: 35%
Yale: 30%
Stanford: 50%
MIT: 25%</p>

<p>I really don’t know though, haha. My verdict: Apply to them all, because you have a fair chance at each.</p>

9

<p>“Princeton: 35-45%
Harvard: 35%
Yale: 30%
Stanford: 50%
MIT: 25%”</p>

<p>Those are somewhat scewed. Stanford is more selective than MIT and Princeton, yet you gave him a 50 percent chance.</p>

10

<p>wicked essays and recs. will be the tipping factor in your app., i believe.</p>

11

<p>Nice ecs and class rank. I think you have a legitimately good chance of getting into MIT and Stanford. On the case of Harvard, Princeton, and Yale the chances are a little less likely. (The only 2 kids that made it to Harvard in my school was an Asian kid that made a 2350 on the SAT, won 3rd in the Siemens Science competition and a African American female with a decent SAT and decent class rank, I don’t believe she was stellar though) Please Chance me too.</p>

12

<p>“Mythbuster2000, 250+ is sorta a big deal, but the OP is right – it’s not going to dazzle them. I have 250 hrs from church activities and retirement home stuff.”</p>

<p>The Ivy League likes community service… make sure to highlight it in your application, although you don’t have to put it as your main focus.</p>

13

<p>yes some of my EC’s are a bit long. But I did take time for them, and I don’t want my efforts to be left unknown. Like for my Certificate of merit, I had to memorize 6 piano pieces, as well as sight reading, theory tests, and ear training. SO to say that I shouldn’t include those would be bad. Cause I did put effort into them. </p>

<p>Score-wise, I agree. As an Asian I need higher scores to be competitive.</p>

<p>Summer-wise
before Sophomore year I took two City College courses for the weighted grades
I also took two more CC classes summer before junior year</p>

<p>My summer before Senior year, however, I am planning to intern either at a local company or at the local UC.</p>

14

<p>Class context, please. Namely:</p>

<p>1) How many Asians in your class will be applying to top schools, and where will they be applying? What is their profile?
2) For your target schools, what is your HS’s recent placement record? Asian or white students?
3) You are from CA. Describe your high school type:
a) The suburban refuge – Small public high school that is majority white, 10-20% Asian (best)
b) The white-flight school – Medium-sized, suburban public school that wealthy white students avoid, 25-40% Asian (bad)
c) The Asian magnet – Large, elite public high school that is majority Asian (worst)
d) The private mecca – Small to mid-sized private school that is majority white, 10-20% Asian (good)</p>

<p>Please be realistic, and understand that for any of these schools, your chances for admission as an unhooked Asian male are less than 10%, and probably closer to 3-4%.</p>

15

<p>Jameschen
here </p>

<p>1) my school is only 6% Asian. 29% Hispanic, 6% Asian, 2% African American, and 2% other.
2) What do u mean by placement? In terms of ranking, it is the best public school in our county (which is not much of a big deal). This year’s class we have two Princetons, one Johns Hopkins, Amherst, CalTech, and a Columbia jsut to name the ones off the top of my head.
3) You are from CA. Describe your high school type: It is a medium size public school. about 2200 students (550 in each class) SO I would say a) as the closest fit?
a) The suburban refuge – Small public high school that is majority white, 10-20% Asian (best)
b) The white-flight school – Medium-sized, suburban public school that wealthy white students avoid, 25-40% Asian (bad)
c) The Asian magnet – Large, elite public high school that is majority Asian (worst)
d) The private mecca – Small to mid-sized private school that is majority white, 10-20% Asian (good)</p>

16

<p>bump 10char</p>

17

<p>You are in good shape. Why? The suburban refuge HS provides you with the highest probability of success. Because:</p>

<p>1) Less competition - Your primary competition is the other Asian students. There are only a handful of Asian students, although presumably, many of them are at the top of the class. Still, its a better situation than at a school where 75% of the class are Asian (common in places like San Francisco, Fremont, Irvine, Cupertino, etc.) and a huge number of highly-qualified will be vying for a limited number of Ivy slots.</p>

<p>Remember, high school “diversity” (geographical) is a common Ivy-admissions criteria.</p>

<p>2) More white students - Having high-performing white students in your school provides Asian students with a benchmark standard for Ivy-level college admissions. If you attend the same classes as white students and are clearly outperforming them (with comparable ECs), it becomes difficult for the colleges to accept the white students while excluding the Asian ones. In Dan Golden’s “The Price of Admission” scribe, he calls this the “Frist effect”, although it was higher-performing white students at St. Albans getting pulled into Princeton along with slacker Will Frist (son of Sen. Bill Frist).</p>

<p>Your first point of class context should be with other Asians in your high school. Where were they accepted? Princeton? Columbia? Or were they the white, black or Hispanic students? If the accepted students were black or Hispanic, then that is a largely irrelevant point of comparison.</p>

<p>Bottom line: Your main competition is with other Asian students, then with white students to a lesser extent (they may actually help your case–“Frist effect”). You don’t compete with blacks or Hispanics at all.</p>

18

<p>I still need to emphasize that your probability of acceptance at any of the upper-band of elite schools is in the single digits. You’ll need to look at the middle band of elite schools (Penn, Cornell, Northwestern, Amherst, etc.) if you want a more realistic shot at getting accepted. Also consider that apply ED/EA to these top schools will only increase your chances to the low double digits at best. EA/ED to a Penn or Cornell would be a much better bet.</p>

<p>Except for the Asian superstars (all-world math students, for example), I rarely see Asian students run the table at the HYPSM/Cal Tech level. It’s more likely that top Asian students (and even many top white students) get accepted by only one upper-band elite school, or two if they are lucky.</p>

<p>All the best to you during your college search!</p>

19

<p>I’d say he has higher than single digit chances.</p>

20

<p>Do the math.</p>

<p>All upper-top tier colleges (HYPSM) now have overall acceptance rates between 7-10%. “Hooked” applicants (alumni, athletes, URM and sometimes women) comprise anywhere between 20-40% of the applicant pool and have acceptance rates AT LEAST DOUBLE that of the “unhooked” pool.</p>

<p>Conclusion: “Unhooked” applicants like OP have acceptance rates well below the overall acceptance rates.</p>

<p>Bottom line: “Unhooked” applicants need to have academic/EC profiles in the top 25% of overall applicant pool to have a decent shot at acceptance.</p>