I am high school student planning to apply ED1 at Emory next year. SAT1=1400, GPA (uw)=3.6, +150 hours of volunteering, debate team captain, math team, band major, etc. What are my chances?
@Rama_ninja : What is in the “etc” (as in describe some more ECs. Win any prizes/awards?). Is your school tough? Is an UW GPA of 3.6 normal for top performing students there (most schools are fairly easy or at least have lots of grade inflation, so things below 3.7-3.75 UW are rare for someone in say, the top quartile at many/most schools today)? Any hooks? Does your school send many people to Emory with your stats that are unhooked, or does it send many at all? What is your state of residence/school?
Also, what about APs (course rigor). Which ones have you taken and how did you do on them?
I dislike chancing, because there is no telling, but more information would be useful to at least tell you what you should focus on or how you may stand.
What I meant etc. is "I have 2 internships lined up this summer. First one is in a Biotech company in Boston (1 week) and the other one is in a MA general hospital (2 weeks). I will be taking 3 subject SAT’s (Bio, Cal, and Chem).
My school has tough grading system. I go to private school. They offer 4 levels of classes. I took all honors classes which is level 2. My school reports only UW GPA for all levels. I am in top 20%. Additionally, I will have total 4 AP’s (Bio, Chem, Pre Cal and Psyco) by the time I will be done with my senior year. My school is in Massachusetts but my I leave in Rhode Island. I looked at my school database for past applicants to Emory. Only 6 students applied to Emory from my schools in last 3 years out of which 2 were accepted.
@Rama_ninja : The etc. matters because those internships are perhaps more interesting (except the hospital thing. Unfortunately this is a stereotype among Emory applicants considering the sciences or pre-med) than the things you listed. Those things you listed before the “etc” are things so common among anyone applying to a remotely selective school, so are not likely to be so helpful/provide an edge for somewhere like Emory unless your involvement in them resulted in an award or something.
Also, what is AP “pre-Calc”(did you mean calc. AB/BC)? I have never heard of it. Even if it exists, it will not help, because places like Emory cannot grant credit for it (Emory does not offer a pre-calculus course on the Atlanta campus). By SAT 2 “Cal” do you mean SAT math 2? You need to do decently on those exams as your course rigor likely will not help you unless your school offers very little APs.
I would have to say that your chances are more of a “maybe”. It really depends on how you compare to those 2 folks admitted (somewhere like Boston and that general area is a tough market because it sends very strong students). Most admits I’ve seen, even in ED round (ideally you want to be as close to a solid RD candidate as possible to be honest) have much more course rigor, perhaps a higher SAT, and maybe a more robust EC profile. I recommend writing essays extremely well and trying to identify a current passion that can be sold to the admissions committee through them.
Thx.This is great help.
@Rama_ninja Emory admissions seems to like very accomplished debaters, as in debaters who’ve won national recognition.
Is there any way to extend your internships by volunteering once the paid portion of your internship ends? They seem very short and it’s unlikely you’ll accomplish or learn much in 1 or 2 weeks.
Emory’s most recent admitted class averaged a 1500 on the SAT.
These internships are not paid internships. I️ will try to extend 2 weeks internship if they allow. I️t is very hard to find internships.
@BiffBrown That’s the median, not the mean. They always shift their scores, too. Look at their CDS. Regardless, a 1400 SAT is only the low side for Emory. Their GPA is way below the average, as well. It was a 3.76 UW average for 2017-2018. I am not chancing, because I am not qualified, lol. I would go with @bernie12’s advice. Check Naviance, and you can see where you place on the scattergram.
@ab2002 : Be careful! A CDS DOES NOT reflect admitted student stats. That reflects matriculates which can be very different. That cohort was pretty close between admits and matriculates (usually, schools shift significantly downward, but this was on the old SAT. Some schools, primarily the ones that stats whored before and admitted at around 1475-1500 for bottom quartile last cycle actually still saw substantial downward shifts of matriculates versus admitted. For some reason, several other schools, including Emory did not see such shifts and most of the schools not initially known for stats whoring shifted quite a bit upward on their score ranges in the last cycle while it looks like stats. whoring schools remained stagnant. My guess is that there are more super high scores out of 1600 on the new ones so so they are more evenly distributed across elites, even those who do not overly focus on scores. May also be that certain “types” of students/learners benefitted from the new SAT, and more of those types attend certain elite schools versus others).
Also, a median is much more useful than a mean statistically (in this context) because it gives information about the distribution of scores whereas a mean provides much less information about that. For example if a mean is 1450 and a median 1500 (this gap is unlikely, but maybe like 1465-1485 vs. 1500 seems reasonable), that simply says that there are some “very low” (relative to general student body) scores at the bottom. However, if the median is 1500, I definitely wouldn’t want to be significantly below that if I didn’t have some flashy ECs or talents that are fairly high level even for an elite. The top quartile of admits started at 1490 for class of 2021. Now the median was 1500, which is a strange shift that may reflect fortune in recruiting this past cycle or a change of philosophy (maybe wanting to game the ranks a little. Every other school has been doing it for a long time now, I guess Emory is trying a softcore version of it). Scores on the SAT at top schools are likely to converge with this new exam. Differences will be seen in ACT ranges…and the ACT is alright, I guess.
They can admit all the 1500+ kids they want. It doesn’t mean they will yield a great percentage of those. For that reason, it makes more sense to look at stats of matriculating students and those stats aren’t out yet.
@ljberkow : but yield doesn’t matter as the student must first gain admission (It doesn’t matter if the median and above yields in super high numbers after the fact. What does matters is that they are clearly admitting less below I certain threshold, so it gets harder for certain students within ranges that were more likely to be admitted in previous classes. See what I am saying). That is the only reason I say pay attention to admitted stats. In addition, if the trend continues with Emory yielding roughly the same students it admitted or slightly better like last cycle, admitted students is a representation. If you want to know who ultimately ends up going, CDS is fine, but students applying must be competitive against the students that Emory is AIMING for. Again, 1500 being 50 percentile versus 75th percentile is a substantial shift within in a single cycle. It could possibly mean that those at 1400 and slightly below could be closer to the bottom quartile of admits than the middle of the pack. I would give the same advice if they had a 1500, but being at 1400 given this recent cycle means they need to continue performing well and definitely needs to sell themselves in essays perhaps more than those near, at, or above that median.
@bernie12 , I don’t understand how stats compiled by applicants mostly in a RD pool, impact chance on an ED1 round. It’s a separate process and stats for admitted students for all colleges in RD pools are going up as kids are now applying to more and more schools due to the relative ease of application processes. Kids don’t think twice about applying to 12-20 schools anymore. It’s almost second nature. Stats are getting skewed and it’s a good reason why colleges put increasing value on their ED1 pools. It’s even more than that These kids are motivated to attend Emory and that also helps build a stronger class. Emory was even more competitive at ED1 levels last year with admit rates dropping to 31%. It will drop even more for the next class. Who knows? That’s why it’s ridiculously difficult to chance these kids.
@ljberkow : I would maybe subtract about 50 from RD to get ED. As separate as it is, I doubt it would shift 100 points. To be safe, it may be better to be at 1450 than 1400 (and certainly be safer to be in the past year’s RD middle range) especially if ECs are more “standard” (I am also taking the OP’s profile into account) as often even ED candidates may have certain “signatures” that may heavily associate with Emory’s strengths (maybe they write really well, were great at debate/things like model UN, did research in the area of interest, something). As different as they are, if the overall pool including ED has an increasing trend (and ED itself may very well have it. Remember that they seemed to perhaps be little more picky this past cycle perhaps because they could), I would go in anticipating a replication of the past cycle or further increases. It looks like the days of Emory’s super stats conservatism versus peers are over.
Also, if one does want to assume that matriculate data at Emory will reflect admit data somewhat better than it did in the past, then it still looks not so great if you consider 45-50% of the class is half ED(again, usually it isn’t as useful because matriculate data is notably lower than admit data and this may reflect inability to get the higher end of ED. A freeze in this trend may reflect that ED vs. RD are more similar stats wise as of the fall 2017 incoming class).
Also, we just know that at most schools, it may help significantly if you are far above any median. Even if there was a huge differential between ED and RD, I bet looking like the RD candidate in an ED1 pool both stats and EC wise probably helps far more than it hurts.
These were the stats for class that began last fall, Class of 2021:
Admitted First-Year Class (25th – 75th percentile)
Average GPA: 3.75 - 3.98 (unweighted)
SAT Evidence-Based Reading and Writing: 670-740
SAT Math: 680-770
SAT total: 1360-1490
ACT: 31-34
It will be interesting to see what the stats of the Class of 2022 look like, but I find it hard to believe that the ED admits of the Class of 2022 are above the 75% of the Class of 2021. As such, I don’t believe the 1400 score of the OP is problematic. It may not have the same juice it had for 2021 or 2022 classes, but we’ll see by how much.
I don’t think you can draw conclusions until you see the stats for the Class of 2022. With zero use of the waitlist, it does look as if Emory can get more competitive in the admissions process.
Interesting that Emory likes Speech & debate. I am a rising senior with the following stats:
- 3.77 unweighted, 4.17 weighted.
- 35 ACT one sitting (was supposed to be a 'practice" test, but I don’t think I will re-take) 33 Math 35 in Science, English, and Reading
= AP Eng Lang, AP US Hist, and AP Chem (scores aren’t out yet likely 5 in Eng and Hist, hoping for 4 in Chem) taking AP Bio, AP world, AP Eng Lit, AP Calc AB, and AP Gov in sr year.
- All EC eggs kind of in one basket with Speech & Debate. Leadership team as a Jr, Captain as a Sr. Several speech tournament wins, qualification to National tournament of champions in extemporaneous speech, representing State in "World Schools Debate" at the NSDA National Championships. Lots of time spent traveling to tournaments on weekends, prep for events, speech summer camps, and coaching and mentoring younger HS and MS kids in speech. It is sometimes like a full time job. GPA is likely lower due to issues with time management with speech and school work in freshman part of soph year.
- Also play Sax and was Band Lead for schools contemporary music ensemble as a sophomore, but could not continue in that course due to AP courses and other requirements. Still take lessons and play in small jazz group.
- Worked at restaurant last summer and during breaks through early 2018.
- Internship with US Congressman this summer in down time around speech & debate nationals and speech camp.
Other hook is that mother went to Law school at Emory, but she is not too connected to alumni network. Should I reach out to the debate coach with interest? Does that help?
Can I get in, any chance for Merit $$ as full tuition would be tough.
.
Emory offers one or more full rides to incoming students who show great promise in debate as shown on this web page:
http://college.emory.edu/scholars/woodruff-scholarships/debate.html
In my view, contacting an Emory debate coach and showing genuine interest while making a good impression can only help.
Emory full rides are also available to others who show great promise in other ways including musically:
http://college.emory.edu/scholars/woodruff-scholarships/woodruff-scholarship.html
Note that the application deadline for an Emory full ride is different (much earlier - like around Nov 1st or earlier) than for regular applications.
Note also that Oxford College (a division of Emory U) has its own set of full ride scholarships and that you may apply to both Oxford College and Emory College. Applying to one or the other doesn’t automatically mean you’ve applied to the other unless you’ve so indicated on the application.
These scholarships programs are very selective.
This is how Emory’s merit based scholarship program worked in the LAST admissions cycle; note that deadlines, etc. may change from year to year:
https://apply.emory.edu/apply/scholar.php
I mentioned this on the concordance link but Emory’s SAT numbers may change substantially with the new table released this week. Emory states in their press release (where they only list average SAT) 1500 based on SAT and ACT equivalents.
With the old ACT/SAT concordance a 33 ACT was equivalent to a 1500 it’s now a 1450. So if Emory is using a 33 ACT average to get to 1500, you may see a correction downward if all those ACT takers now are factored in as 1450.
@Cavitee : That wouldn’t be surprising. If anything, I would expect Emory’s ACT to lag others, but that ACT is still higher than previous years. And yes, they did report about a 33 for ACT (32.7, something). The SAT is what it is. The interesting thing I notice is that Emory apparently usually yields a student body more evenly split between those who used their SAT for evaluation versus ACT. Seems like some of the more stats sensitive schools (outside of HYPM of course) may have a bias towards the ACT and cherrypick a smaller % of those with super high SATs. I don’t get these biases and don’t know know if they are intentional. I remember being younger in HS and constantly hearing that many found the ACT easier than the SAT. I don’t know enough to understand how they would feel this way or what it is about that exam that would make them feel more comfortable and I don’t know how different the new SAT is such that there could be a comparison drawn.
Either way, I think for Emory, it is the SAT that is surprising. They were relatively non-stats sensitive compared to peers and near peers before (like Stanford for example), and a number like that indicates that they have slightly changed the philosophy there or had a surprisingly strong applicant pool. To me, the SAT ranges at these schools are already so high. Unless their coursework is easy and remains that way (or students at some highly selective schools prefer majors/tracks known to have simpler courses whose average grade may correlate with even subtle changes in already high SATs…basically a joke.
Apparently a few schools do have a very high proportion in majors that are considered fairly easy by most of the student body so let the grade inflation wave continue unabated!), I just don’t expect performance to change much with these increases, even if they were on the old SAT. This is just sort of showboating for USNWR and other publications that like to see paper based statistical perfection IMHO.
*Interesting, I noticed that last cycle, the traditionally super stats sensitive (these were those who were already admitting bottom quartiles for RD close to 1500 in hopes of ensuring that when the smoke cleared and matriculates came, their bottom quartile would remain at least in the low 1400s) schools outside of HYPM seemed not to benefit as much from the new SAT as did Emory and some other schools who either were not ultra stats sensitive or who recently became so. In fact, seems some of their score ranges decreased a little. I am sure they tried to correct that this year by admitting pretty damned high.
The most surprising thing about the Class of 2022 was the interest in Emory in the application cycle.
Applications were up over 15%. That factor alone makes it more competitive, but nobody right now understands how this translates into statistics for the enrolled Class of 2022 or whether it signifies a trend. For the most part, I agree with @bernie12 and that Emory is small enough to get to know each kid it admits and look to admit and enroll quality individuals who want to learn as opposed to those who compile statistics and extra curricular hours. If the stats of those quality individuals go up, even better.
College of Choice: Emory College
Decision Plan: ED2
Major(s) of Interest: Biology
Location: Midwest
Gender: Female
Race/Ethnicity: Indian
Recruited Athlete, or Legacy: N/A
GPA: UW: 3.65, W: 4.24
AP or IB:
AP Euro – 4
AP Calc BC – 5
AP Stats – 5
AP Computer Science Principles – 5
AP Comp Sci A – 4
AP Biology – 4
(took physics and APUSH too but not sending those scores)
Class Rank: N/A
Test Scores: SAT: 1550, ACT: 34, SAT II: 800 Math 2
Extra Curricular, Community Service, or Co-Curricular(s): President and Vice President of two science clubs, volunteer at hospital and nursing home, karate, Indian classical dance, HOSA Top Ten Nationals Finalist, Best Buddies (club helping kids with disabilities), shadowed doctor ~ 30 hours
I know my gpa is on the lower side… it’s mostly from my second year when I got a lot of Bs and a C in AP Euro that I’m scared about. Junior year was also some Bs. Getting into Emory would be an absolute dream for me.