Looking for my son to take Chemistry for Engineer class over the summer session when he is home in NYC. Are there universities that offer this in the NYC and Long Island Area? I do see a class at NYU. Any others?
Have you checked the CUNYs and Stony Brook? Or community colleges?
Check with whatever college he attends now to make sure that it is accepted for the desired subject credit.
You should find out what your son’s current college will accept for transfer credit. At least at every university I have seen, chemistry for engineers is just chemistry.
And some colleges may not accept any outside credit if he is looking to go into chemical engineering. Other engineering specialties at the same school may well be able to use outside chemistry credit.
I was a chemistry major (eons ago at a top ten for it school then and now). There is no general chemistry for engineers- they take the same courses as others in sciences. It is only when they do advanced engineering level classes that their path deviates from those of the chemistry major. He (not you- he’s the adult taking the course) needs to check on whether the credits will transfer as stated above. Not all chemistry courses are the same. Depending on his U he may or may not get the same background as those who take it at his school. I would have thought he would have taken the general chemistry as a college freshman. It would be a 4 or 5 credit course with labs- a full schedule as a summer class.
As one who went through engineering school, albeit eons ago, i agree with wis75. We took regular chem.
Not all colleges have the engineers take regular chemistry. At Cornell, there is a separate Chemistry course for the engineers, and only the engineers are allowed to take it (and all have to take it). I don’t know what the difference is between that course and the regular one.
M D is ChemE major, and even that, she only needs General Chem, Orgo I and II while the Gen Chem was fufilled by AP credit. There is no special chemistry for engineering except for her ChemE major causes.
@patatty “At Cornell, there is a separate Chemistry course for the engineers, and only the engineers are allowed to take it (and all have to take it). I don’t know what the difference is between that course and the regular one.”
I would bet that they don’t want premed dropping out because they can’t keep up with the engineers.
If the university offers multiple levels of general chemistry, it would be better to take the most challenging one (though honors chemistry is probably not needed). If your son in planning on Chemical Engineering, he would need to take the version of organic chemistry that the chem majors take, and not the one that is mainly for pre-meds. Presumably he is not going to take physical chemistry over the summer, but if he is, he would again want to take the version for chem majors, and not “baby p chem.”
Thank you. I got the course syllabus from my son’s college so I know what to look for. They said if I provide the course syllabus to their Chemistry department, they will take a look at it and approve it for transfer credits. He is an Aerospace Engineering major.
re #6: That is a change from when I attended Cornell.
When I attended, engineers took Chem 207. Which was the same course that most science-oriented students in the other colleges of the university also took. Although there was a higher-level intro Chemistry course (215), mostly for the best-prepared prospective chemistry majors and probably some brave premeds and engineers, also offered in CAS. I don’t believe our sections were exclusively engineers, I think everyone was comingled. But honestly I don’t remember. But in any event it was the same exact course. And it was listed as a CAS course, and taught by CAS faculty.
If they have since carved that course out and put it in the engineering college it is probably NOT to spare premeds because engineers were screwing up the curve. Because the other science-oriented students in the university, including its premeds, are themselves nobody’s fool. As many engineers who presumed their superiority came to learn the hard way.
It is probably due to internal politics, motivated by transfer of funds between COE and CAS. COE would probably rather keep the money for itself than transfer it to CAS. Is my guess. They did that with sophomore math when I attended, taught by engineering “Theoretical and Applied Mechanics” staff instead of CAS staff. I imagine that at some prior point CAS math department faculty taught those, or similar enough, courses.
There may have been some content changes if the engineering faculty is teaching the intro chemistry class, but the extent is probably very minor, is my guess.
I imagine they would accept for transfer credit any normal intro credit course taken elsewhere. Whether or not it was taken at an engineering college, or titled “for engineers”. After all, they accept external transfer students who did not take that exact class. It can’t matter that much, it’s just an intro class.
Timed out:
But that’s just my guess. The content could be different.
Looking at Cornell’s website, they do have separate courses now – 2070 for premeds, 2090 for engineers, and a lower level intro for non science/tech types. They sound similar, and you can get transfer credit for either 2070 or 2090 with a 5 on AP Chem, but not necessarily with a “Chemistry for Engineers” class at unknown college. I agree with some of the other posters that as a general rule, engineers don’t need a special chemistry for engineers class and have a similar if not better chance of getting transfer credit for a standard General Chemistry I type class. However, if you plan on attending a particular college, I’d suggest reviewing the transfer details and chem sequence at that college.
re post #10. You may be the one doing the work but you are NOT the one who is interfacing with the school. That is the job of the adult student. This isn’t high school. You also have clarified your son’s major- it is NOT Chem E!
I suspect having a separate general chemistry course for engineers would be to emphasize problem solving skills over theory. I suspect Cornell has a course for Chemistry majors as well (since it is one of the top ten for it). I know UW (Madison) has several choices for chemistry as well. Honors calculus at UW is theory based compared to the problem based regular version (both with more content than the watered down AP version). In the STEM fields there will likely be versions most appropriate to different goals.
I wonder why he would try to take chemistry at a different school during the summer. The only reason I can think of is that he got behind with his current college classes (no reason to take it before being a college freshman). Summer school classes at a different college are good for meeting breadth requirements, not as good for meeting core classes in the major requirements. Subsequent classes will presume knowledge obtained in the school’s version of the subject. A change in major may necessitate an extra semester. HE needs to check with his school’s engineering department for his major for content expected in the course.
I sure hope it is his idea, not yours, that he spends his summer intensely studying in a required class for his major. Remember, things tend to go at double speed in a summer course. I know we insisted kid take classes at the local U one summer because he couldn’t find a summer job (not yet 18) and needed something to do to avoid boredom. Got his biological sciences breadth requirement credits out of the way.
@wis75 “I wonder why he would try to take chemistry at a different school during the summer.”
Things to know about engineering majors in ABET programs:
- Most freshman engineering majors switch out or drop.
- Few of the successful students graduate in 4 years. Having to retake even a couple of course can cause an extra semester.
- If you do graduate in 4 years, adding a minor or even a few courses of interest is difficult.
It is smart for many freshman engineering to take a class or two in the summer, if they want to be done in 4 years and have even a little flexibility. My freshman had credit for two AP 5’s and took two more summer courses. Now she is able to add a polymer science minor to her material science major.
“At least at every university I have seen, chemistry for engineers is just chemistry.”
It is different at some engineering universities. At Lake Jr.'s engineering school, General Chemistry 1 and 2 were the same, but the chemistry labs were engineering specific, as was the single lab requirement for Organic Chemistry 1 and 2. Many engineering schools do not require Orgo 2.
As for CUNY campuses, the various chemistry departments are generally pretty good; some of them are excellent. Lehman College, for example has a rigorous Chemistry Department. The child of a friend satisfied the Orgo 1 and Orgo 2 requirement at Lehman and the kid said it was no joke. The summer professors were not adjuncts either. The best part was that the tuition was a bargain.
Most ABET accredited engineering majors don’t require any chemistry more advanced than a General Chemistry 1 type class… An exception is Chemical Engineering, which typically requires more advanced chemistry classes, although I haven’t heard of a chemical engineering major or other engineering major that requires Organic Chemistry 2.
D is a Chem E at Purdue. They require 2 semesters of Orgo, P Chem and Bio Chem.
Programs differ in requirements, courses and quality. Purdue is highly ranked, some of the others average.