<p>We are regrouping here... D is in a production, school and work, so we can't even plan new directions yet. If people really wanna know what's happening (and we do have some possibilities, thanks to so many of you) I will report at a later date! </p>
<p>(Even if you don't want to know, I will report at a later date!!) :)</p>
<p>cktsing - Another thought which we are entertaining - home equity line of credit. If your property is that valuable think about it. There is no perfect solution and you can bet my husband didn't anticipate this kind of expense. We did save - enough for the first year for each - but thats it. Look at all your options before saying no. Parent Plus loans are out there, plus student loans.....there are many options as long as she is willing to share the burden.</p>
<p>For all those who are soooo sad about their CMU rejection letters: CMU runs a subscription season of plays/musicals. We subscribe. This year, one of the shows was cancelled, for a good reason, that is, the director they were bringing in got a better gig or longer gig on Broadway or something like that. It was not replaced by another show. It was not kept and directed by another director. Patrons were offered money off their season subscriptions for next year, or, you could do this or that to get your money back. What about the students who were cast? I guess they didn't get their training opportunity. So, CMU may not be perfect. Hope this helps.</p>
<p>khsstitches, I am no financial expert, but have a hobby involving listening to a financial advice program on the radio and have heard it said that it is a mistake to stake your home or your retirement savings to finance college.</p>
<p>I have to agree with NMR about avoiding if possible the home equity approach -- particularly a line of credit that can change. If you go the route of home equity, consider a second mortgage with a locked in rate, not something that can go up. Until recently, the lines of credit rates were soaring. Interest rates are somewhat lower now -- if you have a good credit rating. </p>
<p>As far as loans, here are a couple of general things I have learned after making a mistake of co-signing for a close relative. Much of what I have since learned about the subject was from the Suze Orman show, which I heartily recommend (or her website).
1. learn the difference between federally subsidized loans (stafford loans) and those that are not (private loans). In both cases, no payment is due until after college -- the big difference here is that the kind of loan you want does not even accru interest. You do not want to start out with a $10,000 loan, for example, and have it already be a $12,000 loan by graduation. This is as bad as a credit card -- interest on top of interest. </p>
<ol>
<li><p>look for the best interest rate.</p></li>
<li><p>make sure there are no prepayment penalties. That way if one of your loans is say 6 percent and you can now get one for 4 percent, you can pay off the 6 percent one early. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>MOST IMPORTANT ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS of a lot of different people. There have been allegations here in NY by the state attorney general that some school finance offices are getting "commissions" off of loans, therefore are not necessarily tellling parents what is best.</p>
<p>To all those that did not get into the school of their dreams, take heart in the following note I found from a jaded musical theater veteran when a dad of a 13 year old was asking how he could get a good scholarship for his daughter in musical theater. Not sure what an Equity Card is - but it doesn't sound like a fun process. </p>
<hr>
<p>Answer
Hello, Ron </p>
<p>Thank you for the question. Put this reply in a box somewhere and bring it out again in two years.</p>
<p>You should be in dialogue with the counselors at your daughter's school. As a Theatre Arts graduate, I know that I attended the very best university on the west coast for Theatre Arts at the time I was there. I'm not so sure I would make the same choice now. Today, depending on all my interests (both dramatically and musically, i.e., pop/standard or classical, etc.) I would be aiming for NYU or Julliard.</p>
<p>What you need to understand is that Musical Theatre is one of THE lowest paying jobs in all the Performing Arts that is, if the wannabe performer can endure the process of earning their Equity Card to qualify for an audition in the first place and then be the right "type" for whatever role and compete against hundreds of other auditionees all answering the same physical description and with similar or better qualifications. If your daughter is to have the remotest chance of eking out a living in this field, then see to it she is a championship dancer by her Junior Year, that she can read music and play enough piano to learn her own roles, is no less than 5' 8", looks like Miss America and could be a Sports Illustrated Centerfold. If all that is happening, then every newspaper in town will have written about her, the high school will be scrambling for full scholarships, and the best conservatories in the country will be clamoring for her. If not, then be prepared to pay her bills for a long, long time while she stands outside the NYC Equity Office at 5 AM rain or shine, snow or more snow.</p>
<p>And that is the Truth.</p>
<p>About the Parent Plus Loan - Can someone that has one tell me when payments start on these type of loans? Also does the interest accrue - when I checked the rate was 8+ % which is pretty high. Just trying to figure out how to pay for NYU if that is the final choice.
Thanks so much!</p>
<p>Karentic,</p>
<p>I don't get it. I don't see how that negative, bitter, but probably contains some truth, note has anything to do with making one feel better about not getting into the school of your dreams.</p>
<p>Karentic - actually that "veteran" was only referencing one specific type, in no way does it represent the norm in the industry. While I agree that yeah MT is the lowest paying job and getting an equity card can be a nightmare. Women in the industry do not all fall into the ideal chorus girl type that he was talking about there! </p>
<p>I guess you were correct in saying that the person was jaded because I have friends in the industry and none of them think this way.</p>
<p>I do have to say that I am 5'10" and a female, and being that height in this business has in NO WAY helped me in snagging roles. In may ways it has actually PREVENTED me from doing so. Us tall girls do not have it as easy as one thinks, the only time I will admit it IS beneficial is in a dance call. But other than that, it is not the easiest thing to sell... more short boys in this business than you'd think ;)</p>
<p>No offense, Karentiec, that letter may be amusing to some, I guess, but I don't think it has much basis in reality. Worse, it's discouraging. I've seen a number of Broadway and other professional musicals and plays in my time, and few of the performers fit the description offered above. Yet there they are, on stage, doing what they love and making audiences happy.</p>
<p>No doubt that there is some truth in what he said, certainly not everything but his point is that it is harder than most of our children realize. I know that they have all heard it as we have hopefully mentioned this aspect of the profession. I think when you are actually standing in a line of hundreds of other high school/college stars in the cold the reality of the numbers alone will set in. I would love to here from people who are doing this for a living or attempting to.</p>
<p>MTDad777, you are so right: the challenge ahead of our kids becomes startlingly evident when you attend any of these college auditions, and see hundreds of beautiful, talented kids all competing for the same few spots. I am still befuddled as to how the auditors can choose between so many bright lights.</p>
<p>
[quote]
but his point is that it is harder than most of our children realize. I know that they have all heard it as we have hopefully mentioned this aspect of the profession. I think when you are actually standing in a line of hundreds of other high school/college stars in the cold the reality of the numbers alone will set in.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You are absolutely right, mtdad, most kids (and parents!) do not realize how difficult it is to earn a sustained living in this business. The reality of the numbers often sets in while at college auditions but that's just the beginning. When you think that last year, and the year before that, and next year and the year after that, there were, and will be, similar numbers, ad infinitum, all of whom will also be looking for work, the numbers are even more daunting. This is why there is a 95% unemployment rate at any given time for Equity actors, which doesn't include the thousands of non-Equity actors who are also trying to book work. </p>
<p>Are some actors able to earn a living without family assistance or taking more traditional jobs or living with roommates or being financially supported by a significant other? Very few, especially if they're in NYC. Even if they are fortunate enough to be cast in a national tour or a Broadway show, which most never will, the jobs are never permanent in the way that a 'regular' job is. Once a job ends, so do your benefits, which means no health insurance, and this is for Equity actors. Non-Equity actors are on their own for that. Looking at the 2006-2007 Broadway season, for example, 39 shows opened, five of which are still running. The remainder closed within that same season, some limited runs, many financial flops.</p>
<p>Now, does this mean that kids shouldn't follow their dreams? Absolutely not, but they, and their families, should go into this process with their eyes wide open to the possibility that they likely will never be able to earn a living onstage. This isn't to say that there aren't other opportunities out there, e.g., teaching, tech work, theatre admin., etc. Most kids aren't thinking along those lines when they're at the beginning of this process. They're envisioning themselves as the next Elphaba or Melchior or Mimi or Elle or Roxie or Danny or Link or Christine or maybe even Mama Rose! :) Nothing wrong with any of that, as long as they are realistic about the future and about how this business works. Discouraging? Perhaps, but realistic.</p>
<p>A friend who is a working actress said she is always up against the same handful of actresses at auditions in New York...her "type." </p>
<p>The thing I try to drive home with my D, and I think she's heard me, is that Broadway is like baseball's All Star game. Many kids in Little League have dreams about playing professional baseball, and some do get there, but an even smaller group make it to the All Star game. The chances of getting to Broadway are indeed slim, and the financial rewards short-lived for all but a few. (Everytime I passed the cast list for The Producers, I saw the name "Eric Gunhus." People came and went from that show, but he stayed for all 6 years. It might have been boring, but it was steady!)</p>
<p>I just want my D to do what she loves somewhere. There are several actors in Philadelphia who have homes and families and normal lives, and they work locally all the time. That would be a fine life for my D.</p>
<p>Skwidjy...I would agree. Time and again, I read of applicants whose main goal is "Broadway" and while it is good to dream and have goals, I feel that is a very narrowly defined goal and not that realistic as few will be on Broadway. If they love MT, the goal might be better to perform on stage anywhere. And then an even more realistic goal would be to have a life working in theater in some capacity.</p>
<p>As in many conversations, one thing can lead to another and discussion goes off on a tangent. A member posted some questions about their child's Tisch studio assignment and others responded and a discussion ensued. I have moved the various posts about that discussion to the existing thread in the NYU/Tisch forum called "Studio Assignments."</p>
<p>Here is that thread and the posts from today are now there:
<a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/nyu-tisch-mt/484206-studio-assignments.html%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/nyu-tisch-mt/484206-studio-assignments.html</a></p>
<p>I think the thing that really doesn't help me get good singing roles is the fact that i'm 5'8'' and am in the slim slender category, but I have a BIG voice for such a little body. And alot of baritone roles I can sing...but most of those roles are for bigger guys who look like they have that kind of voice and that manly build.</p>
<p>Sorry guys...didn't mean to strike a negative chord with everyone. I just showed it to my D who was very depressed about not getting into a school that once you are even in that it may not really be the life you wanted anyway. She actually hated the audition process, but loves the performance part. I was trying to point out that getting to the performance part is not going to be like trying out for the high school musical, at least I don't think, but more like the process she just went through. But I really don't even know anything about the industry itself. </p>
<p>My point was more for kids that were making peace with the fact that they didn't get in and have to part ways with this career path now and move on to something else. That in the long run, that it is a good chance that they would make this decision at some point anyway whether they are 17 or 30. But for those that are in, I'm sure the next four years will be a blast, and you can deal with the reality stuff later. </p>
<p>I'll leave now....good luck to everyone!</p>
<p>karenteic -- Don't worry yourself about this! As for me, I realized you were just trying to throw something out there for those who would like to join the "take this major and shove it" route right now. It's only natural to go through those feelings of "I don't want this anyway" when the disappointment level has been unbearable. I'm sure you spoke for a whole bunch of people in their moment of frustration.</p>