<p>The issue with a home mortgage 2nd loan is that if you don't take out enough you may not be able to get more later or get any other kind of loan. With the line of credit you have a more flexible option. It is only 1 suggestion amongst many. Parent loans are one option, student loans another, LOC another....it is just one more option in the pool. It worked perfectly for my brother and is one more suggestion she can look into. Not saying its the only way to go.</p>
<p>With regard to loans, I guess it boils down to it still requires repayment. With Emerson we would need to borrow at least $120,000 for the 4 years. At 8% over 10 years, that would cost about $1460/ month, with a total loan cost of $175,000. If we spread it out over 20 years, it drops to $1000/month with a total loan cost of $240,000, but we will be over 70 by the time it is payed off. </p>
<p>That is crazy- it puts the burden of caring for us when we are older totally on our children. Our daughter could take out the loan but that is a huge burden to put on a graduate- and let's be realistic- theater is not a stable or lucrative profession. We also have one more to get thru college and it is not fair to him.</p>
<p>We feel we have to look at the payback period for such a loan: is our D going to make enough when she graduates in MT to warrant such an expenditure for college. As talented as we think she is, the answer is very probably no. As much as she would love to go to Emerson, she could be just as successful at a school of lesser cost. I am involved in costuming of professional theater and am around actors enough to see that the really good ones probably would have made it no matter where they went, and many who are successful went to inexpensive state schools.</p>
<p>Thank you for all of the suggestions everyone. Our D applied to these schools hping for a big scholarship but is being pretty realistic about the whole thing. She will make it work!!! Se has looked at UCLA and UCI but wasn't happy w/either program - she thinks (right or wrong) that good theater schools need to be on the east coast. Good luck to everyone in finding their niche in this whole business!</p>
<p>karen - I sent the "letter to Ron" to my D. I always value insight from people actually in the business. Without picking apart his vision of the person who in his opinion will make it (ie: height) basically he is saying what I think everyone already knows...the odds are low on employment. That is reality. The image of being a waiter or odd jobs and constant auditions waiting for that break. Which would probably include several calls home for financial help on lean months. You can probably find people that finally got a break at age 40. I always think in any kind of artistic career endeavor you need to assign a period of time of how long you are going to give it - 5 yrs, 10 yrs - with a backup plan. My D's was to either go back to school and get a teaching credential to be a high school theatre teacher or go to law school. Unless she married and had children - then she wanted to be a writer. </p>
<p>In any case I think you need in this career path to set a time and have a worst case scenario back up plan. I also think it's important to examine the school and degree you are getting keeping in mind how attractive it will make you if you apply for graduate school. I know a girl that graduated Cap21 and now is in a graduate program at USC in a totally unrelated field.</p>
<p>I posted this on the Webster thread, but I thought I'd put it on this one too as you all have been so supportive.</p>
<p>D's last expected letter arrived today from Webster. The decision is a thanks but no thanks. So, that's that. </p>
<p>I feel so bad for my D. She was very sick for all her auditions and she knew her voice wasn't strong and that she didn't have that usual spark that makes you stand out. She had to replace her legit soprano song with a lower ballad and it wasn't contrasting enough with her uptempo. After so many years of working hard to have it come down to getting the flu, asthma and bronchittis during those precious weeks of auditions was frustrating. Unfortunately we didn't have the funds to reschedule and fly to the campuses for later audition dates. It was the LA unifieds or bust for us. :-( Let that be a warning to future auditioning students. Really spread out your auditions so that all your dates aren't in the danger zone of flu season if possible.</p>
<p>Oh well, at least we had a wonderful night in the theatre tonight. Closing night of "Grapes of Wrath" and D was Ma Joad. </p>
<p>Tomorrow we'll re group and help her figure out what's next.</p>
<p>Thank you everyone for your support. We'll be scouring the board for suggestions of where to go from here and what's the best route for her to take.</p>
<p>I wish the schools would post in their literature or awareness sessions, the acceptance rate for the MT program. I've come to know how competitive this major is, but if I knew that CMU was only accepting a handful of students, I would have saved the application fee and audition fee. It's like a licence to steal money and to my mind, academically dishonest. For a school to accept fees from 600-800 families, knowing that 6 - 12 of those will ultimately be admitted is immoral. If a school is up front about it (Otterbein for one), then you know what you are getting in for.</p>
<p>Sarasmom, i can empathize with you as my daughter also was sick for half of her auditions. Her auditions were late in the game (between mid-Jan and March) so there was no time to reschedule for a different date. It is incredibly high stakes and you simply want your kid to have the opportunity to "be their best." That doesn't happen when they're sick.</p>
<p>I think many of our sons and daughters have experienced rejection in this audition season, some much more than others. It has been a huge learning experience for me as a parent. The biggest lesson was for me has been that life throws you some curves and maybe helps your kids end up where they are meant to be. I would never have dreamed that my D would not have been offered a few MT programs but the rejections have helped her pick herself up and think about how bad she wants it and what she is willing to do to get the MT training she needs. The rejections leave you guessing why they arent acceptances. Was it a bad audition, wrong songs, wrong look, too short, too tall, too youthful, illness, too many brown eyed girls? I think for my D she is not one who has great auditioning skills and cant walk in and give the performance of a lifetime in 2 minutes. But that is my guess....On stage, she is at the top of her art. I have to think most of the parents who post on this forum have kids who have been on stage for years and who have invested thousands of dollars in their vocal and dance training and have stopped counting how many shows they have been in. We know they are ready for the next step. </p>
<pre><code> On the rejection side, my D got one MT offer (not at a school she can see herself at) but was accepted academically at 3 schools with 2 acting/theatre concentrations. In exploring possibilities of attending one of these universities I have been pleasantly surprised how much information we have been able to already obtain about re-auditioning, which classes to take, and that shows/choirs are open for anyone to audition for. This looks like a great route for my D to potentially be accepted into one of her favorite programs. As a result she will have to work a little harder, become more competitive, be a better auditioner, and yes, go through this again but hopefully she will get there. And it is also at a state university...YEAH!
One of the Tony acceptance speeches for Best Actress a few years back, one of the recipients said, It doesnt matter where you start, but where you end up. Wish I knew who to quote, but I think each of you who arent on the road you thought you would be on will find a different path and end up getting there.
</code></pre>
<p>Black Suits, in all due respect, I do not feel the colleges are being immoral or academically dishonest. As consumers and as applicants, it is our jobs to research every school and every program fully....online, asking current students and faculty and administrators, visiting, and so on. This information is available if you ask. Yale accepted approx. 8% this year. I find nothing immoral or dishonest about it. That is less than last year. When my kids have applied to colleges and grad schools, they gathered up this kind of information and knew what they were getting into and in fact, with very low acceptance rates, they geared their expectations accordingly. I have not found any schools to NOT be upfront about how many apply and how many are accepted, if you ask. For those who read CC, much of this information has been shared here as well. The acceptance rate at CMU for a BFA is about 2% (or slightly less).</p>
<p>Black suits- I know how you feel. My d. auditioned (walk-in) in Chicago for a “top tier” school. The audition fee was $50. Soon after we received a letter from that school stating that they enjoyed d.’s audition and “please send $60 to complete application and receive results from audition.” Several weeks later the no thanks arrives. If they knew she was a no-go, why take my $50 AND my $60? Nice little fund raiser for the school.</p>
<p>Black Suits,
I had to look at the total cost for the applications and audition fees and not get upset about what a particular school's fees were. One school offered comp tickets to a play and served everyone lunch (no audition fee) and another with an audition fee we paid $30 a ticket to see an opening night show which was a fundraiser for MT scholarships. Any way you look at it it was an expensive process.</p>
<p>With all due respect I do not think all the MT schools have been "upfront." As you noted, acceptance rate at CMU is 2% or less!! I'm sure I am not alone in having no clue that acceptance is that unlikely. You'd have a better chance of being hit by lightning or winning the lottery. I am not a college counselor, nor have I had older siblings go through this process. I also have come to CC rather recently. We knew that CMU, like the other "top tier" schools was competitive. We simply did not know that it had a 98% rejection rate - nor was that information shared at an awareness session we attended or in any literature we received from the school. It obviously was a "reach" school, but I would have liked to think that it was actually within the reach of more than 2% of those applying.</p>
<p>Angie and Sarasmom, I feel for you as parents because no parent wants to see their child disappointed. It is very difficult on a parent (more so than on the child, I think). Life is full of disappointments and certainly this BFA admissions process is wrought with disappointments for many. How a young person learns to deal with disappointments is important and a good lesson in life. All is NOT lost here. Their path may take a bend in the road but they just have to pick themselves up and look at the options. </p>
<p>Before looking at options, I just want to mention that a good point was brought up here about Unifieds (hope junior parents are reading) and a big drawback if you only or mostlly do Unifieds is that all is riding on one weekend and you could be sick or you could run into travel/weather difficulties (particularly if in NYC or Chicago....not so much you sunny LA people!). A lot is on the line. By spreading out auditions on campus, or maybe some at Unifieds and some on campus, that will help. </p>
<p>Another point came up in a recent post about auditioning itself. One can be a good singer, actor or dancer but not that good at auditioning. I am not speaking of anyone's child here as I don't know them or what their difficulties were. But auditioning is a skill. The more you audition, the better you get at it. You have to know how to audition, and not just have skills in singing and acting and dancing. Your kids should try to audition as much as possible at theaters and also get some coaching on their audition skills and how they present their material and not just the technique itself. Also, some may get very nervous in an audition and so again, the more you have been in such situations, the more comfortable you are in them. </p>
<p>Back to options once one has been denied at BFA programs. For one thing, I hope such students ALSO applied to some BA schools (junior families....please listen and observe!). I have seen too many who ONLY apply to BFA schools which must be considered REACHES for ANYONE given the very low admit rates. There are many really fine BA schools for theater/acting and many that offer MT curricula or MT opportunities. I find that many kids have "BFA on the brain" as the only path. A BFA is a great way to pursue this field. But BA programs can also be. I think too many here think of a BA as a "back up" whereas I know many kids who have a BA as a FIRST choice even though they were admitted to top BFA programs or could have been. A BA is a good option. I hope your kids had some on their college list and can embrace this option now if they were admitted. At least one or two of the BAs on their college list should have been an academic safety. </p>
<p>Another option is to take a gap year and do a lot of training. I have seen others do this with success. This could be a wonderful year...perhaps training, being in regional theater, interning some place, etc. </p>
<p>Or a student could attend a school they got into with hopes of possibly transferring into a BFA the next year. Some have done this with success. </p>
<p>Examine all the possibilities. Even if a school was not a favorite choice initially, one needs to embrace it and give it a go. Hopefully, any school on one's list was one that the student liked enough to apply (nobody should apply to schools that they have no interest in attending). While the initial disappointment is understandable, often a student will be very happy at one of their safety schools once they get there. And if they aren't, they can transfer down the line. But many move on and things work out, just not as they had ideally wished originallly. So, once they get past the disappointment, hopefully they can embrace the options that they DO have which can often turn out very happily once they move on.</p>
<p>Black Suits...my point is that it may not be in the literature, but as an applicant and as a consumer, you only have to ask...."how many audition and how many are accepted and how may do you wish to yield." I have found that anyone can get that information. I even recall an administrator from Tisch coming on here to answer that question. I didn't get this information in any special way by being a college counselor. I was a parent whose child applied to 8 BFA programs. We asked if they didn't tell at an information session. They have Q and A at most of them. I communicated with other parents here, etc. As a college counselor, I am not privy to any special information of this sort. I just research things as I do as a parent. This is important information. One needs to understand acceptance rates in compiling their college lists in order to have a balanced list of odds. Again, I do not find any school to have been immoral or dishonest as you have stated. When asked, every school replied on our visits. Such information is shared here all the time between parents and students as well. Ask at the schools. Ask current students. This information is not a secret and they are not dishonest when you ask about it.</p>
<p>To this day, I distinctly recall sessions at places like Tisch, Penn State, Ithaca, Syracuse, BOCO, UMich, Emerson, CMU and others where this question of how many apply and how many do you accept came up.....they either told it outright or those in the audience asked.</p>
<p>I will add that I very much understand that you did not know this information and that now you have heard the admit rate at CMU, it is disconcerting and disillusioning. I do get it. My response, however, was to the assertion that schools are immoral and dishonest and I do not feel that they are because every single one has responded to questions about this information. My kid applied to 8 and we knew this information from our visits, other inquiries, or from others. But every school mentioned it at the sessions either upfront or it was a common question asked by those in the audience.</p>
<p>Officially rejected from my final school, Webster. I guess i'm going to join MT class of 2013 now</p>
<p>But I'm actually not very disappointed. Next year I'm going to work full-time, go super hardcore on my audition prep classes and hopefully save up enough money to pay for audition stuff (travel expenses, hotels, etc...) and maybe some extra money to go into college with. I'm only doing this because I technically have an extra year to play with, since I'm graduating high school early. And since I'm only 17 and competing with 18/19 year olds, I have 1 or 2 years less training than they do. I think this time around I'll be more confident at the auditions because I know how they work and what to/not to do. So some of you might be seeing me next year at the auditions :)</p>
<p>Freedom -- you are a very mature and wonderful young man. I think you have made an excellent decision and a year from now, I am confident you are going to be telling us some great news. Thank you very much for your honesty and for sharing your journey with all of us. Best of luck to you as you take your next steps on this journey.</p>
<p>freedom...I admire your attitude and tenacity. It is a very difficult process as you know too well and it is often wrought with great disappointments. But you have picked yourself up and have a plan and that is terrific. You will be wiser as you have learned more about the process and know what you need to do to be ready. I bet you are going to have an awesome year. I agree that since you are graduating a year early, that this even makes more sense as you can have this gap year and apply at the typical age with your peers next year. My D also graduated high school after junior year and was a little worried at times that she made it harder on herself to be admitted because she had one less year of training, as well as it is a known fact that colleges will scrutinize early graduates in admissions more than seniors. While she did get in, she knew this was a more difficult path to pursue in terms of the odds. So, you know it too. Now, you will be blessed with the gift of a year to concentrate on this in ways that are not even as possible as a high school student. I have faith in you and can't wait to hear more about your journey. Life is a journey and it takes twists and bends and how you weather these is a testament to your character. Your character impresses many adults here and there is something to be said for that. It will take you far.</p>
<p>Freedom, I was out of town yesterday so did not read your message about Webster until this morning and wanted to say how sorry I am that it did not work out, but (again!) how much I admire your maturity and tenacity. I think you could teach some of us parents how to handle "no's" gracefully and move on with good humor.</p>
<p>Freedom, I am "with" NMR on that you could certainly teach us parents how to handle things. I wish you much success this upcoming year. Please keep us updated on your quest as I know we have all come to "cyber adopt" you. I am sure great things are in your future :D!</p>
<p>To those who are dealing with disappointment, please try to remind yourselves that this is not the end, but merely a bump in the road, and your child is taking a different path than what was originally planned. I feel for you, I do, because I find seeing my D disappointed one the hardest things of parenting. On the other hand, I also have seen her bounce back, much faster than I do in fact. Hang in there, go out, have ice cream, lots of it, take a deep breath, review the options, and try highlight the positive within the negative (such and such college has a fantastic basketball team, choir etc. etc.). And remember, things will really turn out ok in the end.</p>