<p>Hi,
I've considered getting a bachelor's degree in business admin with emphasis in accounting and then become a cpa. I'm now having doubts because some ppl say it's boring, the test is hard to pass, very low salary and not enough personal/vacation time but instead long work hours and no benefits. is any of this true? can anyone who followed this path or know someone who has give feedback on this matter? if you are a cpa, how did your first years go and now too? satisfied?</p>
<p>Considering that the national average starting salary for undergrad accounting graduates is ~$45,000, I don't know who told you that the salary is very low. If you work for the big4 firms it's a trade off... you will work long hours, and have very little time to enjoy life, but you spend 2 years there and you will always have great jobs paying salaries upwards of $60K. As far as boring... it depends on which field you go into... CPA's work in a broad variety of fields from Audit and tax to IT and forensics... if you do forensics or IT work, it can be rather exciting, IMO. </p>
<p>According to AICPA:</p>
<p>"A CPA, or Certified Public Accountant, is a trusted financial advisor who helps individuals, businesses, and other organizations plan and reach their financial goals. Whatever those goals-saving for a new home, opening a new office, or planning a multi-billion dollar merger-CPAs can help.</p>
<p>Getting your CPA certification opens the kinds of doors that can fast-track you into influential jobs in every industry. Whom do you think the FBI recruits to investigate criminal fraud? What profession is often a stepping-stone to holding positions like Chief Financial Officer (CFO) and Chief Executive Officer (CEO)? Who helps rock stars manage their money, and avoid going broke?"</p>
<p>What's the difference between CPA and CFA?</p>
<p>"...I'm now having doubts because some ppl say it's boring, the test is hard to pass, very low salary and not enough personal/vacation time but instead long work hours and no benefits. is any of this true? can anyone who followed this path or know someone who has give feedback on this matter? if you are a cpa, how did your first years go and now too? satisfied?"</p>
<p>The CPA exam is rather difficult--before computerization, the first-shot pass rate was between 10 and 20% (80% eventually pass after multiple attempts). I will have taken two or three parts by the end of the month and can say that it requires a hefty amount of preparation and does test on a large amount of information, ranging from financial accounting to information systems to finance to law.</p>
<p>As for compensation, I don't know who told you that it was low. All of my offers from mid-size and Big 4 firms included full benefits (health, dental and whatnot), 3-4 weeks vacation and salaries above $45k. My firm is paying for my CPA review course, the exam fees and will give you $5k a year to spend on education (in addition to the education they provide). Sure, you could do better, but that's certainly not too bad.</p>
<p>As for the hours--yes, you work long hours, especially at the Big 4. That's the nature of the beast. In turn, however, you get to put down that you have Big 4 experience on your resume, which is very desirable and a prerequisite to some jobs.</p>
<p>"What's the difference between CPA and CFA?"</p>
<p>Two different job paths and purposes. A CPA designation is for those working in public accounting and is designed to ensure that those in public practice have the meed the minimum education and experience requirements to serve the public's interests. The CFA designation is for those working with investments and is used to disignate those who meet the standards for investment advisors and managers.</p>
<p>I'm a CPA--and have been for 10 years--and trust me, the salaries can go considerably above $45,000 or even $60,000. Just go into a large corporation or move up to Manager or Senior Manager, or even Partner at one of the Big 4. I think the average partner's pay is around $300,000 per year--although those positions are rare, of course. Out here in the SF Bay area I'd say anyone with 5 years of experience or more as a CPA is making at least $90,000 to $100,000. The jobs do top out around $125,000 to $150,000 or so for most people, though.</p>
<p>Speaking of people just out of school, I know someone who just graduated this year in accounting and since he worked as an intern through last summer for Price Watershouse Coopers--he has permanent corporate offers already in the $65,000 to $75,000 range for when he finishes this summer's part-time position with them. Not bad for a recent grad--although I'd admit his experience is a bit atypical.</p>
<p>now when you say long hours what do you mean? a good job would be 8-6 mon-fri and vacation from time to time. is that how it is? for new grads too?</p>
<p>Long hours means a minimum of 50 hours a week (this is a mandatory minimum for most large firms) year round. During your busy periods, you can work 80 hour weeks. You'll have to work a lot of Saturdays and will probably have a 24 hour day or two every year depending on the clients you work on. If you want to do auditing at a large firm, you need to be able to travel and work whatever time is needed to get the job done in time. Smaller firms will have smaller clients that will allow you to work a set schedule.</p>
<p>It varies from firm to firm, but I can tell you that all of the Big 4 start you off with 3-4 weeks of vacation a year.</p>
<p>Wow, that's really not that bad. What are some of the more "exciting" things you can do with accounting (career-wise)?</p>
<p>how can one like a job like this that takes away weekends and offers no time for family?</p>
<p>Some people value money and prestige over family and weekends. Just ask the guys that went to ibanking (yeah i'm sorry i brought it up).</p>
<p>Many accountants work regular 40-45 hour weeks with weekends off. Many accountants at the big 4 are there for 2-5 years, then take advantage of the opportunities it provides for other positions that pay well, and allow more time off. For instance, a CPA at my company worked for PriceWaterHouseCoopers for 10 years, resigned there and now he's working 25-30 hours a week and making ~$55K as a management accountant. If you ask me, that's not a bad trade off... he's only like 38 years old.</p>
<p>so can someone tell me what is the typical day schedule for say a new grad working at the big 4? (including from what time to what time and days per week)..average pay? benefits? vacation time? and during the busy period?</p>
<p>later, after 2-5 years what would the pay and typical day schedule (start time-end time included)? average pay? benefits? vacation time? at a small to medium sized firm? at a firm I were to open for myself?</p>
<p>Generally, the schedule is something like 8:30 AM to 7:30 PM 5 to 6 days per week--and it can be even more during tax season--though that is rare. Average pay to begin is $45-53K in the Silicon Valley (don't know across the country). You get your standard two weeks off to begin, plus 5 days off to take continuing professional education classes (which they pay for--the time off and the classes). You will get a couple of personal days, and they sometimes (usually) give you some time off to study for the CPA exam. </p>
<p>You'll get a great medical/dental plan, life insurance, short-term/long-term disability plan, and a sometimes a 401(k) plan whereby the company matches a portion of your contributions. </p>
<p>I can't speak to small companies--haven't worked there. If you start your own company (as I did for a few years) you can bill at higher rates, and you are allowed to write off most expenses, plus you can donate up to the greater of $40K or 25% of your income to a Keogh plan for savings/retirement purposes. Also, if you have kids or a wife, you can have them work for you up to around $7,000 to $10,000 a year without paying social security taxes and at reduced income tax rates (if you become an accountant, you should learn most of these rules as you go along--though probably not in school).</p>
<p>Speaking of the CPA Exam fellas, for those of you who've studied for the CPA exam, what do you think is the most effective way to study for it, self study review or live classroom review courses?? </p>
<p>I know they're all very similar. However, there probably is a distinction between the reviews taught in classroom format vs. reviews of the self-study variety. The classroom reviews seem to be more costly. Are the classroom format reviews really that much better than self-study reviews to justify the cost difference? I'm willing to pay the premium as long as the classroom reviews are more effective learning tools. </p>
<p>Some of these live courses cost a lot, esp. Becker Review, so I want to make sure I inquire about this subject beforehand. Thanks a lot in advance.</p>
<p>Damn...I just lost everything I just typed...I'll try again:</p>
<p>It really depends on you and how you prefer to study. I'm using the Becker online course and the Wiley books and that seems to be more than enough. I prefer to learn on my own, so I stick to the textbooks and homework questions, but you may prefer the lectures. Just choose the method you feel most comfortable with.</p>
<p>One question: why the concern over cost? Most firms should cover the cost of the review course.</p>
<p>Thanks. I want to flip the bill for now because I really want to pass the exam (or at least parts of it) before I start working 60-70 hrs. a week at a firm. I'm still a senior at college. </p>
<p>I know people who were too sapped to pass it while working. They had to wait later on in their careers to try to pass. One CPA at a firm I know took 17 YEARS to pass it..true story...I also know a tax specialist who's worked for PWC for 5 years who still hasn't passed it. It's only going to get harder now that she's starting a family. Boy is it is one tough exam...</p>
<p>I definitely do recommend passing before you start working, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you have to pay for it. Policies vary from firm to firm, but if you work for Big 4 or a large mid-tier firm (I believe Grant Thornton has this policy), they will pay for the course before you start working as long as you've accepted an offer.</p>
<p>Generally, you will interview for full-time jobs in October of your senior year and accept one by Thanksgiving. I signed up for the Becker course in March or April of this year and had it direct billed to my firm. I graduated in May and won't start work until the end of August, so I've had all summer to prepare (I'm currently waiting for my Notice to Schedule).</p>
<p>Good advice. I "probably" graduate this Nov. so I'll plan accordingly.</p>
<p>ryanbis, just out of curiousity... did you have more than one job offer to choose from come thanksgiving? What type of attributes do you think landed you a position?</p>
<p>311Griff: I had three offers: two from Big 4 firms and one a large mid-tier firm. These also happened to be the three firms from which I wanted offers, so I was happy.</p>
<p>As for what helped me land these offers, it's hard to say exactly, as there are lots of people who have a say in the process (partners, HR and even the associates you speak to in the hallway while waiting to be interviewed will voice their opinions on who should be hired) and there's a lot of different stages you go through. </p>
<hr>
<h2>The short answer: I did a LOT of preparation and made sure I was aware of the areas I was weak in. I'm pretty well-rounded (strong in both numbers and writing, have a degree in business and a degree in a social science). Most importantly, I'm pretty good at communicating my strengths and the things I've gained from my experiences.</h2>
<p>The long answer: I'll try to give you an idea of some of the specific things I did for those interested. Pardon the length.</p>
<p>When applying intially:
Apply as early as possible and be prepared. I applied for all of these jobs via my school's online recruiting website. I met with the career center over the summer (I was on-campus taking some extra classes) and worked on my resume and a sample cover letter. I went through a ton of revisions and did A LOT of research on each of the companies to which I wanted to apply. I wrote a separate cover letter for each of the firms and made sure that I had them ready for when each firm posted its job ad online. I then read the job ad and made adjustments to the cover letter, tailoring it to what the job ad was looking for (if it said they wanted someone who could work under pressure, I gave an example of how I work well under pressure). I submitted it within a day of the posting, so that my name was the first name they saw when they went and reviewed applicants.</p>
<p>In terms of resumes, make sure that you work it over carefully. I designed mine so that it made me look well-rounded (which was a big plus for some interviewers). My resume essentially consisted of an academics section, an academic team projects section, two jobs and a skills/interests section. Each demonstrated a different important point: academics showed academic strength, team projects demonstrated team skills, my job at a small CPA firm showed initiative in the workplace, my job as a nightclub DJ showed sales and management skills and my interests section demonstrated writing and communication skills. Make sure that the bullets under each job heading doesn't contain job description (that's usually implied by the job title)--they should talk about a problem you solved and be measurable if possible. If you worked in a pharmacy, "Enacted new system for organizing prescription files, saving store, decreasing audit fines by $100,000 from previous year," is much more compelling than, "Assisted pharmacist in filling prescriptions," even though it's not what you did day-to-day.</p>
<p>In terms of cover letters, make sure that they are tailored to the job description and don't repeat anything already said on your resume. Be very concise.</p>
<p>At this stage, I had a high enough GPA (above a 3.5) and had a solid resume/cover letter, so I believe that was why I got interviews.</p>
<p>While waiting to hear back:
Try to get some face time with the firms. Go to Meet the Firms Night, go on informational interviews and go to career fairs. Introduce yourself. Definitely do not miss pre-interview dinners if you can (one firm brought all of its interviewees to Bertucci's the night before). Ask all of your introductory questions so that you'll have some more substantive questions to ask during interviews. I had met someone (in one case, the person who ended up being my interviewer) at each of the firms I received an offer from.</p>
<p>Interviews:</p>
<h2>Be extremely prepared. Be ready for behavioral questions. Have lots of situations ready to draw upon and have a ton of questions. When answering behavioral questions, don't get caught up in trying to think of the perfect situation to demonstate what they are looking for--a lot of people worry that they don't have the perfect story and end up sitting there for too long umming and ahhhing. If you're eloquent and friendly and can tell a story, the interview won't be that bad. What really helped me during the interviews was finding something in common with the interviewers. I was in a dual-degree program and so was one of the partners I interviewed with. He REALLY liked that. I also think it helped that I had well thought out descriptions of my academic and work experience. Another partner I interviewed with wasn't familiar with the undergrad program at BU, but seemed somewhat impressed with it by the end of the interview (he went to Harvard undergrad). It also helped that I was familiar with current events in the industry. That sounds kinda obvious, but not everyone seems to do their homework (you should understand, for instance, that one of the major implications of SOX is that accounting is no longer self-regulated by the industry).</h2>
<p>That's about all I can think of at the moment...let me know if there's anything else you'd like to know.</p>