lol, I meant the parent. Treating the subject as taboo seems strange to me. Oh well.
Who are you talking about Brown? Me? I can tell you the next step. She’s going to a private for profit art college to earn an associates degree that’s worth nothing at any other public or state college for the tidy sum of $60000.
@BrownParent I don’t think there can be a meaningful convo at this point. The student is about to embark at an overpriced for-profit school. She may or may not have any real talent. If after this year, the DD has developed any real talents, there may be something to talk about.
That said, who knows if there will even be a second year. The DD may find that she doesn’t like the program, or the stepdad may be expecting the dad to cosign the loans for Year Two.
It may prove to be a scary time when it comes time for DD to pay back all those loans.
The conversation ended in May when both the mom and my daughter told me they didn’t want to talk about it anymore. Why? Because they didn’t like what I had to say and they didn’t like the fact that I wasn’t willing to cosign that amount of money for what she’s getting. Really, what associates degree IN ANYTHING is worth $60k??? It’s out of my hands. I can’t tell my now adult daughter what to do and I can’t tell my ex wife or anybody else what to do with their money.
All I can do is pray that it somehow works out and she’s happy and is able to afford the debt she is taken on. And if it doesn’t, I may not be on the hook financially, but I’m still going to pay the price with the fact my daughter is in the terrible situation she got herself in. And no amount of saying I told them so is going to make me feel better. There’s no greater thing in my life at this point that I want to be proven wrong about.
I do agree with @mom2collegekids that the daughter is probably far less concerned about who co-signed the loans than she was about going there in the first place, and she’s probably very unwilling to open up a can of worms by discussing financial details that have been taken care of (for good or for ill) and that were clearly contributing to all the acrimony a few months ago.
OP is now free to learn about his daughter’s interest in graphic design unencumbered by significant financial burdens - which is a wonderful spot to be in! OP, don’t hesitate to offer her all the emotional support she needs - love her art work, ask her to send the digital images and display them proudly in your home or office. Try to visit a couple of times this next year. Sure, it might all go south - or it might not. Either way, if she thinks you care about HER - and not just which school she chose or who co-signed the loan - she’ll hopefully come 'round and begin to trust you for advice and guidance (and not just moola).
@brownparent I read it as OP giving his daughter some space now that the decision has been made.
I completely agree @mamelot. I hope the OP goes to her art shows, is positive and emotionally supportive in any way that he can be. And if for some reason it ends up not working out, I really hope he can resist the urge to say “I told you so.” That is usually the last thing a child needs to hear, IMO.
OP, if everything goes south in one to two years, please please please REFRAIN from saying “I told you so”. They will be wallowing in their consequences and will be well aware of the mess - no need to point it out any further. And in this sad scenario do NOT respond to any pleas from the Ex for more money. But DO offer to assist your daughter with some prudent decision-making from that point forward. If you keep the offer limited to advice and guidance and emotional support, keep positive and focus on problem-solving, you will likely make some real progress with her. Much better than using the “because . . . I Told You So!” rationale, which is sure to drive a further wedge into the relationship.
60k for an associates degree. Why do some people on here insist on talking about feelings when reality and debt is a cold hard bitch?
Listen to me, my daughter is about to attend IMO(and a lot of folks on here’s opinion) a crappy, overpriced art college and get a crappy associates degree and be on the hook for 60k. And I’m supposed to be positive. Attend art shows? I’m halfway across the country. I have a full time job. I’m not going to rub it anybody’s face if it doesn’t turn out. But yes, I do have the satisfaction in knowing that I was right all along. I’m at peace internally with myself by doing what I thought was right. But as I said before, that will bring me NO joy. I just don’t understand where some of you all are coming from. I think some of you all try to apply your own experiences to everybody else. There’s obviously a disconnect here between some of us.
And she wont be a child. She will be an ADULT. On the hook for 60k plus interest. No amount of positive feelings are going to pay for those loans if it doesn’t work out. Good lord…
I’m out of the picture. I’m a dad halfway across the country who loves and supports his daughter very much but never got to see or interact in person with his daughter very much. I did a lot in her adolescent and preteen years compared to when she became older. I have always supported her financially and emotionally as much as I could. I dont think she or my ex or anybody else would dispute that.
But I’m just out of the picture now. Thats just how its been for the last 4 or 5 years. I’m just dad who lives over here in South Dakota who still sends her money and talks to and sees her every once in a while. I still love her to death. I want the best for her. I want to try to guide her with what I think is best. But I have no control any more. This whole situation makes me sad. I just think its terrible. I WANT to be wrong. I WANT to be proven wrong. She’s going to this college. I’m not going to stop talking to her. I’m not going to be all negative. I’m pretty sure she knows how I feel about the situation. I will support her and wish her the best and continue to send her the support I said I would. But when she graduates, with that load…I dont know. I just dont know if its going to work.
We all hold our breaths when it comes to these years. We all lose some control over different things. Right now, your role has changed, sure. It’s not the end of the world for any parent to tell another to support in the positive ways we can, to focus on the long term relationship. Anger stings. I don’t need a rebuttal, we all know this is hard to watch.
How can she possibly be on the hook for that much $ since a student cannot take out that big of a loan?
This is $30,000 a year, right? That is not a huge amount per year. Many colleges, instate public universities, for example, in some states cost that much.
@jym626 it sounds like the mom took out loans.
@maintainin, what @lookingforward said.
Yes, the mom (and maybe stepdad) cosigned the loans. The mom and SF wanted the OP to cosign for Year One, but some of us agreed with the OP that he should not do that because not only was it too much money, but it seemed to be the mom and stepdad’s ploy to only have him “on the hook” in case the child left the program after the first year.
So if the DD ends up not being able to pay back those loans, and that’s a very likely possibility, really it’s only the stubborn mom and her husband who will be on the hook…
No need to say, “I told you so,” if the likely outcome happens, but be prepared for some odd twisting of stories when the mom and step become angry that they’re stuck with the burden of loan payments.
The dad doesn’t need to attend “art shows” to show emotional support. Not even sure if her chosen concentration would have any. The DD can send him digital pics. If I remember correctly, this DD had not shown much art talent before (but maybe I’m not remembering right). She simply attended a very convincing school tour and was hooked.
These degrees are pathetic. My niece has one (thankfully w/o loans), but 5 years later, she’s still working at Macy’s as a nearly minimum wage salesperson. 
Her mom also fell for the “let her choose whatever school she wants” craziness, and now her credits aren’t recognized by any regular college.
I think the art shows were just an idea of how he can show support. Many parents never go to exhibits or college functions of other types, but some do. I think we try to listen to our kids to see what’s important to them.
I do know folks who went to a for-profit and did come out the better for it. Of course, we know the many tales of the opposite. But at this point, with Dad not co-signing, what matters- and the only thing he can control- is his attempt to build a good relationship, going forward. I personally don’t see a need to draw a line in the sand and state that visits won’t happen.
I don’t think the dad is “drawing a line in the sand” as in some sort of stand-off. I don’t think he’d be doing any school visits even if she had gone to her regular instate public. He lives far away and is working. That doesn’t mean that he wouldn’t attend a graduation or something. I believe he traveled for her recent high school graduation. It’s probably pretty typical for many NCPs to only come to a child’s college for graduation.
Maybe the OP’s DD will realize during the first semester or after the first year what a mistake it is going to this expensive school (for the cost/benefit and for the family finances).
Keep options open on more affordable four year degree plan schools where even if you are in creative arts you also can get educated in business, etc - gain internship opportunities to get towards a decent paying job after graduation.
Keep communication going. DD has to grow up now or grow up later with the finances and her career path. She may have to move in with family just to keep her personal expenses down to pay back student loans.
“Listen to me, my daughter is about to attend IMO(and a lot of folks on here’s opinion) a crappy, overpriced art college and get a crappy associates degree and be on the hook for 60k. And I’m supposed to be positive. Attend art shows? I’m halfway across the country. I have a full time job. I’m not going to rub it anybody’s face if it doesn’t turn out. But yes, I do have the satisfaction in knowing that I was right all along.”
As a parent who doesn’t always agree with his daughter (who does?), I’m nevertheless a little surprised by the tone in post #347. Once a decision has been made to go to school, as it has here, I would hope any parent would want to support their child in doing well. OP is off the hook for providing $$, but no one should be off the hook for being a supportive dad. And, yeah, even though it is inconvenient, I think OP should make a trip to the college at some point to see what his daughter is doing, and to give her some positive feedback.
“I just don’t understand where some of you all are coming from. I think some of you all try to apply your own experiences to everybody else. There’s obviously a disconnect here between some of us.”
Well, that is what CC is–it is a place for students and parents to share experiences. Sometimes this involves disagreeing with original posters, no matter how right they believe they are.
In this particular situation, I think it would be tragic if the daughter goes through the program, and does really well having applied herself, and her father never showed up for any event on campus.
While the OP does not support the daughter’s academic choice, it would be nice to consider contributing a bit to it. At present it sounds like he’s unwilling to pay a dime towards her education because he doesn’t agree with the plan. IMO the potential ramifications of his relationship with his daughter is of more concern than perhaps having been willing to pay a few thousand towards his daughter’s education and potential future. And I agree, $25-30K a year isnt off the rails expensive, especially if that includes the art supplies, etc. I forget, has the OP researched this Dayton program at all to see what it offers?
I think OP is going to continue sending his DD the money he was paying while she was in high school. I wouldn’t contribute to a for profit school whose credits won’t transfer elsewhere either. I’d save what money I could so DD could get an actual associate’s degree later in case the $60k for profit program doesn’t pan out.