dejected son

Lehigh weighs demonstrated interest and they are known for waitlisting VERY high stats kids that they are suspcious are using them as a backup option. I don’t know the timing for decisions there, but if it is possible to show a little love for Lehigh, it may be worth it. Maybe your son can email his individual admissions counselor with a specific question, or shoot an email off to a CS professor to ask a question about the major and how his interests would fit at Lehigh. Even visit campus if it is close by. It really is a nice campus!

The other perfectly awful reality is that because schools seem to worry so much about yield, they don’t always take as many high stats as would make sense (at least, make sense to me!). It does not help to tell a high school student this, at least not in the moment of the disappointments, but it really is not so much about them as individuals. This college application process is a rough ride. My daughter got SO lucky to get into her ED school and ever since, whenever something goes wrong or is super difficult, she will say…hey I’m SO lucky that I’m set for college. The spring is tough for those on the later timetable.

@2sunny He ended up in a small LAC that doesn’t even have a large CS department. We were a little worried about that, but he graduated with a dual degree in CS and Psych and is now working in a research laboratory at a top university so it all worked out in the end! :slight_smile:

Sorry to hear about your S. Others have hit the nail on the head, schools like CMU, Georgia Tech and the like are hard admits for computer science, they admit relatively few kids who apply there and a lot of kids apply, because they have the name. In the music world, it is like Juilliard and Curtis, which have this reputation among many people that if you don’t get in there, you shouldn’t bother, and it is hogwash. Juilliard and Curtis get a ton of people applying because of that name, overseas those are magic destinations that kids all will want to apply to, and as a result Juilliard admits like 6% of the kids admitted, and many, many really talented kids won’t get in (one year on flute they were admitting 1 kid, and that was either UG or grad…!)…and there are a lot of great music programs out there.

Speaking as someone who is a hiring manager in the computer field, tell him that where you go to school with cs isn’t a go here or die situation. Getting into a program like MIT, CMU and Stanford, that are some of the top CS research programs in the country, can get you certain things, you can likely get interesting internships and the like, but it really depends on what he is gunning for. If your son is looking to become a software developer in the mainstream, going to a place like that is going to be less important then if for example he wants to work at a place like Google doing cutting edge research (more on that in a bit). Obviously those programs names can help get him in the door someplace,and access to internships at that level can be effective, but in the end once he starts working it won’t matter as much, especially if he is looking to get into regular software application development.

Even if his heart is set on working for a Google kind of thing, he likely would need a grad degree to do that anyway, so he could always go to a program, do well, then apply to one of the ‘big schools’ to do a masters, if his heart is set on big data or AI or machine learning and other esoteric research oriented areas.

Those programs can and do make it easier to get that first job, in other words, but for most programming work going elsewhere and doing well will likely in the not so long run end up with him doing just as well, the CMU/MIT/Stanford name on the degree will matter less and less as time goes on, what will matter is what he does in the work world.

I don’t know how much this will help him to feel better (might be more for the OP), in part what you are seeing is him judging his worth by what school he got into, it is about “gee, I am not good enough”, he doesn’t see that even kids with stellar stats get rejected from those programs. My S is going through grad school auditions in music, and he has done the same thing, he got rejected from even auditioning at a program and was all upset, assuming he wasn’t ‘good enough’ even to audition (turned out it was an administrative issue, his teacher, not surprisingly, hadn’t sent in his recommendation form and an administrator rejected him for that, it was reversed). he just had an audition he felt he screwed part of it up, and was upset, this despite the fact that he has gotten encouragement after auditioning at other programs that are equal or even better than the one he just did (and I suspect he will get in)…so it never ends:). We all look for confirmation of worth from outside, and this kind of thing hurts.

@Bnovel I hope things have softened for your son. You mentioned that his brother is a sophomore at Princeton. Our oldest is P’13 and we’re going through some disappointing rejections and deferrals with our current high school senior. It’s hard to watch and I’m trusting that our younger guys will get to where they’re supposed to be. (((hugs)))

Gap year is a good idea, if he is not happy with his choices. Use the year to do something interesting. Get a consultant to help with apps. You/he may need help from someone who has gone to the rodeo multiple times before. Also, I hope he and you are working closely with his college or guidance counselor who should be sharing the pain and helping him get to a better place.

Oh, I am so sorry, I hope he is doing a bit better now. My heart really goes out to him, and to you. My D was obsessed with getting into William & Mary, spent 6 mos visiting, going to programs, even lived in the dorms taking courses for 3 wks last summer. Applied ED, got the bad news 12/2, she wailed, cried for hours, hysterical. Depressed for weeks, just heartbreaking & gut wrenching. Give him time, space but let him know you care & sympathize. Research other schools if there is time. We discovered Univ of Richmond & she applied ED2. We were surprised, actually, that she got in as standards are similar but each school looks for different things. You have that 1 school still out there, it only takes one! In the mean time there are schools still taking apps, life has a way of working out as it should! Hugs to you both & let us know how he is & what happens! Good luck!

I hope that he gets into one of the schools where he applied but it really would be a good idea to find a list of schools with rolling admissions to find a true safety and/or consider a gap year. CS is typically one of the hardest majors and I think he will be facing real competition in terms of GPA at all of these extremely competitive schools.

I feel for you. My son got a “no” from Purdue—fave school. His major is Mechanical Engineering. He got a “yes” from his safety school (Iowa State), then a deferred from Univ of IL, Deferred at Univ of Wis, wait-listed at MInn, no answer form Michigan State—found out they lost his transcripts. Settled that and he got in but no merit aid–so at $51,000 OOS I think that school is off the table. My son has also felt dejected–like he wasn’t good enough and no one wanted him. He did get into Univ of IL but for Industrial Engineering–not his first pick. It’s very hard to see them sad when their friends all know what schools they are going to, or got their first choices. We sit here and wait…

^^^^I loved Iowa State. If my kid will agree, it will be the top choice. And can pick any major without re-competing. If that is what shakes out as the only option, I think it is a good one. Still trying to decide whether my kids should go after top schools and how the rejection would feel before I encourage reaching.

Hoping @Bnovel reports back at some point.

I echo @musicprnt regarding the experience as a hiring manager in IT. I work in federal IT contracting. Many movers and shakers in this community went to no-name schools; did not study past their Bachelors; some of them did not even study CS, and now they shape a billion-dollar industry.
Besides, you don’t need to be incubated at Stanford to make it big in CS. Every major city has VC looking for hot new startups and they watch local CS departments very closely. The talent will out!

This is the biggest misunderstanding about CS. IT is not the same thing as CS. It’s only one part. My son has a CS degree, but he knows nothing about IT. Everyone at work asks him for help with their IT problems just because he’s knowledgeable about CS, and all he does is google the information. So I guess that proves the point that you wouldn’t necessarily need a CS degree for IT.

I would like Megan’s post three times if I could.

We often have posters here who claim that they’ve got a brother in law who made it big in CS who isn’t good at math, why do folks on CC claim that math is so important for CS, you don’t need a lot of abstract thinking, etc.

Of course, the brother- in- law works in an MIS role or IT at a big company making sure that the payroll system gets patched in to the new hire onboarding system so that new employees get their first paycheck on time. i.e. NOT CS. But whatever.

Thank you for a reality check Megan.

^^ Very true. I work for a software company and with every new release the developers tout some new algorithm they’ve incorporated based on somebody’s cutting-edge PhD thesis or some such thing. Just last week I was listening to an internal technical introduction to a new release and even the propeller-head devs were all in awe over another apparently uber-propeller-head developer who found some obscure new mathematical formula which made some aspect of the product run 10x faster.

Meanwhile the people in IT that we sell to have absolutely no need to know about the uber new algorithm, they just need to know what switch in the config file to set to use it (not to downplay the value of IT, skilled IT guys are extremely valuable). IT and CS are definitely two different worlds.

My D, a CS PhD student at one of the top 5 univ., recently told me this story:

One day, the (of course now retired) advisor of her advisor (approaching retirement) dropped by her advisor’s office for a visit. This old professor and her advisor are world-famous in high performance computing (data science, parallel computing). My D had a long chat with the old professor. During the chat, he pulled out his iPad and asked my D an IT question: “Can you please show me how to clear the cookies on this thing?”

hope you all get good news soon!

@blossom You’re welcome for that reality check! :wink:

It’s so frustrating when people don’t understand this distinction. My son, who’s working as a software engineer in a research lab, is constantly being asked to help with the IT in the lab because the actual IT department is useless. I told him I was going to buy him a t-shirt that said “I’m NOT the IT guy!” LOL! Even the secretary thinks he has an IT degree. Apparently, she has no clue what he’s actually there for, which is programming and data analysis.

Finally good news! Accepted to Northeastern yesterday! He’s so relieved and just in time for his birthday Saturday

Hooray! Great school. Congratulations to him!

I can’t thank you all enough for your kind and extremely helpful messages, you’ve made a painful process much better through your wonderful support!